Do you want to discuss boring politics? (13 Viewers)

[Grendel]

Tories would prevent long-term jobless spending benefits on alcohol and cigarettes

The proposals would also see benefits cut for people who are able to work but have failed to hold down a job.

www.bbc.co.uk

Good to see the Conservatives have moved away from demonising poor people. Pathetic stuff.

it’s unworkable but should be happening?

 

[chiefdave]

Tories would prevent long-term jobless spending benefits on alcohol and cigarettes

The proposals would also see benefits cut for people who are able to work but have failed to hold down a job.

www.bbc.co.uk

Good to see the Conservatives have moved away from demonising poor people. Pathetic stuff.

The party is yet to detail how its proposal would work

This sounds like one of those things that gets announced to make headlines and then quietly disappears as it costs more to implement than it saves.

 

[rob9872]

I'd go a step further and give the money in the form of food vouchers that then couldn't be spent on alcohol or tobacco or drugs or anything else. Pay rent direct to landlords or councils, utilities direct to the supplier. Everyone should have a basic right to housing, food and warmth but wasting it on luxury items paid for by the working class who often struggle themselves, has always been a pisstake.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I'd go a step further and give the money in the form of food vouchers that then couldn't be spent on alcohol or tobacco or drugs or anything else. Pay rent direct to landlords or councils, utilities direct to the supplier. Everyone should have a basic right to housing, food and warmth but wasting it on luxury items paid for by the working class who often struggle themselves, has always been a pisstake.

That’s sad that you’re empathy doesn’t extend far enough to support people who find themselves in need

You seem a good guy too

 

[Grendel]

I'd go a step further and give the money in the form of food vouchers that then couldn't be spent on alcohol or tobacco or drugs or anything else. Pay rent direct to landlords or councils, utilities direct to the supplier. Everyone should have a basic right to housing, food and warmth but wasting it on luxury items paid for by the working class who often struggle themselves, has always been a pisstake.

I have advocated this for some time. There should be a tiny amount of cash and everything else given is in the form of credits for basic necessities

 

[Grendel]

This sounds like one of those things that gets announced to make headlines and then quietly disappears as it costs more to implement than it saves.

If it forced people to actually get a job it clearly would in the end cost a lot less

 

[rob9872]

That’s sad that you’re empathy doesn’t extend far enough to support people who find themselves in need

You seem a good guy too

In what way are they not being supported? Free housing, free food, free bills. But holidays, big tv's the latest iphone, drugs, booze, gambling and cigarettes - you think we should pay for those too whilst others who are working are struggling to afford it for themselves? Not sure how anyone can disagree with any of that.

 

[Grendel]

In what way are they not being supported? Free housing, free food, free bills. But holidays, big tv's the latest iphone, drugs, booze, gambling and cigarettes - you think we should pay for those too whilst others who are working are struggling to afford it for themselves? Not sure how anyone can disagree with any of that.

We need to reduce the welfare bill which is out of control. The next comment will be about pensions. We already have one of the lowest state pensions in Europe. There has to be a limit on how long people can claim benefits while able to work.

 

[rob9872]

It's also not really about my empathy. I donate to most causes added on here like the ST fund etc, I donate to chosen things like your horses ones etc, even though we disagree massively with our views on racing. I give to foodbanks, I have charitable direct debits for a variety of causes, but I'm lucky that I can afford to do that. What we shouldn't be doing, is asking is those that work hard and are just above that breadline, to be paying for others who in many cases refuse to work (not all, some are genuine hardship I agree).

 

[mmttww]

Not sure what's wrong with that?

It's like looking down the back of the sofa to find money to pay the mortgage. Just reaffirms the message that it isn't sh*t government, horrible wealth inequality etc. that are big issues, it's poor people having a drink and some ciggies.

it’s unworkable but should be happening?

it costs more to implement than it saves.

Why should something that's unworkable be happening? Like has been said here and was alluded to in the article, it's dog whistles for Conservatives with no detail on how it'll work or evidence that it's worked anywhere else before.

If it forced people to actually get a job

If there's evidence that something like this actually gets the results you want, I'm all ears but let's be honest, this is just policy made up in the car Thick of It style. Headline grabbing sh*te with no substance offered in support of it at all.

 

[Grendel]

It's like looking down the back of the sofa to find money to pay the mortgage. Just reaffirms the message that it isn't sh*t government, horrible wealth inequality etc. that are big issues, it's poor people having a drink and some ciggies.





Why should something that's unworkable be happening? Like has been said here and was alluded to in the article, it's word salad dog whistles for Conservatives with no detail on how it'll work or evidence that it's worked anywhere else before.



If there's evidence that something like this actually gets the results you want, I'm all ears but let's be honest, this is just policy made up in the car Thick of It style. Headline grabbing sh*te with no substance offered in support of it at all.

The reason it will not happen is that no one is prepared to do anything

You could immediately recover monies by addressing PIP for a start

 

[rob9872]

Just reaffirms the message that it isn't sh*t government, horrible wealth inequality etc. that are big issues, it's poor people having a drink and some ciggies.

... whilst their kids go hungry, dirty, cold and unkempt.

 

[Grendel]

This just is not sustainable

Number of people claiming key disability benefit hits record high

An ongoing review into Personal Independence Payments (Pip) has found the system is "not fit for purpose".

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[rob9872]

"had actually slowed, falling from a rise of 400,000 in the 12 months to July 2024, to 260,000 in the 12 months to July 2026."

This is the kind of shitty political talk that pisses me off. At first glance it looks as if it's reduced. It hasn't. It's gone up by another 260,000!!! If they spoke in plain English, even the bad news would be more widely accepted because it would be seemingly more honest. They rely on the average stupidity not to realise.

 

[Grendel]

"had actually slowed, falling from a rise of 400,000 in the 12 months to July 2024, to 260,000 in the 12 months to July 2026."

This is the kind of shitty political talk that pisses me off. At first glance it looks as if it's reduced. It hasn't. It's gone up by another 260,000!!! If they spoke in plain English, even the bad news would be more widely accepted because it would be seemingly more honest. They rely on the average stupidity not to realise.

PIP is not even counted in tax revenue which the state pension is - its an avalanche of benefits that needs just stopping

 

[mmttww]

their kids go hungry, dirty, cold and unkempt.

You've proven my point here, haven't you? Are we gonna assume everyone who might be affected by this has kids and treats them like sh*t? that's pretty grim.

 

[rob9872]

You've proven my point here, haven't you? Are we gonna assume everyone who might be affected by this has kids and treats them like sh*t? that's pretty grim.

So they're on benefits and spending even some of it on cigarettes and alcohol when money is tight and you think the kids aren't going without? I'm lucky not to have been in that position and I imagine most of us are, but if you're a parent, you'd go without a lot more than fags and booze to see your kids getting what they need ... and if the kids have everything they need and there is still some left over for fags and booze, then arguably they are receiving money they don't need.

 

[mmttww]

you think the kids aren't going without?

Everyone in a home reliant on benefits is likely going without various things to some extent. Bit different from talking as if all those houses are full of starving, dirty kids. I've said all I want to on this, fully cba going round in circles on it especially as it won't happen. Just gets so boring seeing poor people take a kicking. I've had my vent.

 

[Nick]

I'd go a step further and give the money in the form of food vouchers that then couldn't be spent on alcohol or tobacco or drugs or anything else. Pay rent direct to landlords or councils, utilities direct to the supplier. Everyone should have a basic right to housing, food and warmth but wasting it on luxury items paid for by the working class who often struggle themselves, has always been a pisstake.

I always assumed rent was paid direct to landlords but mad that it isn't.

 

[Nick]

Everyone in a home reliant on benefits is likely going without various things to some extent. Bit different from talking as if all those houses are full of starving, dirty kids. I've said all I want to on this, fully cba going round in circles on it especially as it won't happen. Just gets so boring seeing poor people take a kicking. I've had my vent.

Not sure it's taking a kicking if it's saying benefits won't cover cigs and alcohol.

For somebody to smoke 10 a day, whats that a month? £200 nowadays for packs? £130+ for rollups?

If somebody is on benefits and can smoke 10 Richmond Superkings a day then they aren't doing too badly.

 

[Nick]

This just is not sustainable

Number of people claiming key disability benefit hits record high

An ongoing review into Personal Independence Payments (Pip) has found the system is "not fit for purpose".

www.bbc.co.uk

It's madness.

 

[Grendel]

Everyone in a home reliant on benefits is likely going without various things to some extent. Bit different from talking as if all those houses are full of starving, dirty kids. I've said all I want to on this, fully cba going round in circles on it especially as it won't happen. Just gets so boring seeing poor people take a kicking. I've had my vent.

it’s not just reliant on benefits though is it. I know two people who have a brand new Volvo on PIP and two horses and laugh about the PIP mobile

 

[SBAndy]

it’s not just reliant on benefits though is it. I know two people who have a brand new Volvo on PIP and two horses and laugh about the PIP mobile

Plenty of pensioners put their WFA towards a cruise - scrap that as well, yes?

 

[Grendel]

Plenty of pensioners put their WFA towards a cruise - scrap that as well, yes?

Er no as they have paid into the system and the pension forms part of their tax return

your response is really odd. The uk has one of the lowest levels of state pensions across Europe - to to on cruises I’d assume they are still paying tax into the system

Actually it’s not odd. It’s symptomatic of the nonsense you come out with