Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics)

Alan Dugdales Moustache

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Attendance right now is about 85% and falling daily
Schools have to stay open . Everything else has to be shut first in my opinion. Pubs, nail bars, sports centres, gyms etc.
 

Brighton Sky Blue

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Schools have to stay open . Everything else has to be shut first in my opinion. Pubs, nail bars, sports centres, gyms etc.
The logistical problem will come if we get into half in half out for teachers or students or both. My own view is we need to drop the farcical restrictions in school and let us teach normally so the education provided is the highest quality
 
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NorthernWisdom

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Cant see it happening unless other European countries do
I think they will.

tbh, regardless of where we all sit on this, wouldn't the worst thing to do be to follow them all belatedly, as per last time? Don't we either need to commit to a Sweden style approach, or New Zealand style approach, as of now... rather than muddle along, hope for the best, and end up causing more damage by having to shut down after all, just worse than it maybe could and should have been?

We again have the advantage. We need to decide what we do with that.
 

Ian1779

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The logistical problem will come if we get into half in half out for teachers or students or both. My own view is we need to drop the farcical restrictions in school and let us teach normally so the education provided is the highest quality
I see your point, but we have safety restrictions in school and the government have already lost control of the testing situation and can’t keep on top of it. Take them away and you will give the virus even more opportunity to spread and no plan to measure how bad it gets.
 

Brighton Sky Blue

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I think they will.

tbh, regardless of where we all sit on this, wouldn't the worst thing to do be to follow them all belatedly, as per last time? Don't we either need to commit to a Sweden style approach, or New Zealand style approach, as of now... rather than muddle along, hope for the best, and end up causing more damage by having to shut down after all, just worse than it maybe could and should have been?

We again have the advantage. We need to decide what we do with that.
Go for Sweden added with keeping the vulnerable indoors
 

shmmeee

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Attendance right now is about 85% and falling daily
I was thinking today, by Ofsted standards every school in the country is failing right now.

I just don’t think you can close schools without bringing the entire economy to a halt. Even half in half out doesn’t work. The admin required to administer some kind of compensation to every parent or employer of a parent rather than by business type would be insane. Some parents can stay in high paying jobs working from home, others could lose a low paying job they can’t. It’d be a political nightmare.
 
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skybluetony176

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They will as long as there are staff to keep it open and students to teach.
Don’t know about schools elsewhere but numerous schools in Rugby have had to close entire years already for a period of time. Stands to reason that at some point an entire school will have to close if only for a fortnight. Hopefully temporary closures on a year by year or school by school basis will be enough. Really don’t want the schools to close for 5 months again.
 

Brighton Sky Blue

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I see your point, but we have safety restrictions in school and the government have already lost control of the testing situation and can’t keep on top of it. Take them away and you will give the virus even more opportunity to spread.
It’s going to spread anyway, some have 2000 people on site and lots of siblings in different year groups. Let me do my job normally and allow anyone who doesn’t like it to get a remote education. Children won’t get ill from this to the same extent as they will from flu or cold and there’s a slim chance I will.
 

Ian1779

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Don’t know about schools elsewhere but numerous schools in Rugby have had to close entire years already for a period of time. Stands to reason that at some point an entire school will have to close if only for a fortnight. Hopefully temporary closures on a year by year or school by school basis will be enough. Really don’t want the schools to close for 5 months again.
No one does, but unless someone gets a grip on what is happening I can’t see anything else but it happening, although I wouldn’t expect it to last anywhere near as long as before.
 

skybluetony176

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well if other industries cope and other Countries do keep schools Open it says something either about us being over cautious or die thing else. Sweden never closed did they?
Sweden just this week admitted that they got it wrong. Not really sure what point you think you’re making there but whatever it is Sweden disagrees with you.
 

Grendel

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The difference is that it doesn’t take many staff absences to leave schools unable to have an adult in every room.
Can they not employ retired teachers, supply teachers etc on a temporary basis as and when? Otherwise should we just have zoom lessons for the next few years? Could save money by firing most teachers I guess
 

skybluetony176

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No one does, but unless someone gets a grip on what is happening I can’t see anything else but it happening, although I wouldn’t expect it to last anywhere near as long as before.
I think ADM has it right (surprised me too ;)) in that pubs, clubs, gyms etc should be closed first. Schools should be the last resort.
 
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NorthernWisdom

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Can they not employ retired teachers, supply teachers etc on a temporary basis as and when? Otherwise should we just have zoom lessons for the next few years? Could save money by firing most teachers I guess
Throwing a bunch of 70+ yos in is throwing in the people who need protecting most.

Needs radical thinking. If we close over winter, we need to open schools over summer to compensate.
 

Grendel

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Throwing a bunch of 70+ yos in is throwing in the people who need protecting most.

Needs radical thinking. If we close over winter, we need to open schools over summer to compensate.
but most in schools are of minimal risk so by your own argument why close them?
 

NorthernWisdom

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but most in schools are of minimal risk so by your own argument why close them?
Because they come in contact with parents who are higher risk, who come in contact with grandparents who are higher risk still, who come in contact with delivery drivers, farmers etc...

It's not the immediate, it's what happens after that is the issue. And to effectively exile a segment of society as pariahs to not be seen by anybody could, potentially, be more destructive psychologically both to them and their dependents, as a full lockdown.

if you do it quicker and harder, it probably doesn't need to be for as long as last time. Schools close for a fortnight over Christmas anyway, we have a week half term in October. A Three week shutdown in October/November, seeing how it goes, extending as necessary, and chalking extensions off summer could potentially skew trends to allow for *more* freedoms and normaility, than a muddling through doing neither.

None of this, of course, alters the fact that government needs to lead... whichever approach or plan it chooses. Currently it seems six months further on, we *still* have no plan.
 

Alan Dugdales Moustache

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I think ADM has it right (surprised me too ;) ) in that pubs, clubs, gyms etc should be closed first. Schools should be the last resort.
Yeeeeeeeeeeessssssssssssss. You left out nail bars but if you want that luxury then you can have it.
 
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Alan Dugdales Moustache

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Because they come in contact with parents who are higher risk, who come in contact with grandparents who are higher risk still, who come in contact with delivery drivers, farmers etc...

It's not the immediate, it's what happens after that is the issue. And to effectively exile a segment of society as pariahs to not be seen by anybody could, potentially, be more destructive psychologically both to them and their dependents, as a full lockdown.

if you do it quicker and harder, it probably doesn't need to be for as long as last time. Schools close for a fortnight over Christmas anyway, we have a week half term in October. A Three week shutdown in October/November, seeing how it goes, extending as necessary, and chalking extensions off summer could potentially skew trends to allow for *more* freedoms and normaility, than a muddling through doing neither.
In short, the problems are not in schools, it's at the school gates, it's arriving and leaving. Social distancing doesn't exist .
 
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NorthernWisdom

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In short, the problems are not in schools, it's at the school gates, it's arriving and leaving. Social distancing doesn't exist .
Well... it's also when a child goes home to be looked after by somebody who's vulnerable to it. As for distancing, we've had a chance to think how we could make schools, well... bigger - see us utilise buildings / rooms that currently stand vacant as staff aren't using them, encourage workers who can to work from home, subsidise essential services (give a pay rise to people who serve you at the checkout ffs) and yes, if necessary cut wages of people who are travelling less and so have less costs. Re-think where we're going, and how.

Now, I can spout bollocks on here easy enough ;) but where's the cross-party working group on all this? tbf, I assume there is one?
 
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Brighton Sky Blue

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Can they not employ retired teachers, supply teachers etc on a temporary basis as and when? Otherwise should we just have zoom lessons for the next few years? Could save money by firing most teachers I guess
There’s only so many of those available and they cost a lot on top of the existing costs, a problem which is amplified by a decade of not funding them properly to begin with. I suppose we could fire most office monkeys to begin with
 

Ian1779

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Can they not employ retired teachers, supply teachers etc on a temporary basis as and when? Otherwise should we just have zoom lessons for the next few years? Could save money by firing most teachers I guess
Do you not think a profession with a huge recruitment crisis might not have already thought about these things generally before Cov-ID. I can’t see the added ‘incentive’ of you may die being a seller to be honest.
 
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Ian1779

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In short, the problems are not in schools, it's at the school gates, it's arriving and leaving. Social distancing doesn't exist .
Ultimately we have no control outside of the school gates. That falls on the parents and kids themselves, and all the measures we put in place can only mitigate as best we can.
 

Grendel

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Well... it's also when a child goes home to be looked after by somebody who's vulnerable to it. As for distancing, we've had a chance to think how we could make schools, well... bigger - see us utilise buildings / rooms that currently stand vacant as staff aren't using them, encourage workers who can to work from home, subsidise essential services (give a pay rise to people who serve you at the checkout ffs) and yes, if necessary cut wages of people who are travelling less and so have less costs. Re-think where we're going, and how.

Now, I can spout bollocks on here easy enough ;) but where's the cross-party working group on all this? tbf, I assume there is one?
You quoted New Zealand - when did they reopen schools
 

Brighton Sky Blue

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Do you not think a profession with a huge recruitment crisis might not have already thought about these things generally before Cov-ID. I can’t see the added ‘incentive’ of you may die being a seller to be honest.
It’s alright G just volunteered to do my A level classes by Zoom
 

CCFCSteve

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Sweden just this week admitted that they got it wrong. Not really sure what point you think you’re making there but whatever it is Sweden disagrees with you.
Sweden’s a funny one. I’ve seen some comments (from inside and out) thinking they fucked up, others not. Nobody will know until you look back in years to come and see the deaths/illnesses over the period of the whole outbreak and the impact of lockdowns (on economy, schooling and other illnesses)

It's bordering on impossible to compare countries anyway though, Ive read Sweden has a massive percentage (40%) of single occupiers with no kids, so the household spread (highest risk of contagion) is likely to be far more limited over there. It’s why there’s been a massive problem with household spread of different ethnicities in this country (not really ever mentioned but if anyone looks at the data on the surveillance reports, it’s stark)

That’s before you go into density of certain populations, cultures, obedience to laws etc etc
 

Alan Dugdales Moustache

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Ultimately we have no control outside of the school gates. That falls on the parents and kids themselves, and all the measures we put in place can only mitigate as best we can.
You're right. I have the misfortune to live fairly close to a large primary school and to walk past the kids and parents at start and end of school you wouldn't think coronavirus even existed.