The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (12 Viewers)

[NorthernWisdom]

I mean, what I could do is a quantitative coding exercise of posts, to see which words and tags crop up most...

But then, I'd have to drink laudanum during and afterwards.

 

---

[skybluetony176]

 

[Astute]

I've read some nonsense on here but fuck me!! At least it's not normally as long winded!

And surprise surprise that bad smell that follows me agrees with you. Like I said he doesn't like being pulled up for being wrong just like those who agree with you here. I could have predicted who would.

I suppose you all think you can change the world by changing the history of what has happened.

 

[skybluetony176]

We were also told that predictions about ripping up workers rights was project fear. Let's keep an eye on that one.

Nothing to see here

Business secretary confirms post-Brexit review of UK workers' rights

Kwasi Kwarteng says his department is examining EU protections but insists they will not be watered down

www.google.co.uk

 

[Astute]

Just so I know in the future, how do I show somebody ignoring something...?

Is that like last week where you made up a supposed quote from me saying I was for Brexit and didn't reply when I said show the quote? And now you make out you can't see my posts

Don't worry. Will leave you all to it. I am happy in the knowledge of calling nearly all of it right including a last second deal. After all the allegations against me not one came with evidence.

26 more paydays and I move full time to an EU country. 2 years 1 month 3 weeks 6 days to retirement. Will be near two airports so will frequently get my football fix. About all I will miss from the UK other than Branston beans and pickle, Heinz salad cream and extra mature cheddar cheese. Oh yes and Bonio's for my dogs

Vive la France

 

[NorthernWisdom]

Is that like last week where you made up a supposed quote from me saying I was for Brexit and didn't reply when I said show the quote? And now you make out you can't see my posts

Don't worry. Will leave you all to it. I am happy in the knowledge of calling nearly all of it right including a last second deal. After all the allegations against me not one came with evidence.

Have you considered running for President of the USA?

 

[fernandopartridge]

Nice work Kier

 

[NorthernWisdom]

I want out of the EU. And there are many reasons why. The economists say we will be in trouble if we leave. Would anyone be surprised if they got it wrong again? After all they are more interested in their own interests than ours.

Anybody, btw, who thinks quoting somebody *which places a link to the original quote for somebody to check* is making up a quote has a serious case of bleating fake news.

I'd naively assumed you'd gone back and deleted it but nope, still there... then you doubled down on it, in case there was doubt!

The main reason I am voting leave is for my younger children.

 

[skybluetony176]

Anybody, btw, who thinks quoting somebody *which places a link to the original quote for somebody to check* is making up a quote has a serious case of bleating fake news.

I'd naively assumed you'd gone back and deleted it but nope, still there... then you doubled down on it, in case there was doubt!

A case of shouting heads and tails in a coin toss then claiming you were right all along.

 

[SBAndy]

Nothing to see here

Business secretary confirms post-Brexit review of UK workers' rights

Kwasi Kwarteng says his department is examining EU protections but insists they will not be watered down

www.google.co.uk

‘Asked about his role in Britannia Unchained, a 2012 collection of essays by then Tory backbenchers calling for reduced worker protections, Kwarteng told the committee that was “a long time ago”.’

 

[clint van damme]

‘Asked about his role in Britannia Unchained, a 2012 collection of essays by then Tory backbenchers calling for reduced worker protections, Kwarteng told the committee that was “a long time ago”.’

Though still happy to try and pin stuff in the last Labour government which was even longer ago!

 

[Sbarcher]

Listened to a radio piece this morning about on line deliveries from couriers. If you buy goods from the EU and have them delivered, the courier will charge you the VAT from the country of origin plus an import duty (0-20%) plus their admin charge. One lady was asked to pay an extra £82 on her item when the courier knocked on her door. Good job we have no barriers and tariffs.

 

[Skybluefaz]

They all knew what they were voting for...

 

[skybluetony176]

Nice work Kier

I see Roger Daltrey is crying into his sovereignty.

From this

The Who's Roger Daltrey says Brexit won't affect British musicians: "As if we didn't tour Europe before the f****** EU"

The frontman, who has previously defended his pro-Brexit views, was asked whether Brexit would be 'bad for British rock music'.

www.nme.com

To this

Top musicians hit out at Brexit deal over impact on touring

Sting, Liam Gallagher and Queen’s Brian May were also among the signatories of the letter

www.google.co.uk

 

[clint van damme]

I see Roger Daltrey is crying into his sovereignty.

From this

The Who's Roger Daltrey says Brexit won't affect British musicians: "As if we didn't tour Europe before the f****** EU"

The frontman, who has previously defended his pro-Brexit views, was asked whether Brexit would be 'bad for British rock music'.

www.nme.com

To this

Top musicians hit out at Brexit deal over impact on touring

Sting, Liam Gallagher and Queen’s Brian May were also among the signatories of the letter

www.google.co.uk

Music industry was offered an exemption as well - the Tories said no.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Music industry was offered an exemption as well - the Tories said no.

He won't get fooled again!

 

[Skybluefaz]

He won't get fooled again!

I don't think they should ever play that again. From my brothers review a couple of years ago they probably shouldn't play again full stop

 

[skybluetony176]

He won't get fooled again!

Apparently the offer had to be reciprocal for EU musicians traveling and performing
but the Tories decided that wouldn’t be taking back control of our borders. That’s how petty it’s got.

 

[hill83]

Anybody, btw, who thinks quoting somebody *which places a link to the original quote for somebody to check* is making up a quote has a serious case of bleating fake news.

I'd naively assumed you'd gone back and deleted it but nope, still there... then you doubled down on it, in case there was doubt!

The bloke is consistently wrong. It’s almost like he’s on a wind up but I don’t actually think he is. He was even on about how as he’s usually right in arguments with his wife she doesn’t argue with him anymore the other week. Lovely stuff.

 

[tisza]

About all I will miss from the UK other than Branston beans and pickle, Heinz salad cream and extra mature cheddar cheese. Oh yes and Bonio's for my dogs

You can get all those things still
We have plenty of British stores over here in the EU. Never without my Coleman's mustard, branston pickle and most importantly PG Tips My girls addicted to Cadburys Dairy Milk.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Listened to a radio piece this morning about on line deliveries from couriers. If you buy goods from the EU and have them delivered, the courier will charge you the VAT from the country of origin plus an import duty (0-20%) plus their admin charge. One lady was asked to pay an extra £82 on her item when the courier knocked on her door. Good job we have no barriers and tariffs.

The industry is adapting to the requirement ‘statement of origin’. In practice, lots of goods should be zero tariff, but without proof of the goods origin, you cannot claim 0-rated tariffs.

When buying abroad, you don’t pay that country’s VAT on the goods. So that should be expected as a minimum.

Industry and consumers alike will adapt.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

The industry is adapting to the requirement ‘statement of origin’. In practice, lots of goods should be zero tariff, but without proof of the goods origin, you cannot claim 0-rated tariffs.

When buying abroad, you don’t pay that country’s VAT on the goods. So that should be expected as a minimum.

Industry and consumers alike will adapt.

By 'adapt' I assume you mean pay more and eventually forget they used to pay a lot less.

 

[tisza]

Now Govt here wants to buy the Russian vaccine.
Less 50% of Hungarians are prepared to take a vaccine as can't guarantee which one they would get. Around 1 % would be prepared to take the Chinese (already purchased a million doses) and 7 % the Russian one.
Vaccine purchases being linked to large capital investments from Russian and Chinese Govts in infrastructure projects and current Govt deliberately trying to show its independence from EU.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Music industry was offered an exemption as well - the Tories said no.

Not quite Clint. Again, sounds like six of one and half a dozen of the other.

UK ministers reject calls for visa-free EU tours for musicians

Culture minister Caroline Dinenage said “taking back control” of Britain’s borders must come first

mixmag.net

looks like the EU didn’t want musicians on the permitted list of short term business activities, due to the whole ending of freedom of movement argument

ps I was thinking though, as there’s 6 month visa free travel for EU citizens, a DJ for example could still pop over without anyone being any the wiser

 

[skybluetony176]

ps I was thinking though, as there’s 6 month visa free travel for EU citizens, a DJ for example could still pop over without anyone being any the wiser

Unless they’ve had the Covid vaccine. In which case Bill Gates is tracking the DJ’s movement for the lesbian vegan libtard woke deep state Antifa BLM communist lefty elite vampire movement. Obviously

 

[clint van damme]

Not quite Clint. Again, sounds like six of one and half a dozen of the other.

UK ministers reject calls for visa-free EU tours for musicians

Culture minister Caroline Dinenage said “taking back control” of Britain’s borders must come first

mixmag.net

looks like the EU didn’t want musicians on the permitted list of short term business activities, due to the whole ending of freedom of movement argument

ps I was thinking though, as there’s 6 month visa free travel for EU citizens, a DJ for example could still pop over without anyone being any the wiser

Only not quite if you believe a Tory minister.
I find not believing them as my default position serves me well.
Not that the EU are a bastion of truth but their claim that 'the counter proposal put forward by Johnson wasn't fit for purpose' sounds entirely plausible.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

By 'adapt' I assume you mean pay more and eventually forget they used to pay a lot less.

You assume wrong.

Every purchase we make, there’s VAT. Being in the EU doesn’t change that. Before, you could buy from Germany, pay German VAT and goods would be delivered as if it was bought from a domestic market (with UK VAT). Post-Brexit, EU sellers should sell goods without VAT now (likewise with UK sellers to EU).

The specific issue a lot of logistics companies are facing are around the rules of origin of goods. This is because to have zero tariffs on trade you ‘claim’ preference. Right now, a lot goods which should be zero-rated are having extra duties applied (2-12%) which is also also has VAT added.

Tbf, the admin/handling fees are nominal for where I work. But the industry can take the piss and charge £25-40 for a consignment.

 

[skybluetony176]

You assume wrong.

Every purchase we make, there’s VAT. Being in the EU doesn’t change that. Before, you could buy from Germany, pay German VAT and goods would be delivered as if it was bought from a domestic market (with UK VAT). Post-Brexit, EU sellers should sell goods without VAT now (likewise with UK sellers to EU).

The specific issue a lot of logistics companies are facing are around the rules of origin of goods. This is because to have zero tariffs on trade you ‘claim’ preference. Right now, a lot goods which should be zero-rated are having extra duties applied (2-12%) which is also also has VAT added.

Tbf, the admin/handling fees are nominal for where I work. But the industry can take the piss and charge £25-40 for a consignment.

You don’t charge VAT on sales between EU countries. Never have.
You’ll pay it now on entry in either direction at port unless you defer it through the IPR scheme if you’re registered and VAT registered, otherwise you’ll have to claim it back at the end of your VAT quarter so long as the goods were imported for resale. Import and export declarations are a different matter and depends on the incoterms you’re either importing and exporting under. Declarations cost between £25 and £40 in my experience depending on the carrier. Sometimes it’s a hidden cost and included in the general term of shipping costs (was always typical for exports pre Brexit outside the EU).

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

You don’t charge VAT on sales between EU countries. Never have.
You’ll pay it now on entry in either direction at port unless you defer it through the IPR scheme if you’re registered and VAT registered, otherwise you’ll have to claim it back at the end of your VAT quarter so long as the goods were imported for resale. Import and export declarations are a different matter and depends on the incoterms you’re either importing and exporting under. Declarations cost between £25 and £40 in my experience depending on the carrier. Sometimes it’s a hidden cost and included in the general term of shipping costs (was always typical for exports pre Brexit outside the EU).

Yes you did, as it’s built into the sale of the goods. Again, both the EU and UK are building schemes to account for VAT at the point of sale to streamline the customs processes. It’s mutually beneficial, but not something achievable overnight.

Now, EU sellers do not need to build that cost at the point of sale to UK consumers, and vice versa. E.g. £100 to the UK consumer should be sold at £80 to the EU consumer and customs collect the VAT and other duties applicable.

Since you know incoterms, a lot of companies on are using DDP, both sides of the channel. To streamline the customs process and deliver a better consumer experience. Since consumers probably don’t fancy being hit with a D&Ts bill.

The company I work for charges £5 per declaration. Most freight forwarders have really manual process - UPS literally have hundreds of people to manually fill in declaration.

Markets will adapt, Government systems will improve and we won’t stop trade with the EU. Meanwhile, hopefully we develop a trade policy which expands free trade.

 

[skybluetony176]

Yes you did, as it’s built into the sale of the goods. Again, both the EU and UK are building schemes to account for VAT at the point of sale to streamline the customs processes. It’s mutually beneficial, but not something achievable overnight.

Now, EU sellers do not need to build that cost at the point of sale to UK consumers, and vice versa. E.g. £100 to the UK consumer should be sold at £80 to the EU consumer and customs collect the VAT and other duties applicable.

Since you know incoterms, a lot of companies on are using DDP, both sides of the channel. To streamline the customs process and deliver a better consumer experience. Since consumers probably don’t fancy being hit with a D&Ts bill.

The company I work for charges £5 per declaration. Most freight forwarders have really manual process - UPS literally have hundreds of people to manually fill in declaration.

Markets will adapt, Government systems will improve and we won’t stop trade with the EU. Meanwhile, hopefully we develop a trade policy which expands free trade.

If it’s a commercial transaction you didn’t. Are you talking about a transaction as a consumer? In which case you would have paid VAT at source. At the moment consumers seem to be paying VAT twice, first at source and then at entry. For commercial transaction the process has changed with VAT being paid at entry which as I say you can either defer as part of the IPR scheme or claim back at the end of the VAT quarter and the import/export declaration. This is the same process you have to do for the rest of the world on commercial transaction but never had to do with EU countries.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

If it’s a commercial transaction you didn’t. Are you talking about a transaction as a consumer? In which case you would have paid VAT at source. At the moment consumers seem to be paying VAT twice, first at source and then at entry. For commercial transaction the process has changed with VAT being paid at entry which as I say you can either defer as part of the IPR scheme or claim back at the end of the VAT quarter and the import/export declaration. This is the same process you have to do for the rest of the world on commercial transaction but never had to do with EU countries.

In the specific example I replied to was based on B2C movements. Yes, there is a risk of double taxation. But, that isn’t the clearance agent’s fault. Sellers on either side of the channel need to make sure they’re providing the correct incoterms or zero-VAT their goods at sale.

Postponed VAT accounting is also still available - businesses just need to provide their EORI numbers.

On one hand, loss of frictionless trade with the EU is a shame and will undoubtedly have a short term economic impact. Longer term, there is the opportunity to reduce trade barriers with other markets.

Brexit is having an impact on the EU, particularly Ireland, as well as the UK.

 

[shmmeee]

In the specific example I replied to was based on B2C movements. Yes, there is a risk of double taxation. But, that isn’t the clearance agent’s fault. Sellers on either side of the channel need to make sure they’re providing the correct incoterms or zero-VAT their goods at sale.

Postponed VAT accounting is also still available - businesses just need to provide their EORI numbers.

On one hand, loss of frictionless trade with the EU is a shame and will undoubtedly have a short term economic impact. Longer term, there is the opportunity to reduce trade barriers with other markets.

Brexit is having an impact on the EU, particularly Ireland, as well as the UK.

Yay? People in other countries lives are made worse too??

We will always trade more with our closest neighbours. No amount of trade deals will change that. The impact of other trade can never outweigh EU trade, no serious economist thinks that’s the case.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Yay? People in other countries lives are made worse too??

We will always trade more with our closest neighbours. No amount of trade deals will change that. The impact of other trade can never outweigh EU trade, no serious economist thinks that’s the case.

7 of our top 15 trading partners are outside the EU and the EU makes up 43% of our exports. That’s dropped about 17% from 1999. That’s without accounting for EU enlargement in the same period. By your logic, that number couldn’t possibly go down.

I didn’t vote for Brexit. But, in the 21st century, with globalisation, technological advancements. The world economy is moving away from Europe and the USA in general... there’s opportunities for the UK to grow.

You’ve mischaracterised my point entirely. Which was that both sides will eventually change to new changes despite the initial challenges Brexit poses.

 

[fernandopartridge]

7 of our top 15 trading partners are outside the EU and the EU makes up 43% of our exports. That’s dropped about 17% from 1999. That’s without accounting for EU enlargement in the same period. By your logic, that number couldn’t possibly go down.

I didn’t vote for Brexit. But, in the 21st century, with globalisation, technological advancements. The world economy is moving away from Europe and the USA in general... there’s opportunities for the UK to grow.

You’ve mischaracterised my point entirely. Which was that both sides will eventually change to new changes despite the initial challenges Brexit poses.

Yes but leaving the EU didn't mean that we had to go down the ridiculous path we have. The lunatics have made Brexit to be only the hardest self punishment possible. Stupid stupid wankers. "Only 43%" of our trade as if it is a trivial number. For many sectors they export exclusively to the EU, they're all fucked.

 

[shmmeee]

7 of our top 15 trading partners are outside the EU and the EU makes up 43% of our exports. That’s dropped about 17% from 1999. That’s without accounting for EU enlargement in the same period. By your logic, that number couldn’t possibly go down.

I didn’t vote for Brexit. But, in the 21st century, with globalisation, technological advancements. The world economy is moving away from Europe and the USA in general... there’s opportunities for the UK to grow.

You’ve mischaracterised my point entirely. Which was that both sides will eventually change to new changes despite the initial challenges Brexit poses.

Yes things will change. Stuff will cost more. That’s the “change” thats “people adapting”. Just calling it change and adaptation doesn’t change that. Stop avoiding that point. You aren’t a politician. Why do you think every nation on earth is working to reduce trade barriers especially to their neighbours?

Ive not mischaracterised your point, you don’t understand it yourself. You’re just spouting vague nonsense in hope.

same with “growth” “advancements”. It’s just bollocks. I don’t know if you’re just parroting something you’ve heard or genuinely believe it but it’s the words of charlatans.

Globalisation doesn’t change how long it takes to move things across the world FFS. Time sensitive stuff will always be better closer and it will always cost both in finance, time and global warming to ship shit across the planet. We are some way from teleportation even in the 21st century.

Again, no serious economist believes the crap you’re spouting. It fairytale nonsense told to people who don’t know better to make them feel better. Like Santa for kids.

“oh only half our trade”

“smaller things are growing more than the large well developed relationship. Iamverysmartbutclearlydontunderstandthedifferencebetweengrowthandabsolutesize”

Fuck me I can’t believe people are still saying this shit with a straight face.