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England World Cup Qualifying Thread (14 Viewers)

  • Thread starter Evo1883
  • Start date Mar 24, 2021
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Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #456
CJ_covblaze said:
One the subject of Harry Kane he’s clearly up there with the best in the world for goal scoring but it isn’t even the best part of his game. He’s so much better when he drops back and plays it to others.
Click to expand...

Think with spurs it works , with England it prevents us getting forward as quickly ..I'd rather he played as an out an out striker for England
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #457
Frostie said:
Certainly was a deserved criticism of him previously & he lost his place in both the City & England teams as a result.

However he has been superb this year &, with the exception of last night, had pretty much managed to eradicate that from his game. Let's not pile on by far our best defender on the back of one error. I'd much rather have somebody comfortable on the ball in that position than the other options available.
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I'm just not keen , I won't pile on him , but this is a position that will cost us any chance of winning the euros imo
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #458
Frostie said:
Certainly was a deserved criticism of him previously & he lost his place in both the City & England teams as a result.

However he has been superb this year &, with the exception of last night, had pretty much managed to eradicate that from his game. Let's not pile on by far our best defender on the back of one error. I'd much rather have somebody comfortable on the ball in that position than the other options available.
Click to expand...


I've had a look and yes he's comfortable on the ball , but in terms of actual defending stats , his tackle success rate is 44% this season and that's in a team that has to defend much less than a Burnley.

Tarkowski success in the mid 60s ..

There has to be a balance surely between actually defending and passing ability otherwise we may aswell stop bringing through defenders and play holding midfielders there instead ...as they typically pass and defend better than John stones

Not really my type of defender I'm afraid , if you can't defend you arent a defender
 
Reactions: Ian1779

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #459
TomRad85 said:
Suarez is one of the best players of his generation and should be remembered as such.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

We get the message. no need to chew our ear off!
 

Frostie

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #460
Evo1883 said:
I've had a look and yes he's comfortable on the ball , but in terms of actual defending stats , his tackle success rate is 44% this season and that's in a team that has to defend much less than a Burnley.

Tarkowski success in the mid 60s ..

There has to be a balance surely between actually defending and passing ability otherwise we may aswell stop bringing through defenders and play holding midfielders there instead ...as they typically pass and defend better than John stones

Not really my type of defender I'm afraid , if you can't defend you arent a defender
Click to expand...

Need to be a bit careful with those kind of stats though because as you say the style of the teams play makes a massive difference.

Burnley play probably 90% of their football in a low block, making lots of tackles, contesting a lot of high % balls, the top teams obviously don't play that way. For example I'm pretty sure Tarkowski's numbers would be better than Van Dijk's last year & nobody would honestly believe Tarkowski is a better defender than Van Dijk.

Similar reason as to why Save % figures are so unreliable as they pay no attention to the actual difficulty of the save. Without even looking I can guess Nick Pope would probably be right at the top of the league for that stat.
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #461
Frostie said:
Need to be a bit careful with those kind of stats though because as you say the style of the teams play makes a massive difference.

Burnley play probably 90% of their football in a low block, making lots of tackles, contesting a lot of high % balls, the top teams obviously don't play that way. For example I'm pretty sure Tarkowski's numbers would be better than Van Dijk's last year & nobody would honestly believe Tarkowski is a better defender than Van Dijk.

Similar reason as to why Save % figures are so unreliable as they pay no attention to the actual difficulty of the save. Without even looking I can guess Nick Pope would probably be right at the top of the league for that stat.
Click to expand...
I mean there Is definitely some English bias towards stones especially this year..
He's having the best season of his career which many people widely agree on but yet he's still no better than rudiger at Chelsea, he's defensively worse than Tyrone mings in many areas ...it literally just comes across as he's a good passer

I don't know mate it's all a bit worrying for me , neither stones or Maguire come off great statistically

The reason I used rudiger , was many people don't think he's good enough at Chelsea


I think teams that press us high that have quality will give stones and Maguire nightmares
 
Last edited: Apr 1, 2021

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #462
I'm not a fan of Stones. Not good enough to be a defender but passing isn't good enough to be a midfielder. But he has done well this year at Man City.
 

David O'Day

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #463
CJ_covblaze said:
One the subject of Harry Kane he’s clearly up there with the best in the world for goal scoring but it isn’t even the best part of his game. He’s so much better when he drops back and plays it to others.
Click to expand...

If he has the right players around him like he does at spurs, it's fucking awfull when he does it for England as it's normally drop deep, pass sidewards, drop deep pass sidewards.
 

Frostie

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #464
Evo1883 said:
I think teams that press us high that have quality will give stones and Maguire nightmares
Click to expand...

Don't disagree with that at all.

I think we are massively unbalanced as a squad & the wealth of attacking talent masks a whole host of problems behind them. The centre backs lack pace, all of the defence have a mistake in them, including the goalkeeper, & the Midfield is almost as problematic.
 

CJ_covblaze

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #465
David O'Day said:
If he has the right players around him like he does at spurs, it's fucking awfull when he does it for England as it's normally drop deep, pass sidewards, drop deep pass sidewards.
Click to expand...

His best performance to date for club or country was in Seville. He didn’t score but provided three assists.
 

David O'Day

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #466
CJ_covblaze said:
His best performance to date for club or country was in Seville. He didn’t score but provided three assists.
Click to expand...

Cool he had a good game, but as has already been pointed out England are not set up to play that way and be successful on a regular basis.

There's no one who plays like Son who breaks in to the gaps created behind the centre backs or runs in behind the full back so thusly the play gets slowed down.
 

Hutch11

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #467
Who do we have instead of Stones ?

There isn't exactly a plethora of top quality centre half's ready to step in
 

Ccfcisparks

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #468
The way Kane plays for Spurs hinders England as a whole. We don’t have the players to run in behind. We would be much better as a team if he stuck on the CB.
 
Reactions: Evo1883

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #469
Ccfcisparks said:
The way Kane plays for Spurs hinders England as a whole. We don’t have the players to run in behind. We would be much better as a team if he stuck on the CB.
Click to expand...

He’s overrated anyway according to Nick
 

covmark

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #470
Grendel said:
He’s overrated anyway according to Nick
Click to expand...
Mental. He's the one world class player we have.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #471
If he was Brazilian he'd be appreciated more
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #472
Hutch11 said:
Who do we have instead of Stones ?

There isn't exactly a plethora of top quality centre half's ready to step in
Click to expand...
I think half of Stones’ issue is that he’s always got to have in his mind that he has to cover Maguire as he is SOOOOO slow. He ends up caught between what he wants to do and what he has to do to protect his partner.
 

Wyken Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #473
I'd rather play Coady than Maguire

Sent from my I3113 using Tapatalk
 
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Ccfcisparks

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #474
Grendel said:
He’s overrated anyway according to Nick
Click to expand...
He’s clearly clueless then, he will probably end up being the best English striker of all time or close to.
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #475
Ccfcisparks said:
He’s clearly clueless then, he will probably end up being the best English striker of all time or close to.
Click to expand...
I mean technically he's a long way off In terms of top flight goals
 

Ccfcisparks

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #476
Evo1883 said:
I mean technically he's a long way off View attachment 19409
Click to expand...
I’m talking more for England really, probably end up all time top scorer. Although if he has a good career and stays injury free then he might even reach shearer! He’s only 27, and got 180 goals, quite amazing really.
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #477
Ccfcisparks said:
I’m talking more for England really, probably end up all time top scorer. Although if he has a good career and stays injury free then he might even reach shearer! He’s only 27, and got 180 goals, quite amazing really.
Click to expand...
He should definitely end up England's top goalscorer , although in my eyes we've had some better strikers...for example Michael Owen would have scored many many more for England if he wasn't a sick note ..and Rooney wasn't pushed back to midfield .

I like kane btw ..Shearer a better striker but kane all round better
 

Ccfcisparks

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #478
Evo1883 said:
He should definitely end up England's top goalscorer , although in my eyes we've had some better strikers...for example Michael Owen would have scored many many more for England if he wasn't a sick note ..and Rooney wasn't pushed back to midfield .

I like kane btw ..Shearer a better striker but kane all round better
Click to expand...
I could see Kane doing what Rooney did and dropping back deeper. It’s good for him that he’s got it in his locker, although it doesn’t mean he’s utilised as an out and out clinical striker like Shearer was.
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #479
Ccfcisparks said:
I could see Kane doing what Rooney did and dropping back deeper. It’s good for him that he’s got it in his locker, although it doesn’t mean he’s utilised as an out and out clinical striker like Shearer was.
Click to expand...
I hope that doesn't happen though as I think it was the start of Rooney decline . Rooney was very good at his peak
 
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Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #480
I mean Shearer was just an out and out goalscorer , fucking power on this
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 1, 2021
  • #481
Speaking of euros was just watching some old euro 2000 goals ...look at the state of this team
 
Reactions: wingy and Deleted member 11652

CJ_covblaze

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 2, 2021
  • #482
Kane will probably go down as the best English striker ever. He’s already scored 265 and he’s only 27.
 

Frostie

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 2, 2021
  • #483
Ccfcisparks said:
The way Kane plays for Spurs hinders England as a whole. We don’t have the players to run in behind. We would be much better as a team if he stuck on the CB.
Click to expand...

Yep. Not really Kane's fault but with all the attacking midfield talent around him we really need him to be a more orthodox 9. This will be why the likes of Grealish and/or Foden won't start, too many players who want the ball to feet & nothing that's going to stretch defences. Only ones who can do that are Rashford, Sancho, Saka.
Again, shows the lack of balance we have.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 2, 2021
  • #484
Ian1779 said:
I think half of Stones’ issue is that he’s always got to have in his mind that he has to cover Maguire as he is SOOOOO slow. He ends up caught between what he wants to do and what he has to do to protect his partner.
Click to expand...

Wouldn't explain why he made the same errors at Man City and Everton before that. Fact is for a central defender he's pretty decent with the ball at his feet. Trouble is sometimes he seems to get it in his head he's Zidane or someone and his touch lets him down.

He's the kind of defender I'd press high on as often as possible because you'll get mistakes out of him. Teams don't do it much because he plays for Man City so they sit deep, scared in case they get hit by one of their lightning quick attacks.
 

Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 2, 2021
  • #485
 
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B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 2, 2021
  • #486
CJ_covblaze said:
Kane will probably go down as the best English striker ever. He’s already scored 265 and he’s only 27.
Click to expand...

Perhaps just childhood nostalgia but none better than Shearer for me
 

SBAndy

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 2, 2021
  • #487
Evo1883 said:
View attachment 19417
Click to expand...

Absolutely no chance.
 

Terry Gibson's perm

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 2, 2021
  • #488
Evo1883 said:
View attachment 19417
Click to expand...

Got to fit those right backs and defensive midfielders in the squad somewhere
 

mark82

Super Moderator
  • Apr 3, 2021
  • #489
Evo1883 said:
View attachment 19417
Click to expand...

Won't happen, but if it did they should just sack him on the spot and let someone else pick the squad.
 

Frostie

Well-Known Member
  • Apr 3, 2021
  • #490
Evo1883 said:
View attachment 19417
Click to expand...

The reason the headline doesn't name the 'news outlets' is because it's the Sun & the Daily Mail...

Both are just clickbait anyway all "could" & "might" speculation to try & sell papers.
 
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