PUSB-We_are_going_up
Well-Known Member
The only words I have is:
What is the point
What is the point
Racist remark towards a coventry player (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Evo1883
- Start date
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
What is what point?
PUSB-We_are_going_up
Well-Known Member
In making a racist remark its a game
Jamesimus
Well-Known Member
But it's also not racism. And is completely incomparable.
fatso
Well-Known Member
Common misconceptions abound in this whole debate, the taking of the knee for example is seen by those clubs that do it as being a non political gesture of solidarity and support for the E.D. population and also a rejection of racism and intolerance in all its forms.
And yet the same gesture is often seen as overt support for a far left marxists political organisation that wishes (amongst other things) to de-fund the police and attack the state.
I'm 100% certain that many who boo the gesture, do so as they resent the gesture as being in support of the political agenda of the BLM political movement. (And no doubt some will do it purely because they are hate filled racist cunts) it's just a pity (imho) that a different gesture wasnt chosen, if it was, then there would be no logical reason to boo it, unless of course you were a complete racist!
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
There'd be a reason to boo whatever gesture was used, and frankly anyone who decides to boo it is ignorant, stupid, or racist. it's been explained enough why it's being done, and the person who originated its use has explained it enough, too. Perhaps those self same people could listen to the people who do it, why they do it, and stop looking for excuses. Of course if they choose not to do that, then those people are exactly why it needs to continue.
Skybluefaz
Well-Known Member
The idea that the Millwall neanderthals and others are motivated to boo because of political symbolism and opposition to Marxism is for the birds. It's an excuse. There will never be an acceptable gesture to these people.
fatso
Well-Known Member
I'd agree with that if it were only Millwall fans that were doing it.
GaryMabbuttsLeftKnee
Well-Known Member
I can’t relate to how you feel on a personal level, nor would I ever pretend I could, but my Mrs is half Indian, and therefore my daughter 1/4. She doesn’t look half and my daughter is white so I guess people don’t have that “I should be careful what I say in front of him” feel.
I’ve been left absolutely raging internally a handful of times when one bloke who occasionally comes with us who is a “friend of a friend”, and is definitely part of the old school “legion” mentality has used the term p*** casually in conversation. Each time it hits me personally despite not obviously being the person being abused, and then I get the guilt that I should have fucking said something. But at the same time, what’s me saying anything gonna do? Ruin the match day experience for loads of friends and family. Cause a huge divide which makes going to games difficult. End up in a scrap with a bloke nearly twice my age. He’s not gonna learn or listen. I don’t know what the “right” thing to do is, but whenever I’m in his presence it is constantly on my mind. People need to be fucking better.
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Esoterica
Well-Known Member
It's not 'seen by those clubs as being a non political gesture'. It IS a non political gesture. They've literally come out and explained why they are doing it. Anyone still booing it is a either a fucking idiot or racist or probably, both. Anyone still booing it after all the explanations made by the players as to why they are doing it should be banned for life, they might as well be monkey chanting during it.
BornSlippySkyBlue
Well-Known Member
I can’t believe people actually do that. Fucking idiots.
Jamesimus
Well-Known Member
Similar situation to you; you feel like you owe it to your family and friends and realistically you do, it's the least you can do (not that I'm trying to make you feel guilty at all, please don't think that - I understand some situations are difficult!), but no one is perfect.
Otis
Well-Known Member
I saw Holding talking about it and he was brilliant. I agreed with every single word an he put it across so well.
Thought Clinton Morrison was bang on about the taking of the knee last night too. On Quest. He was talking about Gary Rowett's inability to condemn those who boo.
Spot on.
Dog
Well-Known Member
Highly relevant but we need to move on. You don't get anywhere standing still. Taking the knee has brought racism into the spotlight. Keep taking the knee just keeps it in the spotlight. It doesn't stop it.
Instant ban for racism. Face and name in local papers. Stop pussyfooting about. Straight to court. Make the idiots realise that we are all equal. Sanctions for clubs that don't come down hard on racism and racists. Undercover people policing the rules so nobody knows who they are standing near. Wouldn't take long before the message got across.
fatso
Well-Known Member
And yet it still goes on. And ironically the gesture used to promote tolerance is actually starting to be divisive (as your language used perfectly demonstrates)
Personally I'd just like anyone heard or seen making racist remarks or gestures immediately dealt with by the police and banned, which it appears is what is happening at Blackpool. (Hopefully)
In fact I'd like the ref to immediately stop a game when racism is heard and the police/steward given the chance to identify the culprit and arrest them during the game.
For example, if Dabo heard the remarks made to him, he should be able to call over the ref/4th official and have the game stopped while its dealt with.
I'm sure the right minded fans wouldn't hesitate to identify the culprit.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Players will keep taking the knee and will continue to do so the longer people continue to boo. It's not rocket science.
If fans boo and the players stop taking the knee, the racists have won.
Players and clubs have explained clearly and with great detail, how taking the knee is NOT a political stance. They could not be any clearer.
We need to accept the reasons the players are doing it. Racism is still rife.
If fans boo and the players stop taking the knee, the racists have won.
Players and clubs have explained clearly and with great detail, how taking the knee is NOT a political stance. They could not be any clearer.
We need to accept the reasons the players are doing it. Racism is still rife.
NorthernWisdom
Well-Known Member
Because people choose not to accept the anti racist gesture, nod in agreement that racism is bad, and continue with their lives.
It wouldn't be divisive if people accepted its message!
Hutch11
Well-Known Member
We of an older age have seen racism at it's worse
What I am encouraged by is the younger generation are becoming more and more less tolerant of any form of discrimination
That's the only way it's going to stop , these youngsters educate their kids the right way , that it's disgusting.
We never had that
It's a slow process and probably won't happen in my lifetime but with this youth there's a chance
What I am encouraged by is the younger generation are becoming more and more less tolerant of any form of discrimination
That's the only way it's going to stop , these youngsters educate their kids the right way , that it's disgusting.
We never had that
It's a slow process and probably won't happen in my lifetime but with this youth there's a chance
This, as well as convincing people racism exists and that a joke isn’t a “free speech” issue, is where it’s a struggle to get people on board.
It doesn’t mean you didn’t face you own problems, or belittle the problems you had. It just means you generally had the privilege of not having to worry about your skin colour or race. There’s no need to be defensive.
One reason we’re a bit stuck on the topic of racism now, struggling to stamp it out when everyone says they’re against it, is that every time the topic comes up it has to be framed around not offending white people or making them uncomfortable.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Yes, I think some people are taking it a little.too personally and getting offended by it. It's not about your circumstances as an individual, it's about people being judged upon by the colour of their skin.
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
The gesture isn't divisive though, it's the people who are ignoring the reason it's being done and then actively booing it that are divisive. Referring to the gesture being divisive is just passively excusing the agenda of the people who want to boo it. It is enabling them to say 'Exactly, I'm just misunderstood, I'm not booing the players doing it but yada yada, something Marxist, something 4000 miles away'.
Completely agree with your personal views on how it should be dealt within the stadium. Hoping the SBA are absolutely raucous in their support of Dabo before Saturday's game.
I’m mean as if BLM are going to get into power in America and implement a Marxist state anyway.
As far as I can tell the whole idea comes from their websites making statements about how racism is tied into a lot of social and power structures and want to “defund the police”, a terrible PR misstep which seems to mean fund issues before they ever become a problem for the police to deal with.
But sure, the American conservative/libertarian media machine says Marxists and people clutch their pearls.
One problem is we now have a Government that refuses to condem these idiots. Let's not forget that Government Ministers have been asked and refused to criticise people booing taking the knee. What does it say about the level of racism in society that we can end up with such an unenlightened Government.
Indeed.Try to condemn racism while downplaying it. They know they’ve got votes from racists and need to keep them on-side.
aloisijohnnyaloisi
Well-Known Member
Stop it with the buts.
Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
Tolerance will always be divisive for the intolerant.
Otis
Well-Known Member
I wonder if Gary Rowett doesn't want to upset his own racists, because that is seemingly quite a bit chunk of Millwall supporters.
Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
If he gets sacked from another job I hope he’s untouchable now. Perfect example of white privilege right there if he can just fail and walk into another job after enabling the racists at that club while a black manager doesn’t get a look in.
In that position he should be showing leadership and calling out the racism. That's the best way for us to tackle this problem.
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
Tolerance always strikes me as a horrible word too in these situations. As if being 'tolerated' because of the colour of your skin is somehow a reward. 'Allowed to exist'
aloisijohnnyaloisi
Well-Known Member
Completely agree with this, I hold the same hope.
I think it's one of the better things to come out of social media. Younger people (on the whole) are less reliant on the mainstream media for news and information, which has been reinforcing prejudices for donkey's years.
Sky Blue Pete
Well-Known Member
Completely agree - respect is better
Value better still.
fatso
Well-Known Member
Well if they use a different gesture, (other than a nazi salute of course) there would literally be zero excuses, that's the only point I'm trying to make.
But I totaly agree about the SBA showing support for Dabo, maybe a huge chant prior to kick off for example, that would be great to hear.
Otis
Well-Known Member
I was very lucky. I am part of the older generation and grew up as a kid in the late sixties and early seventies and two of my best friends were a guy called Sunil Nand, who was Fijian and Leroy Smith, who was of afro-carribbean descent.
I learnt from a very young age to just treat people as people. All individuals.
Racism is a complete nonsense and makes zero sense.
