Forum Statement on New Stadium Announcement (2 Viewers)

[Nonleagueherewecome]

Genuine question as you have said the "no ambition" stuff and "pathetic".

Many games taken in last season?

You know I can't get to Brum. Ironically, this ground would be just up the road for me. Not that it will ever happen.

 

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[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

So you'd screw over fans and leave them outside just to create a "better atmosphere" and "demand" by having people crammed in like sardines (great for spreading germs, btw)? That's definitely not in the supporters interests. Cos then you can really rip them off with ticket prices, too.

I'm sure this is SISU's reasoning too. It won't be because it's cheaper for it to be small at all!

Come on man, 48th-52nd biggest ground in the league? How any City fan can be happy with that baffles me. If we were aiming to be a top L1 club with the odd season in the Champ, then it would be....oh.

You can’t build a stadium on the basis of “we might get a big draw and loads more will turn up” you build it to demand.

we’ve rarely averaged over 20k -if that starts to fill up regularly and we start to have waiting lists - you expand. You want the experience to be the best for your regulars - not the ones who turn up to see Man Utd

 

[Nonleagueherewecome]

Do you not understand the concept of modular buildings?

And also with Highfield road, we all know the ricoh was mainly a vanity project for Richardson and his mates and certainly wasn't "necessary" for the club by any stretch of the imagination

OK have it modular and start at 23-24k? 18-20 is too small.

 

[Nick]

You can’t build a stadium on the basis of “we might get a big draw and loads more will turn up” you build it to demand.

we’ve rarely averaged over 20k -if that starts to fill up regularly and we start to have waiting lists - you expand. You want the experience to be the best for your regulars - not the ones who turn up to see Man Utd

Exactly.

 

[mr_monkey]

OK have it modular and start at 23-24k? 18-20 is too small.

But why run the risk of getting in the same situation as the ricoh and it being too big for us. I'm also sure that once the building has started and it looks like we will need more then they will look to get the modules on sooner than planned, that's the whole point of it

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Oh, they will, they always find a way.

1992/1993- our own fans sold their tickets outside the ground to touts, we had 24,000 in the ground of which about 16,000 were Man Utd fans. There is always a way if demand is there.

 

[Nick]

1992/1993- our own fans sold their tickets outside the ground to touts, we had 24,000 in the ground of which about 16,000 were Man Utd fans. There is always a way if demand is there.

What if we get to the Champions League and a Barcelona fan offers me £1000 because there isn't enough space in the away end?

Fucking hell.

 

[chiefdave]

The point is that it is fucking pathetic. That's a lower league ground. No ambition-they clearly don't see us going up again in the next decade or they would start higher. It has to be bigger than HR, surely? Part of the reasoning of leaving there was it was too small for a growing club...

Looking at our attendance history if you're not happy with an initial 20K rising to 35K if required what capacity would be enough to not be "fucking pathetic"? Should we build a 60K stadium like Arsenal & Spurs and just hope it doesn't bankrupt us before we reach a point where we need to use more than one stand?

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Do you not understand the concept of modular buildings?

And also with Highfield road, we all know the ricoh was mainly a vanity project for Richardson and his mates and certainly wasn't "necessary" for the club by any stretch of the imagination

You're saying a 32,000 seat ground was not by any stretch of the imagination necessary for a Premiership club, whose ground was old & dilapidated, while all other clubs in our position were doing the same and vastly increasing their revenue comparative to us? That makes no sense whatsoever.

You need to forget the personal animosity for Richardson, drop the HR nostalgia and face reality, it was necessary for where we wanted to be. The only problem was that we utterly failed to get anywhere near where we wanted to be.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

What if we get to the Champions League and a Barcelona fan offers me £1000 because there isn't enough space in the away end?

Fucking hell.

No idea what that has to do with anything, but ok.

 

[Nick]

No idea what that has to do with anything, but ok.

Because that will be the next reason that it is not big enough.

And again, the people who seem to be going on about it being pathetic and no ambition aren't having to go there week in week out for various reasons

Maybe it's just a worry that it won't be as easy to rock up to big games? It's not just here, it is social media too.

 

[Nonleagueherewecome]

If it's an adequate size, why is nearly every other Championship ground and all bar one Premier League one bigger?

 

[Nick]

If it's an adequate size, why is nearly every other Championship ground and all bar one Premier League one bigger?

If it is too small, let's get every single city fan moaning about "ambition" to buy a season ticket and get to every game next season to show that it is not viable?

 

[mr_monkey]

You're saying a 32,000 seat ground was not by any stretch of the imagination necessary for a Premiership club, whose ground was old & dilapidated, while all other clubs in our position were doing the same and vastly increasing their revenue comparative to us? That makes no sense whatsoever.

You need to forget the personal animosity for Richardson, drop the HR nostalgia and face reality, it was necessary for where we wanted to be. The only problem was that we utterly failed to get anywhere near where we wanted to be.

But we were at very very best a lower mid table prem club who hardly ever sold out the "small" stadium. Now if we sold out every game and had a waiting list for season tickets it would have been completely different story but we didn't and we failed as a club because of the same people who thought the Ricoh was a good idea and made a fuck load of money from it

 

[Nonleagueherewecome]

If it is too small, let's get every single city fan moaning about "ambition" to buy a season ticket and get to every game next season to show that it is not viable?

If it was in Coventry I think the crowds would prove my point. You'd get over 20k for at least half a dozen games and I expect more.

EDIT: don't try and imply that I am a hypocrite to suit your argument. It's not my fault the ground is in another City that I can't get to. I'd be there if it was closer.

 

[mr_monkey]

If it was in Coventry I think the crowds would prove my point. You'd get over 20k for at least half a dozen games and I expect more.

EDIT: don't try and imply that I am a hypocrite to suit your argument. It's not my fault the ground is in another City that I can't get to. I'd be there if it was closer.

Tbf mate it's not the club's fault either

 

[Nick]

If it was in Coventry I think the crowds would prove my point. You'd get over 20k for at least half a dozen games and I expect more.

EDIT: don't try and imply that I am a hypocrite to suit your argument. It's not my fault the ground is in another City that I can't get to. I'd be there if it was closer.

Yeah half a dozen games based on who the away team is...

I am on about in general, have a look on social media at the people whinging about no ambition and have a look at the games they attend.A lot of them are the same people who were shouting NOPM or BOYCOTT and then whinged about the number of tickets season ticket holders got for away games or Wembley.

It isn't CCFC's fault it is in another city either, sadly.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Because that will be the next reason that it is not big enough.

And again, the people who seem to be going on about it being pathetic and no ambition aren't having to go there week in week out for various reasons

Maybe it's just a worry that it won't be as easy to rock up to big games? It's not just here, it is social media too.

ok- its not actually 'ambition' as such, its more that the owners are now trying to change the very identity of the club. We have always been a club who despite everything aren't badly supported, and the second a whiff of success comes along can pack grounds out & call upon big numbers of fans, showing the potential thats there. That disappears with this 18k ground, the very identity of the club becomes "small Championship club", and rightly or wrongly I don't believe they would expand.

As for the other stuff, I'll have a season ticket no matter how many games are doable, just as I did for the bones of a decade, even though I could have easily picked & chosen my games & knew full well I wouldn't be able to get to all- however thats just going down the road of "you're not a real fan if you don't go to every game", which is silly, and a bit insulting to people who perhaps don't have the cash to slap down on a season ticket. And connected to that- like I said- this nonsense about deliberately making it small and then forcing prices up- thats a surefire way to make absolutely sure we don't attract any new fans, and piss a lot of people off in the process. We're CCFC, not Man Utd, we will likely never have the ability to sell the "experience" of a Cov match.

Therefore- I don't want a huge arena, I just want something that makes sense & doesn't involve ripping people off, and allows for more to start coming more regularly- with 15k home seats & "premium pricing" you don't have any of that.

 

[Nonleagueherewecome]

Yeah half a dozen games based on who the away team is...

I am on about in general, have a look on social media at the people whinging about no ambition and have a look at the games they attend.A lot of them are the same people who were shouting NOPM or BOYCOTT and then whinged about the number of tickets season ticket holders got for away games or Wembley.

Yeah I get the feeling those people never ever went-maybe Chelsea in the FA Cup. I had a ST for around 10 years and stopped that when they moved the club initially. Then I went to some games (in L1/L2), then none when it moved again...if we were Champ and in Cov, I'd go to more games as a "casual" fan than I did in L1/L2 and I think a large number of others would, too.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Yeah half a dozen games based on who the away team is...

I am on about in general, have a look on social media at the people whinging about no ambition and have a look at the games they attend.A lot of them are the same people who were shouting NOPM or BOYCOTT and then whinged about the number of tickets season ticket holders got for away games or Wembley.

It isn't CCFC's fault it is in another city either, sadly.

Well I haven't looked on social media and seen that, and I have no time for the boycott crew, I'm not just copying what they may or may not be saying, just how I see it- 20k home seats makes sense to me, worry about building on if that time comes.

 

[Nonleagueherewecome]

Tbf mate it's not the club's fault either

No it's not, but it's the reason I can't go to any games.

 

[Nick]

ok- its not actually 'ambition' as such, its more that the owners are now trying to change the very identity of the club. We have always been a club who despite everything aren't badly supported, and the second a whiff of success comes along can pack grounds out & call upon big numbers of fans, showing the potential thats there. That disappears with this 18k ground, the very identity of the club becomes "small Championship club", and rightly or wrongly I don't believe they would expand.

As for the other stuff, I'll have a season ticket no matter how many games are doable, just as I did for the bones of a decade, even though I could have easily picked & chosen my games & knew full well I wouldn't be able to get to all- however thats just going down the road of "you're not a real fan if you don't go to every game", which is silly, and a bit insulting to people who perhaps don't have the cash to slap down on a season ticket. And connected to that- like I said- this nonsense about deliberately making it small and then forcing prices up- thats a surefire way to make absolutely sure we don't attract any new fans, and piss a lot of people off in the process. We're CCFC, not Man Utd, we will likely never have the ability to sell the "experience" of a Cov match.

Therefore- I don't want a huge arena, I just want something that makes sense & doesn't involve ripping people off, and allows for more to start coming more regularly- with 15k home seats & "premium pricing" you don't have any of that.

So it's the owners changing the identity of the club now because they aren't potentially building a massive stadium to cater for glory fans? As I have said, the best way to do this is to get thousands to games week in, week out to show that their estimations won't be big enough and force a rethink. Still, Rotherham at home on a Tuesday night in the cold maybe isn't appealing for some?

I haven't said people aren't real fans, I am saying that it's weird how it's people who aren't there week in week out who are going on about the ambition.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Yeah I get the feeling those people never ever went-maybe Chelsea in the FA Cup. I had a ST for around 10 years and stopped that when they moved the club initially. Then I went to some games (in L1/L2), then none when it moved again...if we were Champ and in Cov, I'd go to more games as a "casual" fan than I did in L1/L2 and I think a large number of others would, too.

Isn't that part of any sensible plan, to allow some room for people to "come back", or indeed start watching us?

 

[Nonleagueherewecome]

If it is too small, let's get every single city fan moaning about "ambition" to buy a season ticket and get to every game next season to show that it is not viable?

Oh, and doesn't answer my point: why do nearly all the other Championship clubs consider 18-20k too small?

 

[Ring Of Steel]

So it's the owners changing the identity of the club now because they aren't potentially building a massive stadium to cater for glory fans? As I have said, the best way to do this is to get thousands to games week in, week out to show that their estimations won't be big enough and force a rethink. Still, Rotherham at home on a Tuesday night in the cold maybe isn't appealing for some?

I haven't said people aren't real fans, I am saying that it's weird how it's people who aren't there week in week out who are going on about the ambition.

Who is it you keep quoting as saying that we need to build a massive stadium?

 

[Nick]

Isn't that part of any sensible plan, to allow some room for people to "come back", or indeed start watching us?

I am sure they can still watch on a dodgy Facebook stream?

 

[Ring Of Steel]

Oh, and doesn't answer my point: why do nearly all the other Championship clubs consider 18-20k too small?

because it is

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

the good thing about modular stadiums is that it can be increased quickly if we sell out more often then not we can add 2k or so.

you didn’t see Bournemouth thinkingc fuck it - we’re not ambitious enough... better get a 50,000 seater

 

[Nick]

Who is it you keep quoting as saying that we need to build a massive stadium?

I am talking about when you are going on about changing the clubs identity of having glory / fickle fans. If games are sold out every week or close it then they run a loyalty scheme where you build up points by watching us against shit teams.

The key to it is that it can be upgraded much easier if needed.

 

[Nonleagueherewecome]

the good thing about modular stadiums is that it can be increased quickly if we sell out more often then not we can add 2k or so.

you didn’t see Bournemouth thinkingc fuck it - we’re not ambitious enough... better get a 50,000 seater

The only Premier League club averaging under 20k.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

the good thing about modular stadiums is that it can be increased quickly if we sell out more often then not we can add 2k or so.

you didn’t see Bournemouth thinkingc fuck it - we’re not ambitious enough... better get a 50,000 seater

Thats because that way of thinking would be stupidity, and I don't see where anyone is asking for a 50k stadium, unless I'm missing something.

Also not sure that adding in chunks of 2,000 makes any sense at all- I know modular is the way forward but you don't just add/ remove whenever you feel like it.

 

[Ring Of Steel]

I am talking about when you are going on about changing the clubs identity of having glory / fickle fans. If games are sold out every week or close it then they run a loyalty scheme where you build up points by watching us against shit teams.

The key to it is that it can be upgraded much easier if needed.

No, you keep saying that people are asking for a massive stadium and that they're saying that unless we get it there is no ambition- who is asking for that, and is 24,000 'massive'? Its pretty much the same as Highfield Road. As for loyalty schemes, if games are sold out every week then why would you give loyalty points to the same people every week who go anyway, how does that encourage anyone to start watching us?

Whichever way you slice it- assuming we do ok & keep up the goodwill there is now, 15,000 home seats is not enough. I would argue that about 20,000 would be right.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

20000 season tickets at £200 average each is £4m as opposed to 2500 at the same average. I think 20k home fans is enough unless we go up before then

 

[mr_monkey]

No, you keep saying that people are asking for a massive stadium and saying that unless we get it there is no ambition- who is asking for that, and is 24,000 'massive'? Its pretty much the same as Highfield Road. As for loyalty schemes, if games are sold out every week then why would you give loyalty points to the same people every week who go anyway, how does that encourage anyone to start watching us?

Whichever way you slice it- assuming we do ok & keep up the goodwill there is now, 15,000 home seats is not enough. I would argue that about 20,000 would be right.

And again if it looks like we need it we can quickly add the extra capacity but if we build it as more and we don't need it then it turns into the Ricoh mark 2 and noone wants that. What's wrong with being cautious at the moment, who knows where we will be in 5 years time

 

[Nick]

And again if it looks like we need it we can quickly add the extra capacity but if we build it as more and we don't need it then it turns into the Ricoh mark 2 and noone wants that. What's wrong with being cautious at the moment, who knows where we will be in 5 years time

Yeah but back in the day there were touts selling Man Utd tickets in the home end?

As it stands at the moment, we are going to be a lower end (hopefully more mid table) Championship club. That's the reality of the situation, if it gets to the point where were are knocking on the door of the Premiership and a sellout every week then it can be the case that upgrading capacity can be looked at.

Safe standing would also be an easy way to increase capacity.