Southampton Poll

[GC1976]

Giving this some thought and reading some reports that Middlesbrough had been practicing penalties last week when spied upon , do you think Southampton should be excluded from the final and Middlesborough sent through. I think they will continue to train until it’s resolved

 

[rob9872]

Could've potentially kicked them out before last night, but cant really now. Hopefully link up with the EPL and start next season with a points deduction whatever league they're in.

 

[northstander]

Cheating is cheating. Throw the book at them.

 

[Flying Fokker]

They will train. But we’ll never know about the penalties. However, the Boro players will have been rattled, probably playing out penalties in their sleep. I’d be happy to award Boro a 3-0 win at the home leg and a points fine at the start of the season for Saints.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

Could've potentially kicked them out before last night, but cant really now. Hopefully link up with the EPL and start next season with a points deduction whatever league they're in.

Doesn’t help Middlesbrough who were the team disadvantaged by their cheating

 

[harvey098]

No, not for me. He stood on a hill near a golf course which overlooked the training ground. It wasn’t like he breached security and trespassed.

If you’re that bothered about people watching you train, then train somewhere more private.

I don’t even know how much of an advantage you can gain. “Conway was good in the rondo today”

 

[harvey098]

For full context if you hadn’t read

How Southampton spied on Middlesbrough

Southampton have been charged by the EFL with spying on Championship play-off rivals Middlesbrough. It was not as difficult as one might think.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[clint van damme]

No, not for me. He stood on a hill near a golf course which overlooked the training ground. It wasn’t like he breached security and trespassed.

If you’re that bothered about people watching you train, then train somewhere more private.

I don’t even know how much of an advantage you can gain. “Conway was good in the rondo today”

Are you just ignoring the fact there are clear rules regarding this which have been broken?

 

[KNSB]

Kick them out. They knew the rules and did it anyway. Also this cycnical attempt to play for time to carry out an 'internal investigation' only makes it worse.

 

[harvey098]

Are you just ignoring the fact there are clear rules regarding this which have been broken?

I think they should be punished and fined but my answer was in relation to them being kicked out the playoffs and that’s too far for me, for what is a pretty minor rule break in terms of actual advantage. I’d say more advantages were gained by breaking rules actually in the game with time wasting and diving etc.

 

[Shannerz]

Kicked out by default. If the allegations from the first play off game are demonstrated unequivocally, then that game should be forfeited, with the standard 3-0 scoreline.

Probably more important than that, though, are bans for those involved, including the manager. Canada manager situation set the precedent.

 

[David O'Day]

I think they should be punished and fined but my answer was in relation to them being kicked out the playoffs and that’s too far for me for what is a pretty minor rule break in terms of actual advantage. I’d say more advantages were gained by breaking rules actually in the game with time wasting and diving etc.

So what is the point of having a rule if the punishment isn't going to stop people breaking the rules?

 

[ccfc1234]

If they go up or stay down give them -10 to start next season with. It punishes the club without giving anyone else a free pass. Southampton could have effected many results with their approach and we can't put all those right so just punish the club.

 

[harvey098]

So what is the point of having a rule if the punishment isn't going to stop people breaking the rules?

The punishment for a cynical foul is a yellow card but people still do it and that affects the outcome of the game far more than someone watching a training session. I think there should definitely be punishment but I’m saying to remove them from the playoffs is way too drastic for something that I can’t really see how it affected the outcome of that game.

I’d probably feel differently if it went to pens and they won that way (and had watched them practicing pens).

 

[David O'Day]

If they go up or stay down give them -10 to start next season with. It punishes the club without giving anyone else a free pass. Southampton could have effected many results with their approach and we can't put all those right so just punish the club.

nah, they will still get the 100+ million PL money

 

[David O'Day]

The punishment for a cynical foul is a yellow card but people still do it and that affects the outcome of the game far more than someone watching a training session. I think there should definitely be punishment but I’m saying to remove them from the playoffs is way too drastic for something that I can’t really see how it affected the outcome of that game.

I’d probably feel differently if it went to pens and they won that way (and had watched them practicing pens).

Comparing a yellow card foul to this.

You're done here

 

[ccfc1234]

nah, they will still get the 100+ million PL money

Fair point.

 

[ajsccfc]

I've heard a lot of Southampton fans excusing it by saying it would have barely made a difference to what happened in games, if that's the case don't do it in the first place you thickos.

Problem with forfeit or ejection is that there's not exactly the time to enact that and deal with appeals etc. before the final, and then if it transpired they've been doing in all year what do other teams have to say as well? Wrexham in 7th may be watching very keenly.

All things considered, I think winding the club up is the best outcome and whoever wrote whatever they pretended to say to Lampard after our game there should be flogged in a public square.

 

[Shannerz]

The punishment for a cynical foul is a yellow card but people still do it and that affects the outcome of the game far more than someone watching a training session.

Is that true?

Teams often work on new set-piece routines, etc.; if an opponent has knowledge of that, they can take steps to counter. That could potentially be a significant advantage

I'm not saying necessarily that Southampton have benefited or won games because of this, nor am I saying they haven't, but if it doesn't convey genuine advantage, why do it?

 

[Ccfcisparks]

I do think its funny how the same people who think Southampton have broken the Geneva Convention talk about Jimmy Hill's cheating to get Sunderland relegated as fun playground hijinks

 

[David O'Day]

I've heard a lot of Southampton fans excusing it by saying it would have barely made a difference to what happened in games, if that's the case don't do it in the first place you thickos.

Problem with forfeit or ejection is that there's not exactly the time to enact that and deal with appeals etc. before the final, and then if it transpired they've been doing in all year what do other teams have to say as well? Wrexham in 7th may be watching very keenly.

All things considered, I think winding the club up is the best outcome and whoever wrote whatever they pretended to say to Lampard after our game there should be flogged in a public square.

The thing is, it's not about the effect it had and more more about the action that was undertaken.

Poor return is not a defence.

 

[ajsccfc]

The thing is, it's not about the effect it had and more more about the action that was undertaken.

Poor return is not a defence.

I've seen justification that as it was a 0-0 draw in the first leg they shouldn't be punished as it didn't work. Fuck's sake. My own fault for reading replies to tweets really isn't it

 

[harvey098]

Is that true?

Teams often work on new set-piece routines, etc.; if an opponent has knowledge of that, they can take steps to counter. That could potentially be a significant advantage

I'm not saying necessarily that Southampton have benefited or won games because of this, nor am I saying they haven't, but if it doesn't convey genuine advantage, why do it?

Obviously it might do but the advantage of watching a training session compared to watching 46 games of how they actually played is not enough for me to kick them out the playoffs. Punishment yes, but not that drastic.
Anyway, I don’t really care but I know how I’d feel as a fan if we won and were kicked out retrospectively because some kit man sat on a hill for 10 minutes. I just don’t see how it effected the outcome enough to change the result.

 

[skybluelee]

I don't think the timescales will allow for them to be kicked out with the appeal that would follow etc.

 

[Skybluedogwood]

I’d need to know that the guy was acting on specific instructions of the club and whether this was a one off or (as now reported) may have happened to other opponents. I’m taking it as a given that the guy knew he was breaching EFL rules given he was apparently caught changing his clothing to try to avoid being identified.
Can’t see them being thrown out as a viable option at this late stage but a points deduction and transfer embargo could be an option that would deter others.

 

[Hobo]

It wouldn't surprise me if Eckert was oblivious to the rules. I know that is not a defence or an excuse.

 

[Sky Blue Harry H]

Hope Hull beat them, as they ought to be weaker than Saints next season, but if Saints win, we'll be better off financially due to their parachute money being distributed (in part) to us. EFL won't kick them out, but think they'll get a points deduction when they're next in the EFL (assuming PL won't impose EFL sanctions?)

 

[Evo1883]

I think they should face a hefty fine around 5 million pound will slightly hit their spending power next season but also deter any other EFL Clubs

 

[RoboCCFC90]

The punishment has to be severe enough to deter others from doing the same in the future. Also, the EFL come under scrutiny if they don't get this punishment right, especially if other clubs come forward with Boro suggesting they believe this has happened to them by Southampton.

Other sports and examples, don't really provide an appropriate, but there are some interesting stories.

 

[Moff]

Its not like its just around the corner. Someone asked/instructed the Analyst to travel a significant distance to spy on the opposition team, knowing this is against the EFL rules.
Not knowing is not a defence.

Its cheating, plain and simple, done to gain an advantage over the opposition and its pretty likely they have been doing it more than this one occasion.

Personally I would kick them out of the playoffs, and I hope the EFL do to, as otherwise clubs will do whatever they can to bend the rules or cheat to get an advantage.

 

[clint van damme]

I do think its funny how the same people who think Southampton have broken the Geneva Convention talk about Jimmy Hill's cheating to get Sunderland relegated as fun playground hijinks

Jimmy Hill didn't break any rules that were in existence at the time, Southampton did

 

[Jay88]

They should be as it's cheating. But I can't see a world where Southampton are not playing in that playoff final. The EFL will bottle it like normal and give them a fine (which won't matter when next season they've got either Premier League TV money or year 2 parachute money).

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Kicking them out is really the only option, any other ourcome just tells teams cheating is allowed for the right price.

 

[Otis]

Jimmy Hill didn't break any rules that were in existence at the time, Southampton did

And there wasn't millions and millions of pounds at stake back then.

Now it is huge, the difference between going up and not going up

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Make all their training sessions from now have to be open to the public and streamed online, with the coaches mic'ed up and broadcast over a PA system.