The EU: In, out, shake it all about....

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%
  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed .

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
2,909
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So how come there’s trouble in Northern Ireland? Boris told them that their shepherds pie is the best ever yet they’re up in arms. It’s almost as if your analogy doesn’t work when it comes to politics.
The point your missing is that Boris DID tell them a lie, no one is denying it.
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
2,909
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Yes, because leadership isn’t the weak ass, slopey shouldered crap Johnson does. He’s a pussy who just wants to be liked so he told everyone they’d get what they wanted then hid when it was time to pay the piper.

Look at how NZ handled lockdown for instance “it’s shit but we’re all in it together and we’ll get out” instead of “lol sure it’ll just be a few weeks” like we got. Political leadership does exist.

Labour’s Brexit solution was a customs Union brexit which would’ve solved this entire problem. The issue wasn’t Brexit it was the weird extreme Brexit the ERG insisted on and Johnson was too weak to refuse.
Brexit and the pandemic are hardly comparable.

But I guess from BJ's point of view, the problems in NI are worth it if it meant Brexit got done. But that was never going to be the pc thing to say.

Very few people would trust the labour party to even find NI with a map, a compas gps and a leprechaun to lead the way.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2011
31,486
22,967
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Coventry, United Kingdom, United Kingdom
Brexit and the pandemic are hardly comparable.

But I guess from BJ's point of view, the problems in NI are worth it if it meant Brexit got done. But that was never going to be the pc thing to say.

Very few people would trust the labour party to even find NI with a map, a compas gps and a leprechaun to lead the way.
Feel like I’m talking to a brick wall here.

Brexit wasn’t the issue with NI, a very specific particular form of Brexit was. Brexit would’ve been done either way.

What that simple fact has to do with Labour I’ve no idea. Yet again it’s “well Labour aren’t perfect so I had no choice to but choose to shoot myself in the face”, which is certainly one take to have.

And I wasn’t likening Brexit to the pandemic I was giving a decent example of political leadership that “Boris” severely lacks because you claimed Johnson was the best you could hope for.
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
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Feel like I’m talking to a brick wall here.

Brexit wasn’t the issue with NI, a very specific particular form of Brexit was. Brexit would’ve been done either way.

What that simple fact has to do with Labour I’ve no idea. Yet again it’s “well Labour aren’t perfect so I had no choice to but choose to shoot myself in the face”, which is certainly one take to have.

And I wasn’t likening Brexit to the pandemic I was giving a decent example of political leadership that “Boris” severely lacks because you claimed Johnson was the best you could hope for.
Do you honestly want to discuss BJ's leadership compared to Corbyn's?
Please tell us what Corbyn's stance on Brexit was, or is today!
I can assure you it's not me that's the brick wall, anyone with any common sence can take a look at the 80 seat majority that BJ has and ask themself who is out of step!
When northern pit villages vote Tory for the first time since Thatcher, you have to stop and ask why.
Even the labour head office had the sence to get rid of the socialist leader, and appoint "man of the people" Sir Keir Starmer QC (you couldnt make that up)
I can accept criticism of BJ's leadership from anyone, but not from someone who backed Corbyn!
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
2,909
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Spoken like a true Republican.
Is my quote wrong? Is that not indeed the case today? It might not be palatable, but its factual.
Do you think if the referendum was ran today the outcome would be any different?
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
17,707
9,110
313
Verona, Italy
Is my quote wrong? Is that not indeed the case today? It might not be palatable, but its factual.
Do you think if the referendum was ran today the outcome would be any different?
The problems in the north are very much a British problem, especially as it is a province in the UK.
For what it's worth though, the average vote in England couldn't care less about the north and would quite happily see Irish reunification happen. The Unionist love for GB is definitely not requited.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2013
27,300
11,702
313
The point your missing is that Boris DID tell them a lie, no one is denying it.
But he told them what they wanted to hear. He specifically told the loyalists community what they wanted to hear. How come specifically the loyalist community aren’t satisfied with the lie like your other half is? If you wanted to use analogy that works it would have been as followed.

Ahem. I told my wife that her shepherds pie was the best ever even though it wasn’t, turns out she didn’t believe the lie and I woke up screaming in the night as she was cutting my balls of with a blunt knife for telling said lie.
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
2,909
213
But he told them what they wanted to hear. He specifically told the loyalists community what they wanted to hear. How come specifically the loyalist community aren’t satisfied with the lie like your other half is? If you wanted to use analogy that works it would have been as followed.

Ahem. I told my wife that her shepherds pie was the best ever even though it wasn’t, turns out she didn’t believe the lie and I woke up screaming in the night as she was cutting my balls of with a blunt knife for telling said lie.
But the lie BJ told did work. He got the result he wanted, now if he can get away without having his balls cut off with a blunt knife, he will go down in history as pulling off the biggest success in recent political history.

But let's not forget that project fear had its share of BS as well, it's amazing how that all gets forgotten, it appears that only the victor gets called to account.
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
2,909
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That has nothing to do with your point or statement whatsoever.
My point is that the labour government of TB has no comparison with the labour opposition of JC.
I'm sure TB would of done a far better job of opposing brexit and dealing with the aspects affecting NI than JC.
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
2,909
213
The problems in the north are very much a British problem, especially as it is a province in the UK.
For what it's worth though, the average vote in England couldn't care less about the north and would quite happily see Irish reunification happen. The Unionist love for GB is definitely not requited.
I agree with you here, it's not ideal, but it's the situation we find ourselves in.
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
17,707
9,110
313
Verona, Italy
My point is that the labour government of TB has no comparison with the labour opposition of JC.
I'm sure TB would of done a far better job of opposing brexit and dealing with the aspects affecting NI than JC.
Yeah I agree with you 100%.
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
17,707
9,110
313
Verona, Italy
It's nuts how Tory voters think the likes of Johnson, Rees-Mogg, Gove etc have their interests at heart yet dismiss Starmer as elite despite being born into a working class family.
I think you mean ex-Labour voters over the last 5 years.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2013
27,300
11,702
313
But the lie BJ told did work. He got the result he wanted, now if he can get away without having his balls cut off with a blunt knife, he will go down in history as pulling off the biggest success in recent political history.

But let's not forget that project fear had its share of BS as well, it's amazing how that all gets forgotten, it appears that only the victor gets called to account.
The lie BJ told is coming back to bite him. Same as your wife cutting of your balls when the deck of lies came crashing down. The other obvious issue being Northern Ireland didn’t buy his lies, they voted remain, the DUP is loosing votes at an alarming rate for being complicit in those lies. It also sounds like you’re saying that a return to the troubles is what Boris wanted because that will be the nett result of Boris lying to get what he wanted. “Project fear “ said that it would break up the Union, that’s also looking to be a likely nett result of Boris lying to get what he wanted. Are you suggesting that he actively lied to achieve the break up of the Union?

No one’s got what they wanted and no one will. Not without moving the goalposts anyway.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2011
31,486
22,967
313
Coventry, United Kingdom, United Kingdom
Do you honestly want to discuss BJ's leadership compared to Corbyn's?
Please tell us what Corbyn's stance on Brexit was, or is today!
I can assure you it's not me that's the brick wall, anyone with any common sence can take a look at the 80 seat majority that BJ has and ask themself who is out of step!
When northern pit villages vote Tory for the first time since Thatcher, you have to stop and ask why.
Even the labour head office had the sence to get rid of the socialist leader, and appoint "man of the people" Sir Keir Starmer QC (you couldnt make that up)
I can accept criticism of BJ's leadership from anyone, but not from someone who backed Corbyn!
What are you even on about? What has Corbyn got to do with anything?

It was a choice to leave the CU. Nothing to do with Brexit or Corbyn or single mums or whatever else. A choice that was made and now a choice the people who made it need to sack up and own.

And as an aside “LOL Keir Starmer worked his way up to QC and that sounds posh so I’m going to vote for the landed gentry headed by an old Etonian” is perhaps the dumbest take in politics.

I didn’t have you down as someone obsessed with identity politics and virtue signalling, but if you want working class men of the people you couldn’t get much worse than Farage and Johnson FFS.
 

Skybluefaz

Well-Known Member
Aug 1, 2011
6,515
5,551
413
Coventry
It's nuts how Tory voters think the likes of Johnson, Rees-Mogg, Gove etc have their interests at heart yet dismiss Starmer as elite despite being born into a working class family.
Was only the other day that aspiration was a vote winner. Now Sir Keir Starmer QC coming from a mother who was a nurse and dad a toolmaker is an elite who they don't want to know about.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2011
31,486
22,967
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Coventry, United Kingdom, United Kingdom
Was only the other day that aspiration was a vote winner. Now Sir Keir Starmer QC coming from a mother who was a nurse and dad a toolmaker is an elite who they don't want to know about.
Uppity man should know his place. Leadership not for the likes of us that didn’t go to Eton. That’s the view of the people. Salt of the earth. Pit villages (lol!). Etc.
 
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Skybluefaz

Well-Known Member
Aug 1, 2011
6,515
5,551
413
Coventry
Uppity man should know his place. Leadership not for the likes of us that didn’t go to Eton. That’s the view of the people. Salt of the earth. Pit villages (lol!). Etc.
Baffling. Why do we have such a low opinion of ourselves nowadays?
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
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What are you even on about? What has Corbyn got to do with anything?

It was a choice to leave the CU. Nothing to do with Brexit or Corbyn or single mums or whatever else. A choice that was made and now a choice the people who made it need to sack up and own.

And as an aside “LOL Keir Starmer worked his way up to QC and that sounds posh so I’m going to vote for the landed gentry headed by an old Etonian” is perhaps the dumbest take in politics.

I didn’t have you down as someone obsessed with identity politics and virtue signalling, but if you want working class men of the people you couldn’t get much worse than Farage and Johnson FFS.
You cant muddy the waters shmmeee, you challenged BJ's leadership, and yet the guy did what he said he would do, AND delivered his party the biggest electoral landslide in living memory, by winning over traditional labour heartlands.
As for KS, you defend his background all you like, he's a laim duck leader of a rudderless ship.
Any politician worth his salt could of had a field day with what's happened with the pandemic, accusations of cronyism and brexit, but where is he?
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
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A
The lie BJ told is coming back to bite him. Same as your wife cutting of your balls when the deck of lies came crashing down. The other obvious issue being Northern Ireland didn’t buy his lies, they voted remain, the DUP is loosing votes at an alarming rate for being complicit in those lies. It also sounds like you’re saying that a return to the troubles is what Boris wanted because that will be the nett result of Boris lying to get what he wanted. “Project fear “ said that it would break up the Union, that’s also looking to be a likely nett result of Boris lying to get what he wanted. Are you suggesting that he actively lied to achieve the break up of the Union?

No one’s got what they wanted and no one will. Not without moving the goalposts anyway.
A break up of the union is a very real possibility, one option would be to offer a vote to the people of NI on remaining in the UK and accepting a EU border, or uniting with Ireland, and having a hard border with mainland UK.
Not ideal, but possible.

The issue was always going to come post Brexit, it was a case of "get Brexit done" and cross the NI bridge when we get there.

Well we are there now, so as I've said, it will be interesting to see how it plays out.

Either way, the break up of the Union seems more and more possible, with Scotish independents pushing for it as well.

Will it be such a bad thing in the long term? I have no idea.
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
17,707
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Verona, Italy
The issue was always going to come post Brexit, it was a case of "get Brexit done" and cross the NI bridge when we get there.
If that’s the case then it’s utterly irresponsible and shows a total disregard for a province inside the UK.
 

PVA

Well-Known Member
Apr 22, 2011
5,580
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It's utterly ridiculous that Boris Johnson can:

  • Insist that there will be no border in the Irish sea or checks on goods… Despite everyone pointing out that will have to happen for Brexit to happen
  • Still make those claims even when it’s in writing that it will happen
  • Agree to the deal
  • Then complain the border and checks, which he put in place, are ludicrous
  • And then completely get away with it – the media don’t challenge him and the general public don’t give a shit about what he’s done

Fuck this country
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
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If that’s the case then it’s utterly irresponsible and shows a total disregard for a province inside the UK.
it's a case of damned if you do damned if you dont. Something had to give in order to get brexit done by the deadline.
He made the deadline, delivered brexit as promised in his manifesto, and now he has to fix the fall out.
I'm not defending his actions, but I dont see how he could of done anything else in the timescale available.
Telling the truth would of been a disaster, (if the truth was, I dont have a clue how to solve NI)
My guess is, he will stroll of into retirement as the man who successfully delivered Brexit, and leave someone else to pick up the pieces.

Not good, but that's politics now I'm afraid.
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
Jun 19, 2017
3,464
2,909
213
It's utterly ridiculous that Boris Johnson can:

  • Insist that there will be no border in the Irish sea or checks on goods… Despite everyone pointing out that will have to happen for Brexit to happen
  • Still make those claims even when it’s in writing that it will happen
  • Agree to the deal
  • Then complain the border and checks, which he put in place, are ludicrous
  • And then completely get away with it – the media don’t challenge him and the general public don’t give a shit about what he’s done

Fuck this country
I think your right about the public not caring,
Unless your irish of course. (Or scotish)

But with the referendum result being 51% vs 49%
Its inevitable that so many will be left feeling betrayed.
You cant please all the people all the time.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2013
27,300
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I think your right about the public not caring,
Unless your irish of course. (Or scotish)

But with the referendum result being 51% vs 49%
Its inevitable that so many will be left feeling betrayed.
You cant please all the people all the time.
The majority of fishermen voted for Brexit and they’re far from pleased. Didn’t gain back control of waters as promised and lost access to its biggest market which was promised wouldn’t happen. More people are feeling betrayed than voted remain and by some margin. Some of the most betrayed are leavers.