yes the amount of england flags and israel flags in people’s bio on twitter is pretty stark.I'm sure it's just coincidence that so many racists in England "support" Israel in their matchup against Palestine
As for this situation its unfortunate but they wanna s oid violence. Also didn't the Israeli fans cause trouble in Amsterdam aswell?
Plus they shouldn't be allowed in the completion of Russian clubs ain't allowed
No they wouldn’t. You need to wake up and smell the coffee that this an ugly reflection of how mass migration has changed one our major cities. British Jews report feeling less and less safe in our country and that’s correlated with the increasing sectarianism in our politics. If a city being 30% Muslim makes it a ‘no-go’ area for certain demographics, this is a massive red flag and shameful episode. It also a kicker to our image as a successful multicultural country and the mantra of ‘diversity is our strength’.They surely would in certain countries. As I’ve said earlier in this thread, I don’t agree with that, but surely some club would ban them for fear of trouble.
you’ve put 2+2 together and got 5. you’ve assumed, like hiraeth have said, because an mp has said it people are going to follow what he saysWell if there is no worry about violence then why are they banned and why are other ultra groups not banned from attending games in birmingham .
Im sure you arent that silly
you’ve put 2+2 together and got 5. you’ve assumed, like hiraeth have said, because an mp has said it people are going to follow what he says
My partner is originally from that population and no I’d imagine neither her nor her family would partake in that.So in your opinion the local muslim population wouldnt interfere with their supporters whatsoever, the game qould pass by incident free besides racist chanting from the israeli supporters ?
Your view and reality are probably not aligned here
My partner is originally from that population and no I’d imagine neither her nor or her family would partake in that.
You say my view and reality aren’t aligned but i’d suggest i’m much closer to it than you despite your protests.
don’t need to, you know it all as usual.Then why are they banned from attending and no other ultra group has been ? Do tell
Don't know for sure Tel Aviv fans wouldn't have been banned from a game against Nottingham forest though do we?No they wouldn’t. You need to wake up and smell the coffee that this an ugly reflection of how mass migration has changed one our major cities. British Jews report feeling less and less safe in our country and that’s correlated with the increasing sectarianism in our politics. If a city being 30% Muslim makes it a ‘no-go’ area for certain demographics, this is a massive red flag and shameful episode. It also a kicker to our image as a successful multicultural country and the mantra of ‘diversity is our strength’.
Given how view on the Union Jack or St George’s cross making minorities feel unwelcome, your angle on this is strange.
There is no beef between Villa and Tel Aviv, Israel is supposedly an ally of the UK. The security risk is not high from a hooliganism POV. We wouldn’t ban Napoli fans, PSG, Marseille or any other European nation football fans. Heck, Galatasaray came to London twice in 2014 with fans allowed, despite their reputation with English football fans. Fenerbahce too in 2016.
Im asking you , if its not to upset the islamic population then im all earsdon’t need to, you know it all as usual.
There were worried about protests iand possible violence n Italy too when they played Israel last week. Talk of wil game go ahead etc.Im asking you , if its not to upset the islamic population then im all ears
There were worried about protests iand possible violence n Italy too when they played Israel last week. Talk of wil game go ahead etc.
Not sure Italy has massive Muslim population. Alot of people just opposed the genocide
Absolutely, we should immediately ban all teams from the Gaza Premier League from the Champions League.Should Palestine be banned too?
It is an extremely ugly situation all round and I’m not sure why you’re suggesting I think otherwise. Maccabi Tel Aviv fans have an element of their fanbase who have acted like thugs, and other fans of theirs have suffered anti-Semitic attacks as well - none of it is acceptable. Where we differ is that you seem to be suggesting we should move to protect one religious group by limiting another. Not sure that’s going to result in the utopia you remember from 10-20 years ago.You need to wake up and smell the coffee that this an ugly reflection of how mass migration has changed one our major cities. British Jews report feeling less and less safe in our country and that’s correlated with the increasing sectarianism in our politics. If a city being 30% Muslim makes it a ‘no-go’ area for certain demographics, this is a massive red flag and shameful episode. It also a kicker to our image as a successful multicultural country and the mantra of ‘diversity is our strength’.
We all have different perspectives and that's fine - I don't personally see much support for the actions of the Israeli government amongst many people in England, whether they are racists or otherwise - personally think that is another fringe group of people. There will of course be some that think like that.I'm sure it's just coincidence that so many racists in England "support" Israel in their matchup against Palestine
As for this situation its unfortunate but they wanna s oid violence. Also didn't the Israeli fans cause trouble in Amsterdam aswell?
Plus they shouldn't be allowed in the completion of Russian clubs ain't allowed
Yeah I'm not saying it's not cos of Muslim population. I'm just saying it might have been called off in different locations in England full stop just because of the opposition to what's happeningTel aviv played in greece recently , the only game where fans have been banned is birmingham , i believe
I have mentioned the awful treatment of the Uighurs on a few occasions. Having watched a documentary on the brain washing taking place there, I was very vested in this story.Has anything else happened in the Netherlands? I’m only aware of the one incident.
One thing I’ve observed on social media is that many of the Pro-Pal people have v little to say about Hamas executing political enemies in the streets this week*.
*Or ethnic of the Uighurs in China… or massacres of Christians in the Middle East and Nigeria.
Are they banned cos they Jewish though?We all have different perspectives and that's fine - I don't personally see much support for Israel amongst many people in England, whether they are racists or otherwise - personally think that is another fringe group of people. There will of course be some that think like that.
I'm a lot more comfortable with the notion of a ban on Israeli sporting teams based on the politics and actions of the Israeli government in the same vein as current Russian teams or previously South African sporting teams through sporting sanctions.
Banning individual football away fans seemingly because of their nationality or religion is something different and I'm disappointed to see Corbyns' MP appearing to treat that as something to be celebrated.
Leaders from the UAE and Saudi have been warning the west for decades about the people we’re letting in.I definitely see some religions as less progressive and more backward thinking than others , and in a progressive society i dont want more of it
Don't know for sure Tel Aviv fans wouldn't have been banned from a game against Nottingham forest though do we?
It's worth remembering that babies are being killed so people will be angry. It's probably human nature to feel it more when it's someone who looks like you I dunno
Yeah. It's the SAG isn't.If we cut to the chase , the reason their fans have been banned is because the local authorities cant guarantee their safety because birmingham has a very large muslim population that will probably be out for blood .
Isnt this the truth ?
oh yes the saudi’s the real friends we should be keepingLeaders from the UAE and Saudi have been warning the west for decades about the people we’re letting in.
They probably won’t be now this has kicked off. In fact, it’ll say more about us if they were banned. The problem with sectarianism in our society is that people calling for ‘global interfada’ or ‘jihad’ is that they cannot demarcate ordinary Israeli’s from the IDF.
Many Israeli’s are critical of their regime and want the conflict to end, their citizens should not feel unsafe in neutral countries.
Yeah. It's the SAG isn't.
I just think they can see that it's might well all kick off.
They have no political affiliation do they?
That's the same as saying Palestinians are not hamas. Yet that's the justification Israel and USA use.Leaders from the UAE and Saudi have been warning the west for decades about the people we’re letting in.
They probably won’t be now this has kicked off. In fact, it’ll say more about us if they were banned. The problem with sectarianism in our society is that people calling for ‘global interfada’ or ‘jihad’ is that they cannot demarcate ordinary Israeli’s from the IDF.
Many Israeli’s are critical of their regime and want the conflict to end, their citizens should not feel unsafe in neutral countries.
Maybe it is their nationality and not their religion that causes these football away fans to be banned.Are they banned cos they Jewish though?
More likely that they are Israeli during a time their country is committing genocide and the world isn't happy. They want to avoid violence and people being hurt on both sides
It's not like it's a pub saying no blacks allowed.
We were banned for a while (English)Maybe it is their nationality and not their religion that causes these football away fans to be banned.
I'm not sure banning away fans cos of their nationality is a good thing.
If threats of protests or suggestions of violence were made against away fans of other nationalities, do we similarly ban those away fans as well and pander to any group that might incite trouble.
Where do we draw the line on away fans nationalities?
I think it’s hard to be definitive about why this decision has been taken without knowing who even sits on the SAG that made it.Yeah. It's the SAG isn't.
I just think they can see that it's might well all kick off.
They have no political affiliation do they?
Awful regime. Really annoys me that we still treat them like they are friendsoh yes the saudi’s the real friends we should be keeping
Funny man. Palestine still play in FIFA sanctioned matches and were in World Cup qualifying earlier in the year.Absolutely, we should immediately ban all teams from the Gaza Premier League from the Champions League.
It is an extremely ugly situation all round and I’m not sure why you’re suggesting I think otherwise. Maccabi Tel Aviv fans have an element of their fanbase who have acted like thugs, and other fans of theirs have suffered anti-Semitic attacks as well - none of it is acceptable. Where we differ is that you seem to be suggesting we should move to protect one religious group by limiting another. Not sure that’s going to result in the utopia you remember from 10-20 years ago.
That's the same as saying Palestinians are not hamas. Yet that's the justification Israel and USA use.
I have no doubt there are Israelis horrified at what they are seeing(seem less vocal about it than Russians though?) but the Tel Aviv fans apparently caused trouble in Amsterdam so have previous
They probably understand the dynamics of the Arab and Islamic world better than we do.oh yes the saudi’s the real friends we should be keeping
I didn't think English fans were banned because of fears for their safety arising from people conflating their individual English or British nationality with the actions of the British government.We were banned for a while (English)
Not saying it's a good thing. Just saying not banned cos they Jewish. It is their nationality because they may be targeted yes
It's not a good situation at all. But not sure if it's worth crying about when a genocide has taken place last 2 years that's caused this issue with a Europa league game.
And what I mean by that is things like this unfortunately are inevitable
Not sure how many times I need to say that I don’t think the Tel Aviv fans should have been banned. Despite the ugly elements among their support, they don’t deserve to be tarred with the same brush, and you should deal with any trouble as it happens, not just throw them on the scrap heap. Can you say the same about Birmingham’s Muslim population, or should our working assumption be that they’re all “out for blood”?You’ve got it twisted. The people being literally limited are ordinary Israeli football fans. It’s categorised as a ‘high risk’ match not because of a few hundred (if that) Tel Aviv fans.
The reality is that Birmingham has a large Muslim population, routinely has Pro-Pal demos where ugly chats can be heard. Therefore, it’s plainly obvious that the local authorities are not confident they can guarantee the safety of our visitors.
Like I said it's not a good situation but its inevitableI didn't think English fans were banned because of fears for their safety arising from people conflating their individual English or British nationality with the actions of the British government.
I think it's possible to condemn and argue against all of these whether that was the Hamas attack, the Israeli governments actions in Gaza and banning away fans from matches in England based on the nationality of those fans.
I am not suggesting a false equivalence between the harms of the killings that have been taking place and the harms of the away fans ban.
I just don't know where we draw the line on fans of which nationalities are acceptable and which fans nationalities aren't a?
Don't think anyone is going to be worried about regular football fans, far more likely the concern is around the very right wing Maccabi Fanatics who have been travelling to away games in Europe in large numbers and causing trouble.The people being literally limited are ordinary Israeli football fans.
Its entirely possible, or at least should be, to believe supporters shouldn't be banned while acknowledging this isn't a one off and other clubs have in the past, and no doubt will in the future, had to play without their fans in attendance.Not sure how many times I need to say that I don’t think the Tel Aviv fans should have been banned.
Why are you putting something I didn’t say in quotation marks? That is incredibly misleading and disingenuous.Not sure how many times I need to say that I don’t think the Tel Aviv fans should have been banned. Despite the ugly elements among their support, they don’t deserve to be tarred with the same brush, and you should deal with any trouble as it happens, not just throw them on the scrap heap. Can you say the same about Birmingham’s Muslim population, or should our working assumption be that they’re all “out for blood”?
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