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Do you want to discuss boring politics? (51 Viewers)

fernandopartridge said:
As much as Starmer is hated, Reeves is equally as big a problem if not bigger.
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I posted this one the other day on a different thread (not mine, but shamlessly stolen from X):

"replacing Starmer with Reeves, is like shitting your pants then changing your shirt"
 
fernandopartridge said:
It isn't for you, you have long been anti immigration which is your right. You are not so anti that you have not been an economic migrant yourself across Europe though.
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Regardless of my personal and economic situation, which you know very little about, I have contributed positively to the countries I have lived in through taxes and spending. I also haven't committed any crimes or tried to tell the native people that they should bend for me, or indeed sexually assault any of them, which is a popular pastime for many coming to the UK in recent times. The number of Brits living here is is also less than boat arrivals in 2 months of last year alone, so your point is irrelevant. You know you haven't got an argument though, which is why you are lashing out. It's another reason why so many people don't bother engaging and then vote in ways you cannot comprehend.

You go on holiday to Benidorm which is ironic, and have limited travel experience, let alone the minerals to live somewhere different. Given that the vast majority of the country just voted for Reform, and you think it is because it's down to the price of a sandwich, you aren't really in any position to lecture anybody on any of this.
 
Grendel said:
You seem to be getting pretty desperate to defend Starmer and that the public are stupid
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Well the public are pretty stupid. They voted for Brexit and now are voting for Farage.

But that's not my point.

My point is if immigration is the main problem, as keeps being claimed, and immigration has reduced massively under this government then by definition they're doing a good job.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Regardless of my personal and economic situation, which you know very little about, I have contributed positively to the countries I have lived in through taxes and spending. I also haven't committed any crimes or tried to tell the native people that they should bend for me, or indeed sexually assault any of them, which is a popular pastime for many coming to the UK in recent times. The number of Brits living here is is also less than boat arrivals in 2 months of last year alone, so your point is irrelevant. You know you haven't got an argument though, which is why you are lashing out. It's another reason why so many people don't bother engaging and then vote in ways you cannot comprehend.

You go on holiday to Benidorm which is ironic, and have limited travel experience, let alone the minerals to live somewhere different. Given that the vast majority of the country just voted for Reform, and you think it is because it's down to the price of a sandwich, you aren't really in any position to lecture anybody on any of this.
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How can somebody living in Czechia lecture me living in the UK about elections in the UK?
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Regardless of my personal and economic situation, which you know very little about, I have contributed positively to the countries I have lived in through taxes and spending. I also haven't committed any crimes or tried to tell the native people that they should bend for me, or indeed sexually assault any of them, which is a popular pastime for many coming to the UK in recent times. The number of Brits living here is is also less than boat arrivals in 2 months of last year alone, so your point is irrelevant. You know you haven't got an argument though, which is why you are lashing out. It's another reason why so many people don't bother engaging and then vote in ways you cannot comprehend.

You go on holiday to Benidorm which is ironic, and have limited travel experience, let alone the minerals to live somewhere different. Given that the vast majority of the country just voted for Reform, and you think it is because it's down to the price of a sandwich, you aren't really in any position to lecture anybody on any of this.
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Why is going on holiday to Benidorm ironic?
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Given that the vast majority of the country just voted for Reform
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I would be absolutely amazed if the turnout was high enough that over 50% of eligible voters have voted for Reform.

That assumes by vast majority of the country you are meaning to exclude those not eligible to vote.
 
fernandopartridge said:
I'm going to Benidorm with all my Reform voting mates next week ESB, fancy it? Or is it too low brow for you? Do you always sneer at the white working classes?
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You've missed my point spectacularly, which was on purpose to deflect from your flaliing argument.

You go to one place full of Brits who don't integrate, but have a go at someone who does. You then think there is no validity in arguments against immigration, but would be the first to have a pop at those people who have more bravery to try and do it, which is something that you couldn't.

I would happily go anywhere and have a pint with anyone, which is a big part of the reason I love travel so much.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Regardless of my personal and economic situation, which you know very little about, I have contributed positively to the countries I have lived in through taxes and spending. I also haven't committed any crimes or tried to tell the native people that they should bend for me, or indeed sexually assault any of them, which is a popular pastime for many coming to the UK in recent times. The number of Brits living here is is also less than boat arrivals in 2 months of last year alone, so your point is irrelevant. You know you haven't got an argument though, which is why you are lashing out. It's another reason why so many people don't bother engaging and then vote in ways you cannot comprehend.

You go on holiday to Benidorm which is ironic, and have limited travel experience, let alone the minerals to live somewhere different. Given that the vast majority of the country just voted for Reform, and you think it is because it's down to the price of a sandwich, you aren't really in any position to lecture anybody on any of this.
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I replied to you on this exact topic yesterday, reducing it to ‘the price of a sandwich’ is like reducing immigration to ‘a few blokes on a plane’. Come on.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
You've missed my point spectacularly, which was on purpose to deflect from your flaliing argument.

You go to one place full of Brits who don't integrate, but have a go at someone who does. You then think there is no validity in arguments against immigration, but would be the first to have a pop at those people who have more bravery to try and do it, which is something that you couldn't.

I would happily go anywhere and have a pint with anyone, which is a big part of the reason I love travel so much.
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How do you know he couldnt?
 
Brighton Sky Blue said:
I replied to you on this exact topic yesterday, reducing it to ‘the price of a sandwich’ is like reducing immigration to ‘a few blokes on a plane’. Come on.
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Again, the leftist view that reform voters are misplacing their frustration at the economy by blaming immigration is incorrect. This argument sailed away a long time ago. What is in the shopping basket specifically for the analogy is not important here, as most of us can all agree the economy (almost everywhere) is in a shit state.

You have people on here downplaying the results of this local election. It should be a huge warning, not an opportunity to downplay people's concerns, or come out with denial based theories about how it must be to do with something else.
 
Looks like an increased number of councils are going to end up as no overall control. Be interesting to see how they work when the day to day running of the council needs to be addressed.

Will the Conservatives want to align with Reform? Won't do much for the idea that they're essentially the same party, for different reasons probably not good for either. Hard to see Labour, Lib Dem or Greens working with Reform. Hopefully we don't see too many councils that just end up in constant deadlock.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Again, the leftist view that reform voters are misplacing their frustration at the economy by blaming immigration is incorrect. This argument sailed away a long time ago. What is in the shopping basket specifically for the analogy is not important here, as most of us can all agree the economy (almost everywhere) is in a shit state.

You have people on here downplaying the results of this local election. It should be a huge warning, not an opportunity to downplay people's concerns, or come out with denial based theories about how it must be to do with something else.
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Well, you think it’s incorrect, I disagree. That’s essentially the source of the disagreement.
 
we regained our pos as 5th largest economy and are set to overtake japan we aint doing that badly but the cash aint going to the workers
 
eastwoodsdustman said:
I can give you a few ideas on why people are pissed off and it does come down to mass immigration as the root cause.

Housing shortage issues, pressure on ALL public services, driving down wages, no go areas in cities, crime and organised crime gangs are all symptoms of mass immigration policies employed by both main parties for the last 30 years.

Its impossible to allow nigh on ten million people into the country in a short time and not expect an impact on all of the above (with the exception of crime if we were more thorough with vetting).

If people don't think that any of the above apply in this country then they are in denial.
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Just a few things to politely correct here.

That 10 million figure is patently wrong. Completely made up. Where did you get that from?

Where are these no go areas that you're talking about. Name one.

Recorded crime rates have generally been dropping since the 1990s, whereas immigration has been increasing. That seems counter to your argument too.

Now I can't deny how you _feel_ about these things, that's down to you. But when it comes to the facts on these issues at least, you're the one in denial.

If you want things like more security at work, less crime, a better NHS, then voting Reform seems entirely counter intuitive to me.

What you're voting for is a man who doesn't believe in workers rights, who would see the NHS become further privatised, who will be looking to put less money into everything that's publicly funded.

Reform in power would definitely try to throw out migrants though, there's no secret about that. And maybe that's enough for some people; but if they think it's going to make everything else magically better then they really are in severe denial.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
You've missed my point spectacularly, which was on purpose to deflect from your flaliing argument.

You go to one place full of Brits who don't integrate, but have a go at someone who does. You then think there is no validity in arguments against immigration, but would be the first to have a pop at those people who have more bravery to try and do it, which is something that you couldn't.

I would happily go anywhere and have a pint with anyone, which is a big part of the reason I love travel so much.
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They're on holiday, they don't need to 'integrate'. Holidaymakers are not immigrants.
 
PVA said:
Posting a tweet from a white supremacist, nice!

I dread to think what else is on your X feed.
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It came from Google images.

Glad I posted it though as you have also helped prove its validity! I'll give you a bit of slack however, as this must be a very difficult day for you.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
It came from Google images.

Glad I posted it though as you have also helped prove its validity! I'll give you a bit of slack however, as this must be a very difficult day for you.
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You're glad you posted a tweet from a white supremacist?

And I've had a great day thank you.
 
PVA said:
This is just not true is it.

Reform voters are all over social media, moreso than any other party I would say (certainly Facebook)
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The vocal ones are. The ones who are worried about being called racist arent.
 
duffer said:
Just a few things to politely correct here.

That 10 million figure is patently wrong. Completely made up. Where did you get that from?

Where are these no go areas that you're talking about. Name one.

Recorded crime rates have generally been dropping since the 1990s, whereas immigration has been increasing. That seems counter to your argument too.

Now I can't deny how you _feel_ about these things, that's down to you. But when it comes to the facts on these issues at least, you're the one in denial.

If you want things like more security at work, less crime, a better NHS, then voting Reform seems entirely counter intuitive to me.

What you're voting for is a man who doesn't believe in workers rights, who would see the NHS become further privatised, who will be looking to put less money into everything that's publicly funded.

Reform in power would definitely try to throw out migrants though, there's no secret about that. And maybe that's enough for some people; but if they think it's going to make everything else magically better then they really are in severe denial.
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You've not read or have misread what I said. The nigh on figure was a rough one. I know its probably nearer 7-8 mill but who really knows.

As for reform, If you read what I said, I have no love for them at all. I was merely pointing out reasons why people are disaffected by Starmer and or the two main parties.

Feel free to carry on though.
 
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
You don't understand why people don't like Starmer, what value are you adding here, apart from humour?
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Hes banged on about people dont like Starmer without giving Amy reasons why.... ive given an entire list of reasons which he seems to have just conveniently ignored since! Just to carry on banging on about immigration being down so must be a good thing!

Sent from my SM-S711B using Tapatalk
 
Milan's hair dye said:
Dunno why people would be voting based on immigration in local elections tbh but maybe as said it's a rhetoric that's ingrained into people's minds.
I voted based on the piss poor distribution of public money that this council has overseen.
In a world where we the people are expected to cut back, our council has splurged the fucking lot away each year on nothing but vanity projects that constantly go over budget.
All whilst our services get cut.
You can blame austerity all you want, who then blame it on "dear, there's no money left good luck" labour, who in turn ... Blah, blah, blah
But reality is when the money they have, gets pissed away on projects that will never return on investment, maybe they need pulling into check.
One of the UK's best indoor water parks, closed 50% of the time
The old baths, costing a fortune just to keep empty
The IKEA building, a whole shit tonne of lost public money on a building that will be up to 40% used by the uni. The rest on a cultural centre for arts, like the loss making one we already have.
The purchase of coombe park, the thing that's free to go to but costs a fortune to maintain
The 800mtr electric tram line, that offers zero purpose to anyone except a student that needs to get round the corner quicker.
Could have linked the city centre to the rail station, but obviously the need to go round the corner to the uni buildings is far more vital.

Local issues are the only reasons for me to vote in this election, but I doubt I'll be rolling the dice on an inexperienced party on a whimsical hope that 200k immigrants will be waiting at bhx come next week
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All that but not one mention about the social care costs being pushed onto local councils and which now take up over 80% of their budget..
 
DT-R said:
Hes banged on about people dont like Starmer without giving Amy reasons why.... ive given an entire list of reasons which he seems to have just conveniently ignored since! Just to carry on banging on about immigration being down so must be a good thing!

Sent from my SM-S711B using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

In all seriousness, the results so far today are huge. If you are really far politically the other way, it must be difficult. It is a big indication from the general public that they've had enough and I would say one of the most significant indicators of the times we are in since Brexit. The numbers here are not just a few racists, or sheltered corners of the country. There's no adult or sensible way to counter argue that, unless you spin off into denial or do the Seymour Skinner 'it's the children that are wrong'.

Whilst I do not think Reform are the long term answer, I do hope that this shake up can be the catalyst for some form of positive change.

 
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