USSR invades Ukraine. (12 Viewers)

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P

PVA

Well-Known Member
Not long till Putin and Trump throw Ukraine under the bus more like.

Temporary ceasefire, give Russia some of Ukraine, let them rearm and come back for the rest in a few years.

Such peace.
 
shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
It’s just many comments have been made that ‘compromises’ must be made, yet few seem to say what compromises Russia needs to make when it is the one responsible for the conflict.
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SB has been team Russia from day one so not surprising he backs capitulation now.
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
shmmeee said:
SB has been team Russia from day one so not surprising he backs capitulation now.
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Might makes right. Russia is bigger than Ukraine so clearly Ukraine should hand over its land. Israel is bigger than Palestine so clearly Palestine should let itself be annexed.

Is it too late for Britain to have its empire back?
 
Sick Boy

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
shmmeee said:
SB has been team Russia from day one so not surprising he backs capitulation now.
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I've wanted the war to be stopped ASAP. Ideally, with Putin brought to face justice, but we all know that's unlikely to happen.
The idea that I am "Team Russia" is just ridiculous.
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
Sick Boy said:
I've wanted the war to be stopped ASAP. Ideally, with Putin brought to face justice, but we all know that's unlikely to happen.
The idea that I am "Team Russia" is just ridiculous.
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What should happen is a full Russian withdrawal, a full payment of reparations by Russia and Putin himself should be hanging in The Hague.

What I’d accept is rump Ukraine being allowed into NATO. Putin gets to keep his stolen land, avoid punishment for his crimes and his country doesn’t have to pay the bill for the destruction it caused. All he has to compromise on is NATO membership.

Yet even that is seen as ‘unreasonable’.
 
Sick Boy

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
Brighton Sky Blue said:
What should happen is a full Russian withdrawal, a full payment of reparations by Russia and Putin himself should be hanging in The Hague.

What I’d accept is rump Ukraine being allowed into NATO. Putin gets to keep his stolen land, avoid punishment for his crimes and his country doesn’t have to pay the bill for the destruction it caused. All he has to compromise on is NATO membership.

Yet even that is seen as ‘unreasonable’.
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It's not going to happen. What is more likely is that Russia will keep the land is currently occupies and there will be some security guarantee for Ukraine, while both Russia and the USA will benefit economically from the rebuilding that will happen and other wider opportunities that Trump will inevitably want to exploit for the USA's gain.
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
Sick Boy said:
It's not going to happen. What is more likely is that Russia will keep the land is currently occupies and there will be some security guarantee for Ukraine, while both Russia and the USA will benefit economically from the rebuilding that will happen and other wider opportunities that Trump will inevitably want to exploit for the USA's gain.
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So Russia makes no compromises?
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
Sick Boy said:
What are you expecting to happen?
The West did nothing when part of Ukraine was annexed in 2014 and when a passenger plane was shot down - it was business as usual and it will be the same again in a couple of years.
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Why are you hiding behind the actions of ‘The West’? You seem quite comfortable making suggestions about what should be done with Israel, which ‘The West’ has consistently backed for much longer?
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
Sick Boy said:
What are you expecting to happen?
The West did nothing when part of Ukraine was annexed in 2014 and when a passenger plane was shot down - it was business as usual and it will be the same again in a couple of years.
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What I expect to happen and what I think should happen are clearly not the same.
 
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Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Mcbean

Mcbean

Well-Known Member
Do you think Putin speaks English ? Only takes a old skool translator to fuck something Trump says up or make a decision for their leader
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
Mcbean said:
Do you think Putin speaks English ? Only takes a old skool translator to fuck something Trump says up or make a decision for their leader
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He does speak English, but very rarely in public.

The scenario you’re describing is why both sides usually bring their own translators, although somewhat incredibly Trump’s top negotiator Steve Witkoff didn’t think to do this when he first met Putin.
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
SBT said:
He does speak English, but very rarely in public.

The scenario you’re describing is why both sides usually bring their own translators, although somewhat incredibly Trump’s top negotiator Steve Witkoff didn’t think to do this when he first met Putin.
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No need. Trump speaks better Russian than Putin, believe me.
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
Mcbean said:
Do you think Putin speaks English ? Only takes a old skool translator to fuck something Trump says up or make a decision for their leader
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He does, and as @SBT says Witkoff went to meet Putin without his own translator which is mind bogglingly fucking stupid:

"An embarrassing translation error is fuelling concerns in Europe over Trump’s ability to negotiate an outcome with Putin that protects European sovereignty, as Putin demands formal control of at least four regions of eastern Ukraine.

German newspaper Bild reported that Trump’s special envoy, former New York property developer Steve Witkoff, misunderstood Putin’s goals during a meeting in Moscow last week.

Bild reported that Witkoff thought Russia was proposing its “peaceful withdrawal” from Kherson and Zaporizhzhia when he was instead demanding the withdrawal of Ukrainian forces from those regions."
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Now it looks like Trump is going to do the same thing:


Going into Friday’s meeting, she advised Mr Trump to keep his guard up and take a translator with him, lest he fall for the former KGB operative’s linguistic tricks.

“Trump doesn’t speak a lick of Russian,” she said. “The issue there is that Putin is always going to be one step ahead, because Putin’s English is certainly good enough to follow.

“You really need to be paying attention to this guy, how he holds himself when he says things, because he plays all these body language tricks as well.”

When world leaders speak behind closed doors, they conventionally bring their own interpreters.

Steve Witkoff, Mr Trump’s special envoy broke with convention in May when he relied on Russian translators during three high-level meetings with Putin, running the risk that some of the nuance in the Russian leader’s comments was lost in translation.

Ms Hill warned that without a fluent Russian speaker in the room, the president risks being secretly mocked by his counterpart.
“He does make fun of Trump. He uses the Russian language in a way that can be quite sarcastic and ironic. It’s totally lost in translation. I would have someone there telling (Trump) what this guy is saying and how he’s saying it.”

Ms Hill, a British Kremlin watcher and senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, said solo negotiations will “limit” what progress can be made on a ceasefire deal as “Trump isn’t going to have total recall”.

“Who knows what will have been discussed. Only Putin will probably have a good idea,” she said. “His team of people, they’ll be sure to have someone taking notes. That’s what the Russian interpreters do, they take notes at the same time.”
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B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
PVA said:
He does, and as @SBT says Witkoff went to meet Putin without his own translator which is mind bogglingly fucking stupid:





Now it looks like Trump is going to do the same thing:
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At this point his best bet would be to have someone in the room who the Russians think can't speak the language but is actually fluent
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
At this point his best bet would be to have someone in the room who the Russians think can't speak the language but is actually fluent
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Yeah, that's not going to happen.

The fact that a real estate developer has been the main main for discussions with Russia so far says all we need to know.

But here's some more:


No experts in the room: Donald Trump to meet Vladimir Putin after loss of Russia specialists​

Reduction in federal workforce has hollowed out the number of knowledgeable officials in Washington
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Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Might makes right. Russia is bigger than Ukraine so clearly Ukraine should hand over its land. Israel is bigger than Palestine so clearly Palestine should let itself be annexed.

Is it too late for Britain to have its empire back?
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