The boat/James (1 Viewer)

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

I'm James's brother, i saw him last night and he is still trying to get this resolved. He badly organised this and did it against all of our advice. He genuinely wanted to do something different and give the City fan's something different for a day out. People who saying that the CCFC thread is "hilarious" or "juicy" may feel differently it's one of their loved ones being threatened and it's not just my brother. He has had people call him from a withheld number saying they are going to get his son too, he's nine years old by the way. My brother is trying to rectify this but it is a bit of a mess, and has over 300 people to contact individually. This is not a company it's one lad.

WhaleOilBeefHooked · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
People who saying that the CCFC thread is "hilarious" or "juicy" may feel differently it's one of their loved ones being threatened and it's not just my brother. He has had people call him from a withheld number saying they are going to get his son too, he's nine years old by the way. My brother is trying to rectify this but it is a bit of a mess, and has over 300 people to contact individually. This is not a company it's one lad.

Yeah threatening his son or anyone else is not on. Cowardly, even.

Tom19866 said:
My brother is trying to rectify this but it is a bit of a mess, and has over 300 people to contact individually.

Tell him to produce evidence to get the heat off his back, for Christ sake! The radio silence or contacting everyone 'individually' is not helping anyone.

wingy · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
I'm James's brother, i saw him last night and he is still trying to get this resolved. He badly organised this and did it against all of our advice. He genuinely wanted to do something different and give the City fan's something different for a day out. People who saying that the CCFC thread is "hilarious" or "juicy" may feel differently it's one of their loved ones being threatened and it's not just my brother. He has had people call him from a withheld number saying they are going to get his son too, he's nine years old by the way. My brother is trying to rectify this but it is a bit of a mess, and has over 300 people to contact individually. This is not a company it's one lad.

Ditto
Get some perspective folks
He's also the father of my grandson
He is I'm afraid nothing more than a naive dreamer .
City and sport mad!!

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

WhaleOilBeefHooked said:
Yeah threatening his son or anyone else is not on. Cowardly, even.

Tell him to produce evidence to get the heat off his back, for Christ sake! The radio silence or contacting everyone 'individually' is not helping anyone.

It's not radio silence, he's trying to sort out the people who actually went on the trip rather than fight off a rabid mob on FB. He is going to spend the day today trying to get this sorted, when i saw him last night he spent most of the time on the phone to people, answering messages etc. Like i said he doesn't have a customer relations department, it's him and his phone. I warned him after Wembley not to try and do stuff like this it nearly killed him.

WhaleOilBeefHooked · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
It's not radio silence, he's trying to sort out the people who actually went on the trip rather than fight off a rabid mob on FB. He is going to spend the day today trying to get this sorted, when i saw him last night he spent most of the time on the phone to people, answering messages etc. Like i said he doesn't have a customer relations department, it's him and his phone. I warned him after Wembley not to try and do stuff like this it nearly killed him.

He doesn't need a Customer Relations department though? One message with an email or an invoice on and it gets some heat off him for him to process refunds.

Covstu · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
It's not radio silence, he's trying to sort out the people who actually went on the trip rather than fight off a rabid mob on FB. He is going to spend the day today trying to get this sorted, when i saw him last night he spent most of the time on the phone to people, answering messages etc. Like i said he doesn't have a customer relations department, it's him and his phone. I warned him after Wembley not to try and do stuff like this it nearly killed him.

sounds like he is trying to make this right so fair play to him. Really sad that people are making threats to his family, that's just not on.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

WhaleOilBeefHooked said:
He doesn't need a Customer Relations department though? One message with an email or an invoice on and it gets some heat off him for him to process refunds.

He has put some screenshots on, he can't put much more on FB as it has other peoples details on it. I understand people are annoyed, i was on the boat too and i paid for every drink! He's trying to get this sorted and frankly i told him to get off that forum and just deal directly with the people who are owed from the boat.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

Covstu said:
sounds like he is trying to make this right so fair play to him. Really sad that people are making threats to his family, that's just not on.

That's how quickly these things escalate, people might think it's a laugh or funny. However when you see death threats against your family it's not.

Nick · Oct 18, 2018

One of the reasons I didn't want people posting "pictures" as suggested or personal info is that people will be dicks about it. Thankfully there isn't really much of it on here (threats etc) but would want to cut it out before it got there (especially anything to do with his kid).

Will leave the thread open so he can hopefully post a message on here to reply to the issues as there were some people on there.

Anybody who wants to threaten kids over not getting a few beers needs their heads testing. Understand if people were misled they will be pissed off but it needs a bit of perspective.

WhaleOilBeefHooked · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
He has put some screenshots on, he can't put much more on FB as it has other peoples details on it. I understand people are annoyed, i was on the boat too and i paid for every drink! He's trying to get this sorted and frankly i told him to get off that forum and just deal directly with the people who are owed from the boat.

He put it up for five minutes and nobody saw it mate. You can blank out details too.

It's mob mentality at the moment with some dicks not even on the boat threatening him. Getting on the forum where 100s of people are looking for updates is the best bet. Give the mob what they're looking for and calm them down.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

WhaleOilBeefHooked said:
He put it up for five minutes and nobody saw it mate. You can blank out details too.

It's mob mentality at the moment with some dicks not even on the boat threatening him. Getting on the forum where 100s of people are looking for updates is the best bet. Give the mob what they're looking for and calm them down.

I think that's what he will be doing, but as you said it's mob mentality. One guy was threatened on there for saying he thought his coaches were alright, so i understand his unwillingness to go on FB. He has made a mess of this and is trying to get everything sorted for people, it's not helped by every time he goes on to try and sort it he has people threatening to hurt him.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

Nick said:
One of the reasons I didn't want people posting "pictures" as suggested or personal info is that people will be dicks about it. Thankfully there isn't really much of it on here (threats etc) but would want to cut it out before it got there (especially anything to do with his kid).

Will leave the thread open so he can hopefully post a message on here to reply to the issues as there were some people on there.

Anybody who wants to threaten kids over not getting a few beers needs their heads testing. Understand if people were misled they will be pissed off but it needs a bit of perspective.

Thank you Nick

harvey098 · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
Thank you Nick

I was one of the ones on the boat. I think we all just want to know how much he paid the boat company. That’s all we’re asking for.

duffer · Oct 18, 2018

dazed&confused said:
I'm aware of my next door neighbour's name, and their address, and their date of birth (I think), but it doesn't mean that I can contact Barclaycard and expect to be told how much he spent on his new sofa. Just because I've sat on that sofa, the information is not freely available to me. If I impersonate my neighbour, it could be a criminal matter. If Barclaycard know who's asking the question and still tell me, it's a breach of the Data Protection Act which can lead to criminal prosecution, non-criminal prosecution and/or external audit.

But I agree with the rest of what you say!

Politely, I think you're wrong on the DPA bit. This isn't personal information; it's not his card balance, his address, date of birth, or anything else that could be classed as personal in that sense; it's specific information about a commercial transaction which has already been offered publicly (and possibly incorrectly) by the person involved.

James could raise a complaint with the ICO, but given he's already publicly stated his version of the figures involved I can't see any way the company making their version public would put them in breach of anything unless there was a NDA between the buyer and seller.

Indeed arguably it could be claimed the disclosure was in the public interest if it identified the possible commission of a crime. Or they could justify it as a reasonable defence of their own reputation.

Either way, as soon as James shares the data publicly then his grounds for claiming a breach when the company shares the same data doesn't fly, imho.

Minor point, it's GDPR that drives this these days rather than the old DPA. It's even more onerous on companies in terms of the processing and retention of personal data. I like that, personally.

clint van damme · Oct 18, 2018

if ever get to the point where I threaten a child, let alone threaten one over 30 quid, I hope I'll have the good grace to throw myself under a train and if not hopefully someone will cave my head in with a baseball bat.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

harvey098 said:
I was one of the ones on the boat. I think we all just want to know how much he paid the boat company. That’s all we’re asking for.

I will speak to him later and tell him to put it up again, does Jimbo have your details btw?

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

clint van damme said:
if ever get to the point where I threaten a child, let alone threaten one over 30 quid, I hope I'll have the good grace to throw myself under a train and if not hopefully someone will cave my head in with a baseball bat.

Most people would feel the same, my point is people don't realise how quickly these things can turn very nasty. Mob mentality takes over and you don't know how far people will take it.

jess4ccfc4life! · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
I'm James's brother, i saw him last night and he is still trying to get this resolved. He badly organised this and did it against all of our advice. He genuinely wanted to do something different and give the City fan's something different for a day out. People who saying that the CCFC thread is "hilarious" or "juicy" may feel differently it's one of their loved ones being threatened and it's not just my brother. He has had people call him from a withheld number saying they are going to get his son too, he's nine years old by the way. My brother is trying to rectify this but it is a bit of a mess, and has over 300 people to contact individually. This is not a company it's one lad.

Why the hell am i finding out that threats are being made about my son on a public forum? James could have cleared this up simply yesterday with his booking confirmation he doesnt even have to share anything public about others you can dedact a bank statement easily - i have to do it daily at work. Please tell him to share his booking confirmation because it will stop all of this.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

jess4ccfc4life! said:
Why the hell am i finding out that threats are being made about my son on a public forum? James could have cleared this up simply yesterday with his booking confirmation he doesnt even have to share anything public about others you can dedact a bank statement easily - i have to do it daily at work. Please tell him to share his booking confirmation because it will stop all of this.

I will ask him to do that, as you can probably imagine i advised him to keep off FB last night.

dazed&confused · Oct 18, 2018

duffer said:
Politely, I think you're wrong on the DPA bit. This isn't personal information; it's not his card balance, his address, date of birth, or anything else that could be classed as personal in that sense; it's specific information about a commercial transaction which has already been offered publicly (and possibly incorrectly) by the person involved.

James could raise a complaint with the ICO, but given he's already publicly stated his version of the figures involved I can't see any way the company making their version public would put them in breach of anything unless there was a NDA between the buyer and seller.

Indeed arguably it could be claimed the disclosure was in the public interest if it identified the possible commission of a crime. Or they could justify it as a reasonable defence of their own reputation.

Either way, as soon as James shares the data publicly then his grounds for claiming a breach when the company shares the same data doesn't fly, imho.

Minor point, it's GDPR that drives this these days rather than the old DPA. It's even more onerous on companies in terms of the processing and retention of personal data. I like that, personally.

Ok, we'll just have to agree to differ on this.

Otis · Oct 18, 2018

So sorry to hear of all the the threats. It is sad, pathetic and totally unnecessary.

As has been suggested though, to get people off his back, James could screenshot info and simply blank out personal details. All he needs are little pieces of white paper covering personal info, or just blur it out in a photo editing app.

If James needs any help I am more than happy to do so. That's if I can be of any help at all.

I'm sure other SBTers would do the same.

Anything to alleviate all this frothing at the mouth and clenched first policy.

I think even ringing people isn't going to satisfy some. They are now looking for concrete proof of the costs etc.

Think it is the only way to stop the baying mob.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

Otis said:
So sorry to hear of all the the threats. It is sad, pathetic and totally unnecessary.

As has been suggested though, to get people off his back, James could screenshot info and simply blank out personal details. All he needs are little pieces of white paper covering personal info, or just blur it out in a photo editing app.

If James needs any help I am more than happy to do so. That's if I can be of any help at all.

I'm sure other SBTers would do the same.

Anything to alleviate all this frothing at the mouth and clenched first policy.

I think even ringing people isn't going to satisfy some. They are now looking for concrete proof of the costs etc.

Think it is the only way to stop the baying mob.

Cheers mate, i will pass that on to him.

The Lurker · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
I'm James's brother, i saw him last night and he is still trying to get this resolved. He badly organised this and did it against all of our advice. He genuinely wanted to do something different and give the City fan's something different for a day out. People who saying that the CCFC thread is "hilarious" or "juicy" may feel differently it's one of their loved ones being threatened and it's not just my brother. He has had people call him from a withheld number saying they are going to get his son too, he's nine years old by the way. My brother is trying to rectify this but it is a bit of a mess, and has over 300 people to contact individually. This is not a company it's one lad.

look if it was a genuine mistake then he should refund every person £20 for the trip. at the minute it doesn’t look good. you say he’s one lad and not a company. he shouldn’t go promising deals he can’t offer. I.e trips to European games, boats with free bars. the fact is as it stands it looks all hes pocketed £7000 from trip he offered. that’s not good. all he has to do is show invoices from the company. in terms of threats to kids. that’s wrong. the sooner he gets it sorted the better it is for him

The Lurker · Oct 18, 2018

Otis said:
So sorry to hear of all the the threats. It is sad, pathetic and totally unnecessary.

As has been suggested though, to get people off his back, James could screenshot info and simply blank out personal details. All he needs are little pieces of white paper covering personal info, or just blur it out in a photo editing app.

If James needs any help I am more than happy to do so. That's if I can be of any help at all.

I'm sure other SBTers would do the same.

Anything to alleviate all this frothing at the mouth and clenched first policy.

I think even ringing people isn't going to satisfy some. They are now looking for concrete proof of the costs etc.

Think it is the only way to stop the baying mob.

he’s got previous for this! he was in jail for fraud! why are you sticking up for him?

Otis · Oct 18, 2018

The Lurker said:
he’s got previous for this! he was in jail for fraud! why are you sticking up for him?

I'm not.

I'm offering to help sort it out if it's a genuine mistake.

And you simply cannot say someone is guilty of something just because they were guilty previously of something else.

We have to be better than that as a society.

Are you trying to say that no criminal has never reformed, ever?

skybluegod · Oct 18, 2018

The Lurker said:
he’s got previous for this! he was in jail for fraud! why are you sticking up for him?

So what if he’s got previous. Everyone deserves a second chance.

You can’t keep bringing up the past. He served his time for that.

To me it looks like genuine mistake.

You are making wild accusations without hearing both sides. You don’t know what he pocketed. I don’t see how he could have pocketed £7000 when it’s been said he was going around all the bars putting £200 on all of them. So to now also be refunding £20 to all people, doesn’t exactly sound like the best fraudster ever does it.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

The Lurker said:
look if it was a genuine mistake then he should refund every person £20 for the trip. at the minute it doesn’t look good. you say he’s one lad and not a company. he shouldn’t go promising deals he can’t offer. I.e trips to European games, boats with free bars. the fact is as it stands it looks all hes pocketed £7000 from trip he offered. that’s not good. all he has to do is show invoices from the company. in terms of threats to kids. that’s wrong. the sooner he gets it sorted the better it is for him

I have said all this to him, he shouldn't be trying to organise these type of things. He try's to do too much and it's too much for him to take on. It's not as if he even makes money from it most of the time, and it's far more grief than its worth. He is spending today getting this sorted and hopefully that will at least calm this down.

Otis · Oct 18, 2018

Bring Back Rattles has been in prison, so obviously a criminal.

Maybe everyone should refuse to have their windows cleaned by him.

Is that fair, eh?

Mild-Mannered Janitor · Oct 18, 2018

Personally, the football club and Mark Robins have a lot to answer for here, if they were not playing as well doing some good stuff with the community and kids then everyone would be having a go at all of those things rather than continuing a pointless conversation about something that didn't quite work out as planned, a few people didn't get exactly what they wanted but no one made a fortune, no one lost out a great deal on getting to the game etc

Drop it, move on, get on with something more important than missing out on a few beers and look forward to this weekends all inclusive ice cream, candy floss, donkey rides and a kiss me quick hat for £10 all in. Contact: No_one_cares@gmail.com for bookings.

The guy is trying and being persecuted over a few quid and he is learning, it doesn't need to abuse and comments that have been thrashed about on all of the available media to do so.
My final say on this is that if he decides to not do this going forward and you have to book all other away games with the club or someone else then its going to cost you far more than you lost on the Charlton trip so stick with him as its still cheaper for you in the long term.

Otis · Oct 18, 2018

Tom19866 said:
I have said all this to him, he shouldn't be trying to organise these type of things. He try's to do too much and it's too much for him to take on. It's not as if he even makes money from it most of the time, and it's far more grief than its worth. He is spending today getting this sorted and hopefully that will at least calm this down.

Are his family rallying around and trying to help him out here, Tom?

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

Mild-Mannered Janitor said:
Personally, the football club and Mark Robins have a lot to answer for here, if they were not playing as well doing some good stuff with the community and kids then everyone would be having a go at all of those things rather than continuing a pointless conversation about something that didn't quite work out as planned, a few people didn't get exactly what they wanted but no one made a fortune, no one lost out a great deal on getting to the game etc

Drop it, move on, get on with something more important than missing out on a few beers and look forward to this weekends all inclusive ice cream, candy floss, donkey rides and a kiss me quick hat for £10 all in. Contact: No_one_cares@gmail.com for bookings.

The guy is trying and being persecuted over a few quid and he is learning, it doesn't need to abuse and comments that have been thrashed about on all of the available media to do so.
My final say on this is that if he decides to not do this going forward and you have to book all other away games with the club or someone else then its going to cost you far more than you lost on the Charlton trip so stick with him as its still cheaper for you in the long term.

He told me next big away day etc he's just doing a few coaches for his regulars. He's not going to do things like this again, which for me is a relief.

Esoterica · Oct 18, 2018

How has something as simple as a booking confirmation or an invoice from the company not been shared 12 days after the event? To start phoning individuals before that 15 minute job is done is like putting a plaster on your knee when your head's been chopped off. The mob mentality is completely wrong - getting some real evidence out there is the only way to take the sting out of all of this now, not family member's character references.

james raffell · Oct 18, 2018

I’ve tried to reply and get a bit of my side across on Facebook but it’s impossible as does become a witch hunt.
I know what the email says but in one transaction to them alone I did send more than that, I messed up massively on this and was hoping it would be a different way to travel, I would never purposely rip off City fans, as I’ve said on Facebook, if I was to do that then I’d charge more for coaches I do week in week out, or even charge more for badges etc.
I’m currently sorting out refunds and then I’ll go about clearing my name on Facebook, this is a mistake. I know people say I’m a fraud for what I’ve done, on the day I said to the staff I’ll put my card behind the bar to sort a tab out, that would have left me massively out of pocket (so that’s not the best fraudster in the world), I’ve made mistakes in the past and done my time for that.
I’m sorry to everyone who travelled and am trying to get this rectified ASAP.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

Otis said:
Are his family rallying around and trying to help him out here, Tom?

I am going to try and help him sort this, i can't get on to the fans forum on FB but can try help him in anyway i can. I can tell you he honestly hasn't tried to fuck people over, he had an idea to try and do something different for a day out. It's backfired badly because he has neither the experience nor nous to pull this off.

Tom19866 · Oct 18, 2018

Esoterica said:
How has something as simple as a booking confirmation or an invoice from the company not been shared 12 days after the event? To start phoning individuals before that 15 minute job is done is like putting a plaster on your knee when your head's been chopped off. The mob mentality is completely wrong - getting some real evidence out there is the only way to take the sting out of all of this now, not family member's character references.

I understand that, but i am not going to stand by a watch a loved one be treated like this. I suspect neither would you.

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