Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (31 Viewers)

[David O'Day]

it's going to court

 

---

[CCFCSteve]

it's going to court

this will be interesting ! Last week Germany courts overruled the bar curfew restrictions implemented in Berlin saying the science doesn’t back it up

 

[CCFCSteve]

But again, that's only because they've rijigged their scales, because they don't want to have a lockdown.

That's not following the science, that's manipulating the statistics.

Agreed. From memory additional restrictions got implemented in Birmingham after going over 100 or 150 per 100,000. This was 10pm curfew non mixing of households. I think Bolton was over 250 when bars were closed (and could only serve takeaways).

my comparison was between very high risk ie Liverpool/Manc, requiring lockdown and closure of hospitality, gyms etc (now looks like around 400-500+) and various areas of the country substantially below that. I’ve said I don’t agree with locking down those other areas yet (and didn’t know why Burnham did either, which upset David )

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

low as in when considering lockdowns Pete (mentioned in another message to NW). Will amend to read ‘lower’

It is interesting though previous to this second wave 20 per 100000 was a cause for concern it’s now not a concern up to 150 or even 170 as in coventry

 

[CCFCSteve]

It is interesting though previous to this second wave 20 per 100000 was a cause for concern it’s now not a concern up to 150 or even 170 as in coventry

Yeah, never understood the 20 per 100000 to be added to UK quarantine list. Looks a bit silly when we’re at current numbers !!

ps think the Cov numbers are a concern, guess they will be moved to Tier two (no household mixing) in coming days if they’ve not been already. It’s all levels as confusing as it might be....I didn’t make the rules

 

[chiefdave]

my comparison was between very high risk ie Liverpool/Manc, requiring lockdown and closure of hospitality, gyms etc

Don't speak too soon

Covid-19: Gyms can reopen in Liverpool City Region

They were ordered to close when the area was placed into tier three of the coronavirus restrictions.

www.bbc.co.uk

But it doesn't really matter what the restrictions are if they aren't enforceable.

Police ‘struggling’ to enforce ‘confusing’ three-tier lockdown rules

Boris Johnson urged to clear up muddles – as senior officer says ‘That is what I thought was going to happen 10 days ago’

www.independent.co.uk

Police chiefs say they are “struggling” to enforce the latest Covid-19 restrictions which have brought “greater confusion”.

Progress in aligning the law with guidance has been plunged into reverse by Boris Johnson’s new three-tiered system, the National Police Chiefs’ Council said.

It means that, in tier 2 and 3 areas, the regulations bar people from separate households from meeting in a pub, or other indoor setting – but police guidance still says that is allowed.

“Introducing them in the way that we have done has introduced greater confusion – that’s exactly the crux of the issue here,” admitted Owen Weatherill, from the NPCC, adding: “We are all struggling with that.”

Mr Weatherill revealed the NPCC had pleaded with the government for clearer rules, telling MPs: “That is what I thought was going to happen 10 days ago.”

 

[Kieranp96]

The people getting triggered about Burnham wanting an extra 10/20m are the same people that have essentially glossed over giving 12b to Serco for nothing.

No credibility whatsoever.

You say that but I just got my covid test results back, that I had done via the NHS a d guess what I entered the # given to me on the track and trace and it worked, it also gave me an alert that my friend tested positive after she got her results back after I spent a little bit of time with her.

Screenshot-20201021-105033-uk-nhs-covid19-production hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot-20201021-105033-uk-nhs-covid19-production hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

Took 2 days to get the results back. Not bad for a system that doesn't work.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

It is a shame Labour have been so shit for such a long time. If they had some decent competition we wouldn't have these inept twats in power now. There needs to be a third fresh option I think.

If there was a general election tomorrow I actually think Boris and his cronies would be in for defeat.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Where have low rates? I just tried Devon and Suffolk (traditionally low rates) and they're heading up to and beyond 50 per 100k... which was a high rate vefore we reclassified!

I can find a small pocket of Somerset that's 24.

OK, it's stabbing randomly, but there aren't exactly many places with a low rate... until the scales have been re-jigged to suit the current narrative.

When London was leading the infections the whole country had to close. When the North leads them, it should be localised-hmmm

 

[Kieranp96]

It is a shame Labour have been so shit for such a long time. If they had some decent competition we wouldn't have these inept twats in power now. There needs to be a third fresh option I think.

If there was a general election tomorrow I actually think Boris and his cronies would be in for defeat.

I agree there's noone in labour that's worth shit atm, but disagree I actually think Boris would still stay in.

 

[Kieranp96]

When London was leading the infections the whole country had to close. When the North leads them, it should be localised-hmmm

Not as black and white as that though is it, he's trying not to fuck the country more economicly.

 

[NorthernWisdom]

Not as black and white as that though is it, he's trying not to fuck the country more economicly.

Then why did we close down when things were better, previously?

What's the plan this time when it gets worse? Why is this time different to last?

What's the exit plan?

When are we following the science?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Not as black and white as that though is it, he's trying not to fuck the country more economicly.

So why did he do it the first time when infections were light in the rest of the country and the virus wasn’t as widespread?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I agree there's noone in labour that's worth shit atm, but disagree I actually think Boris would still stay in.

I’d have Starmer over Boris in an instant

 

[CCFCSteve]

When London was leading the infections the whole country had to close. When the North leads them, it should be localised-hmmm

I’d imagine with hindsight, London would’ve gone in and out of lockdown sooner and North later. Who knows though. The fact that we exited at the same time is apparently part of the issue with the Norths virus resurgence

....having said all that the London palladium was open last week, looking busy with mainly higher risk aged people....yet we can’t have (limited capacity) football in an outdoor arena ?!

 

[chiefdave]

Took 2 days to get the results back. Not bad for a system that doesn't work.

Back in June there was criticism from SAGE that the effectiveness of track and trace was being hit by a failure to deliver results within 24 hours. Johnson promised that by the end of the month all results would be given within 24 hours.

 

[Ian1779]

It is a shame Labour have been so shit for such a long time. If they had some decent competition we wouldn't have these inept twats in power now. There needs to be a third fresh option I think.

If there was a general election tomorrow I actually think Boris and his cronies would be in for defeat.

I don’t agree sadly - Brexit hasn’t been done, and for that alone he will get a free ride, because he’d claim he’s still got a job to do...

 

[Skybluefaz]

It is a shame Labour have been so shit for such a long time. If they had some decent competition we wouldn't have these inept twats in power now. There needs to be a third fresh option I think.

If there was a general election tomorrow I actually think Boris and his cronies would be in for defeat.

It would also help if people didn't hoover up the lies from the Tories like a line of Columbia's finest. I think people are starting to see the oven ready shit for what it is now. It is too late for a lot of people unfortunately. Agree to an extent about Labour. They have made it easier than it should have been.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I’d imagine with hindsight, London would’ve gone in and out of lockdown sooner and North later. Who knows though. The fact that we exited at the same time is apparently part of the issue with the Norths virus resurgence

....having said all that the London palladium was open last week, looking busy with mainly higher risk aged people....yet we can’t have (limited capacity) football in an outdoor arena ?!

With hindsight a lockdown of London initially would have made more sense and be a lot easier to enforce tightly. But Boris knows that the North is expendable as the votes he got there aren’t essential

 

[NorthernWisdom]

I’d have Starmer over Boris in an instant

Yeah it's a ridiculous thing to say isn't it. Whatever your misgivings over policy, demeanour etc. there's somebody with a proven track record of competence in his career, over a bumbling magalomaniac who doesn't do detail.

The choice is betwen having a vacuous posh boy full of hot air, or not. I'll take the not, thankyou very much.

And that also applies to wanting May, Cameron (through gritted teeth), Hague, Major in there instead. While we're at it, Jeremy Hunt etc. can come above too.

It's a nonsense to say that this is the best option, because it patently isn't.

 

[CCFCSteve]

It would also help if people didn't hoover up the lies from the Tories like a line of Columbia's finest.

favourite sentence (was going to say line) of the day !!!

 

[Ian1779]

You say that but I just got my covid test results back, that I had done via the NHS a d guess what I entered the # given to me on the track and trace and it worked, it also gave me an alert that my friend tested positive after she got her results back after I spent a little bit of time with her.

Screenshot-20201021-105033-uk-nhs-covid19-production hosted at ImgBB

Image Screenshot-20201021-105033-uk-nhs-covid19-production hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

Took 2 days to get the results back. Not bad for a system that doesn't work.

This is what I mean... the glossing over the fact it’s still a mediocre app at best, has been littered with fuck ups - but obviously still more beneficial to give £12b to a private company than to the people that will end up jobless and homeless.

 

[CCFCSteve]

With hindsight a lockdown of London initially would have made more sense and be a lot easier to enforce tightly. But Boris knows that the North is expendable as the votes he got there aren’t essential

Think they’re probably needed for a majority though. This messy situation with the North is bad for Tories

 

[Skybluefaz]

favourite sentence (was going to say line) of the day !!!

I could go some today tbf. Think that's why it came out.

 

[NorthernWisdom]

Think they’re probably needed for a majority though. This messy situation with the North is bad for Tories

Ah but Brexit, ah but Covid. It's a perfect circle that'll somehow end up without responsibility falling at the feet of those in charge.

Incidentally (and again, ignoring policy) it was refreshing to hear Sturgeon say yesterday that the buck for decisions ultimately stopped with her. That's such an obvious truth it shouldn't need saying, but somehow our prime minister gets to avoid responsibility.

 

[Skybluefaz]

I agree there's noone in labour that's worth shit atm, but disagree I actually think Boris would still stay in.

Relate more to Jacob Rees-Mogg than you do to Angela Raynor? Prefer Gove's continual shit fest to someone like Jonathon Ashworth?

I don't get it.

 

[David O'Day]

Why can't people grasp the basic concept that a short sharp break is better economically than drifting towards most of the country being perpetual tier 3 restrictions.

 

[chiefdave]

Ah but Brexit, ah but Covid. It's a perfect circle that'll somehow end up without responsibility falling at the feet of those in charge.

It's the only reason I can see for going full steam ahead with Brexit in the middle of a pandemic.

 

[NorthernWisdom]

Why can't people grasp the basic concept that a short sharp break is better economically than drifting towards most of the country being perpetual tier 3 restrictions.

Alas, we've missed the slot for a short, sharp one.

It is a kind of scientific feature of the effect of a lockdown that, if disease levels are higher when you effect the lockdown, the effect will be less, overall, than if the lockdown is inflicted at a point when disease level is much lower,

I wouldn't expect the same magnitude of effect if it were done now as if it were done early in September or mid-September.

 

[fernandopartridge]

The level of 'borrowing' is way below what the OBR forecast was to date in any case:

The UK’s national debt has gone down this year, whatever the ONS likes to claim

The ONS has announced another pile of economic news this morning, all of which is framed in a way intended to misrepresent what is actually happening in the economy. Take this chart: Breathless journalists are reporting that UK national borrowing went up by £36 billion last month and has now...

www.taxresearch.org.uk

Why is Sunak closing the Furlough Scheme again?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Think they’re probably needed for a majority though. This messy situation with the North is bad for Tories

Nah they’ll just find some fresh meat to con into voting against their own interests

 

[chiefdave]

China, the first country to see an outbreak of coronavirus, is beginning to see the roll out of its emergency Covid-19 vaccine to members of the public ahead of the winter months.

It’s big news today in the country that the city of Shaoxing in eastern Zhejiang province, which has a population of around five million people, is now allowing non-priority groups to apply online for a Covid-19 vaccine.

They must be aged 18-59, and the vaccine is being priced at an affordable 200 yuan (£23; $30) per dose. There is an additional inoculation fee of 28 yuan.

Earlier this week, other cities in Zhejiang including Yiwu and Jiaxing unveiled plans for local residents to receive vaccinations. However, state media stress that these systems are being carefully managed to prioritise high-risk groups.

Wonder what they're injecting people with?

 

[shmmeee]

Good news everyone!

The graphs are back! Let’s party like it’s April 2020!

 

[shmmeee]

Also sorry @CCFCSteve for starting off a debate about macroeconomic theory then not coming back. But basically @fernandopartridge has the same views as me when it comes to govt spending so happy to leave him to it

 

[ajsccfc]