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Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (59 Viewers)

  • Thread starter BackRoomRummermill
  • Start date Feb 23, 2020
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C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,476
David O'Day said:
So Manchester will get 60 million in another off the cuff Boris u-turn
Click to expand...

like I said they would yesterday (it was politics bullshit)
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,477
Sky Blue Pete said:
There are only medium areas there are no low areas
Click to expand...

low as in when considering lockdowns Pete (mentioned in another message to NW). Will amend to read ‘lower’
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,478
fernandopartridge said:
I'd suggest you read 'The Deficit Myth' by Stephanie Kelton. There is no 'debt' pass down to anybody, that's a myth. The UK government 'borrowing' money solely denominated in £ sterling could 'repay' it all tomorrow.

The government’s not telling the truth about its funding right now, when the simple fact is that QE is paying for everything

As the FT notes this morning: The Bank of England is expected to increase its asset purchase programme by at least £100bn on Thursday in a bid to ensure stability of financial markets at a time of huge government borrowing. Economists are almost unanimous in predicting the bank’s Monetary...
www.taxresearch.org.uk
Click to expand...

Will have a read
 
Reactions: fernandopartridge
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,479
CCFCSteve said:
low as in when considering lockdowns Pete (mentioned in another message to NW).
Click to expand...
But again, that's only because they've rijigged their scales, because they don't want to have a lockdown.

That's not following the science, that's manipulating the statistics.
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer and Ian1779

David O'Day

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,480
Deleted member 5849 said:
But again, that's only because they've rijigged their scales, because they don't want to have a lockdown.

That's not following the science, that's manipulating the statistics.
Click to expand...

aye the lowest places have levels where a month ago they would have been placed under further restrictions
 

David O'Day

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,481

it's going to court
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,482
David O'Day said:

it's going to court
Click to expand...

this will be interesting ! Last week Germany courts overruled the bar curfew restrictions implemented in Berlin saying the science doesn’t back it up
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,483
Deleted member 5849 said:
But again, that's only because they've rijigged their scales, because they don't want to have a lockdown.

That's not following the science, that's manipulating the statistics.
Click to expand...

Agreed. From memory additional restrictions got implemented in Birmingham after going over 100 or 150 per 100,000. This was 10pm curfew non mixing of households. I think Bolton was over 250 when bars were closed (and could only serve takeaways).

my comparison was between very high risk ie Liverpool/Manc, requiring lockdown and closure of hospitality, gyms etc (now looks like around 400-500+) and various areas of the country substantially below that. I’ve said I don’t agree with locking down those other areas yet (and didn’t know why Burnham did either, which upset David )
 

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,484
CCFCSteve said:
low as in when considering lockdowns Pete (mentioned in another message to NW). Will amend to read ‘lower’
Click to expand...
It is interesting though previous to this second wave 20 per 100000 was a cause for concern it’s now not a concern up to 150 or even 170 as in coventry
 
Reactions: Deleted member 5849
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,485
Sky Blue Pete said:
It is interesting though previous to this second wave 20 per 100000 was a cause for concern it’s now not a concern up to 150 or even 170 as in coventry
Click to expand...

Yeah, never understood the 20 per 100000 to be added to UK quarantine list. Looks a bit silly when we’re at current numbers !!

ps think the Cov numbers are a concern, guess they will be moved to Tier two (no household mixing) in coming days if they’ve not been already. It’s all levels as confusing as it might be....I didn’t make the rules
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,486
CCFCSteve said:
my comparison was between very high risk ie Liverpool/Manc, requiring lockdown and closure of hospitality, gyms etc
Click to expand...
Don't speak too soon

Covid-19: Gyms can reopen in Liverpool City Region

They were ordered to close when the area was placed into tier three of the coronavirus restrictions.
www.bbc.co.uk
But it doesn't really matter what the restrictions are if they aren't enforceable.

Police ‘struggling’ to enforce ‘confusing’ three-tier lockdown rules

Boris Johnson urged to clear up muddles – as senior officer says ‘That is what I thought was going to happen 10 days ago’
www.independent.co.uk
Police chiefs say they are “struggling” to enforce the latest Covid-19 restrictions which have brought “greater confusion”.

Progress in aligning the law with guidance has been plunged into reverse by Boris Johnson’s new three-tiered system, the National Police Chiefs’ Council said.

It means that, in tier 2 and 3 areas, the regulations bar people from separate households from meeting in a pub, or other indoor setting – but police guidance still says that is allowed.

“Introducing them in the way that we have done has introduced greater confusion – that’s exactly the crux of the issue here,” admitted Owen Weatherill, from the NPCC, adding: “We are all struggling with that.”

Mr Weatherill revealed the NPCC had pleaded with the government for clearer rules, telling MPs: “That is what I thought was going to happen 10 days ago.”
Click to expand...
 
Reactions: CCFCSteve
K

Kieranp96

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,487
Ian1779 said:
The people getting triggered about Burnham wanting an extra 10/20m are the same people that have essentially glossed over giving 12b to Serco for nothing.

No credibility whatsoever.
Click to expand...
You say that but I just got my covid test results back, that I had done via the NHS a d guess what I entered the # given to me on the track and trace and it worked, it also gave me an alert that my friend tested positive after she got her results back after I spent a little bit of time with her.

Screenshot-20201021-105033-uk-nhs-covid19-production hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot-20201021-105033-uk-nhs-covid19-production hosted in ImgBB
ibb.co

Took 2 days to get the results back. Not bad for a system that doesn't work.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,488
It is a shame Labour have been so shit for such a long time. If they had some decent competition we wouldn't have these inept twats in power now. There needs to be a third fresh option I think.

If there was a general election tomorrow I actually think Boris and his cronies would be in for defeat.
 
Reactions: Kieranp96
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,489
Deleted member 5849 said:
Where have low rates? I just tried Devon and Suffolk (traditionally low rates) and they're heading up to and beyond 50 per 100k... which was a high rate vefore we reclassified!

I can find a small pocket of Somerset that's 24.

OK, it's stabbing randomly, but there aren't exactly many places with a low rate... until the scales have been re-jigged to suit the current narrative.
Click to expand...

When London was leading the infections the whole country had to close. When the North leads them, it should be localised-hmmm
 
Reactions: Sick Boy and Deleted member 5849
K

Kieranp96

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,490
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
It is a shame Labour have been so shit for such a long time. If they had some decent competition we wouldn't have these inept twats in power now. There needs to be a third fresh option I think.

If there was a general election tomorrow I actually think Boris and his cronies would be in for defeat.
Click to expand...
I agree there's noone in labour that's worth shit atm, but disagree I actually think Boris would still stay in.
 
K

Kieranp96

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,491
Brighton Sky Blue said:
When London was leading the infections the whole country had to close. When the North leads them, it should be localised-hmmm
Click to expand...
Not as black and white as that though is it, he's trying not to fuck the country more economicly.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,492
Kieranp96 said:
Not as black and white as that though is it, he's trying not to fuck the country more economicly.
Click to expand...
Then why did we close down when things were better, previously?

What's the plan this time when it gets worse? Why is this time different to last?

What's the exit plan?

When are we following the science?
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,493
Kieranp96 said:
Not as black and white as that though is it, he's trying not to fuck the country more economicly.
Click to expand...

So why did he do it the first time when infections were light in the rest of the country and the virus wasn’t as widespread?
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,494
Kieranp96 said:
I agree there's noone in labour that's worth shit atm, but disagree I actually think Boris would still stay in.
Click to expand...

I’d have Starmer over Boris in an instant
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer, derbyskyblue and Deleted member 5849
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,495
Brighton Sky Blue said:
When London was leading the infections the whole country had to close. When the North leads them, it should be localised-hmmm
Click to expand...

I’d imagine with hindsight, London would’ve gone in and out of lockdown sooner and North later. Who knows though. The fact that we exited at the same time is apparently part of the issue with the Norths virus resurgence

....having said all that the London palladium was open last week, looking busy with mainly higher risk aged people....yet we can’t have (limited capacity) football in an outdoor arena ?!
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,496
Kieranp96 said:
Took 2 days to get the results back. Not bad for a system that doesn't work.
Click to expand...
Back in June there was criticism from SAGE that the effectiveness of track and trace was being hit by a failure to deliver results within 24 hours. Johnson promised that by the end of the month all results would be given within 24 hours.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,497
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
It is a shame Labour have been so shit for such a long time. If they had some decent competition we wouldn't have these inept twats in power now. There needs to be a third fresh option I think.

If there was a general election tomorrow I actually think Boris and his cronies would be in for defeat.
Click to expand...
I don’t agree sadly - Brexit hasn’t been done, and for that alone he will get a free ride, because he’d claim he’s still got a job to do...
 

Skybluefaz

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,498
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
It is a shame Labour have been so shit for such a long time. If they had some decent competition we wouldn't have these inept twats in power now. There needs to be a third fresh option I think.

If there was a general election tomorrow I actually think Boris and his cronies would be in for defeat.
Click to expand...
It would also help if people didn't hoover up the lies from the Tories like a line of Columbia's finest. I think people are starting to see the oven ready shit for what it is now. It is too late for a lot of people unfortunately. Agree to an extent about Labour. They have made it easier than it should have been.
 
Reactions: Brighton Sky Blue
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,499
CCFCSteve said:
I’d imagine with hindsight, London would’ve gone in and out of lockdown sooner and North later. Who knows though. The fact that we exited at the same time is apparently part of the issue with the Norths virus resurgence

....having said all that the London palladium was open last week, looking busy with mainly higher risk aged people....yet we can’t have (limited capacity) football in an outdoor arena ?!
Click to expand...

With hindsight a lockdown of London initially would have made more sense and be a lot easier to enforce tightly. But Boris knows that the North is expendable as the votes he got there aren’t essential
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,500
Brighton Sky Blue said:
I’d have Starmer over Boris in an instant
Click to expand...
Yeah it's a ridiculous thing to say isn't it. Whatever your misgivings over policy, demeanour etc. there's somebody with a proven track record of competence in his career, over a bumbling magalomaniac who doesn't do detail.

The choice is betwen having a vacuous posh boy full of hot air, or not. I'll take the not, thankyou very much.

And that also applies to wanting May, Cameron (through gritted teeth), Hague, Major in there instead. While we're at it, Jeremy Hunt etc. can come above too.

It's a nonsense to say that this is the best option, because it patently isn't.
 
Reactions: djr8369, Sick Boy and Brighton Sky Blue
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,501
Skybluefaz said:
It would also help if people didn't hoover up the lies from the Tories like a line of Columbia's finest.
Click to expand...

favourite sentence (was going to say line) of the day !!!
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,502
Kieranp96 said:
You say that but I just got my covid test results back, that I had done via the NHS a d guess what I entered the # given to me on the track and trace and it worked, it also gave me an alert that my friend tested positive after she got her results back after I spent a little bit of time with her.

Screenshot-20201021-105033-uk-nhs-covid19-production hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot-20201021-105033-uk-nhs-covid19-production hosted in ImgBB
ibb.co

Took 2 days to get the results back. Not bad for a system that doesn't work.
Click to expand...
This is what I mean... the glossing over the fact it’s still a mediocre app at best, has been littered with fuck ups - but obviously still more beneficial to give £12b to a private company than to the people that will end up jobless and homeless.
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,503
Brighton Sky Blue said:
With hindsight a lockdown of London initially would have made more sense and be a lot easier to enforce tightly. But Boris knows that the North is expendable as the votes he got there aren’t essential
Click to expand...

Think they’re probably needed for a majority though. This messy situation with the North is bad for Tories
 

Skybluefaz

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,504
CCFCSteve said:
favourite sentence (was going to say line) of the day !!!
Click to expand...
I could go some today tbf. Think that's why it came out.
 
Reactions: CCFCSteve
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,505
CCFCSteve said:
Think they’re probably needed for a majority though. This messy situation with the North is bad for Tories
Click to expand...
Ah but Brexit, ah but Covid. It's a perfect circle that'll somehow end up without responsibility falling at the feet of those in charge.

Incidentally (and again, ignoring policy) it was refreshing to hear Sturgeon say yesterday that the buck for decisions ultimately stopped with her. That's such an obvious truth it shouldn't need saying, but somehow our prime minister gets to avoid responsibility.
 

Skybluefaz

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,506
Kieranp96 said:
I agree there's noone in labour that's worth shit atm, but disagree I actually think Boris would still stay in.
Click to expand...
Relate more to Jacob Rees-Mogg than you do to Angela Raynor? Prefer Gove's continual shit fest to someone like Jonathon Ashworth?

I don't get it.
 
Reactions: Sick Boy and Ian1779

David O'Day

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,507
Why can't people grasp the basic concept that a short sharp break is better economically than drifting towards most of the country being perpetual tier 3 restrictions.
 
Reactions: djr8369

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,508
Deleted member 5849 said:
Ah but Brexit, ah but Covid. It's a perfect circle that'll somehow end up without responsibility falling at the feet of those in charge.
Click to expand...
It's the only reason I can see for going full steam ahead with Brexit in the middle of a pandemic.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,509
David O'Day said:
Why can't people grasp the basic concept that a short sharp break is better economically than drifting towards most of the country being perpetual tier 3 restrictions.
Click to expand...
Alas, we've missed the slot for a short, sharp one.

Jonathan Van-Tam said:
It is a kind of scientific feature of the effect of a lockdown that, if disease levels are higher when you effect the lockdown, the effect will be less, overall, than if the lockdown is inflicted at a point when disease level is much lower,

I wouldn't expect the same magnitude of effect if it were done now as if it were done early in September or mid-September.
Click to expand...
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 21, 2020
  • #34,510
The level of 'borrowing' is way below what the OBR forecast was to date in any case:

The UK’s national debt has gone down this year, whatever the ONS likes to claim

The ONS has announced another pile of economic news this morning, all of which is framed in a way intended to misrepresent what is actually happening in the economy. Take this chart: Breathless journalists are reporting that UK national borrowing went up by £36 billion last month and has now...
www.taxresearch.org.uk

Why is Sunak closing the Furlough Scheme again?
 
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