Do you want to discuss boring politics? (20 Viewers)

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I've said before I'd say MP's pay rises should be capped at the lowest pay rise throughout the public sector.

No we should just pay those professions properly in the first place and make a meaningful effort to improve their working conditions.

 

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[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

No, I find it utterly depressing that there is essentially not a hair's breadth between their positions on the things that matter to me. We get right wing governments because we put up with nonsense like this.

But we have to face the fact that the only time we've had a Labour/non right wing government in my lifetime is when it moved more to the right. Would you say that that government, even though not ideologically what we'd want, was still massively different to what we've seen from the Tories?

Whether we like it or not, there are far too many people that have been indoctrinated into right-wing thinking and are automatically sceptical when you say things like socialism, even if it would be better for them.

Corbyn had two elections and lost both. I think the Tories would feel far more confident of winning the next one, even despite the shitshow, if he were still in charge because they know they can just press those buttons.

I've said before that I think a lot of the recent Labour leaders have been let down by advisors trying to make them appeal to as many people as possible, and thus come across as disingenuous. At this point the Tories are showing their incompetence and are losing themselves the next election. Rocking the boat is only likely to make it less likely Labour will win. Right now, the objective is to make sure they get into power, then they can start making changes. Acting like a left wing firebrand is not going to help achieve that aim.

Of course he can't win - go left wing and Tories push that button and say he's a threat to the economy or stay more to the centre and get accused of just being a Tory in disguise. I'm sure the Tories love hearing people say they think Starmer is little different to them so why vote for him. They know he'd be different.

 

[shmmeee]

Also you have to tack right socially for voters. And you have to do it even more if you’re left wing to cut through. Anyone who thinks the next Parliament is identical in outcome regardless of party is mental.

 

[fernandopartridge]

(1) But we have to face the fact that the only time we've had a Labour/non right wing government in my lifetime is when it moved more to the right. Would you say that that government, even though not ideologically what we'd want, was still massively different to what we've seen from the Tories?

(2) Whether we like it or not, there are far too many people that have been indoctrinated into right-wing thinking and are automatically sceptical when you say things like socialism, even if it would be better for them.

(3) Corbyn had two elections and lost both. I think the Tories would feel far more confident of winning the next one, even despite the shitshow, if he were still in charge because they know they can just press those buttons.

(4) I've said before that I think a lot of the recent Labour leaders have been let down by advisors trying to make them appeal to as many people as possible, and thus come across as disingenuous. At this point the Tories are showing their incompetence and are losing themselves the next election. Rocking the boat is only likely to make it less likely Labour will win. Right now, the objective is to make sure they get into power, then they can start making changes. Acting like a left wing firebrand is not going to help achieve that aim.

(5) Of course he can't win - go left wing and Tories push that button and say he's a threat to the economy or stay more to the centre and get accused of just being a Tory in disguise. I'm sure the Tories love hearing people say they think Starmer is little different to them so why vote for him. They know he'd be different.

(1) No
(2) Where have I said he should say 'socialism' - it's hardly an exclusively socialist ideal to make sure that payment for services rendered keeps pace with inflation
(3) Why are you talking about Corbyn?
(4) Rocking the boat? People are skint. The boat is very unsteady for many as it is.
(5) Please refer to (2)

 

[fernandopartridge]

Also you have to tack right socially for voters. And you have to do it even more if you’re left wing to cut through. Anyone who thinks the next Parliament is identical in outcome regardless of party is mental.

Based on nothing but hope. Labour isn't even promising to improve outcomes, just "growth".

 

[shmmeee]

Based on nothing but hope. Labour isn't even promising to improve outcomes, just "growth".

Based on the evidence of the positions of the 350 odd Labour MPs who are likely to be elected.

What do you mean outcomes?

 

[fernandopartridge]

Based on the evidence of the positions of the 350 odd Labour MPs who are likely to be elected.

What do you mean outcomes?

As in more prosperous people, improved health and wellbeing, improvements in life expectancy. I've not heard anything positive at all just some information about crackdowns.

Kier Starmer's missions barely touch on any of it, the 5th one is just a high-level statement with absolutely no detail at all - we're 12 months out from an election. You cannot promise nothing but competence as people just won't vote and that's ideal for the Tories. I think it's likely the Tories will offer income tax cuts early next year, I'm sure Labour offering to freeze Council Tax will compete with it.

 

[skybluetony176]

TBF MP wages have not kept pace with inflation either, using RPI as the measure they're way below what they should be. I'd be reluctant to tie pay rises to something in the gift of MPs to manipulate, it should be against one of the recognised inflation measures (albeit RPI isn't properly recognised any more). Post 2010 austerity has not been good for anybody.

That said, MPs have the benefit of having all of their work related expenses and even accommodation paid for, so difficult to compare:

View attachment 29008

Compared to NHS staff though. They keep spouting this nonsense that we’re all in it together and everyone has to take some pain. Clearly some public sector workers are in it more than others and are taking more pain than others. My wife works in an NHS department and is on the top rate of the scale for her job so has basically had a pay freeze for the majority of the last 13 years and the few rises (2 in the last 13 years from memory) she has had have been circa 1% from memory. And like you say, my wife has no work related expenses, even the pension isn’t that good anymore which was always the draw of being a civil servant.

 

[skybluetony176]

More Jacob Rees Moggs and Jeremy hunts then

Yeah, thank god the party in power isn’t full of them types thanks to the current MP’s pay structure.

 

[skybluetony176]

Oh dear. The SNP are in a right state. Covid restriction 2021 campaign bus my arse. If they really needed it for that why didn’t just rent one, why was it parked at Sturgeon’s mother in law’s driveway and why was the current leader who was a senior party member completely unaware of it?

Humza Yousaf told of SNP motorhome after becoming leader

The luxury vehicle was seized by police as part of an investigation into the party's finances.

www.bbc.co.uk

Plus why wasn’t it sold after the 2021 campaign? It will be interesting to know how many miles it’s clocked up since it was purchased with SNP funds.

 

[dutchman]

I see even Rayner has distanced herself from the smear campaign:

Rayner says Labour attack ad was ‘hard-hitting’ but refuses to give full backing

Deputy leader says she did not share ad about child sexual abuse convictions because she was spending Easter with family

www.theguardian.com

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

As in more prosperous people, improved health and wellbeing, improvements in life expectancy. I've not heard anything positive at all just some information about crackdowns.

Kier Starmer's missions barely touch on any of it, the 5th one is just a high-level statement with absolutely no detail at all - we're 12 months out from an election. You cannot promise nothing but competence as people just won't vote and that's ideal for the Tories. I think it's likely the Tories will offer income tax cuts early next year, I'm sure Labour offering to freeze Council Tax will compete with it.

So are you saying you think that Starmer should get into a tax cut battle with the Tories?

I suspect what you're saying is that you'd rather see Starmer talk about using the tax to improve services and offer better pay etc. rather than just ape Tory policy. Trouble is seeing how a lot of people in this country seem to think I reckon they'd go for the tax cuts.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Hope no one has a trip to France planned this weekend. Riots surely incoming.

France pension reforms: Macron signs pension age rise to 64 into law

President Macron makes the unpopular reforms law despite widespread protests in Paris and other cities.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[clint van damme]

Not sure I'd use the term lost

UK government fraud crisis: Up to £58b lost in 2021 alone

UK government fraud failures mean up to £58.8 billion was lost in 2021 alone, excluding Covid support scheme fraud, with data silos rampant.

thestack.technology

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Starmer in the crowd at the Arsenal game. Is he sure it’s wise to support a team in red?

 

[SBT]

Starmer in the crowd at the Arsenal game. Is he sure it’s wise to support a team in red?

Still a few points ahead of the blue team, but the gap is closing

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Still a few points ahead of the blue team, but the gap is closing

Rishi Sunak bottom of the league sadly for him.

 

[dutchman]

Whereas Starmer is top of the table for scoring own goals.

 

[fernandopartridge]

It's appropriate that he follows a team that throw away leads

 

[skybluetony176]

Sunak having a nightmare today. Firstly his statement on math’s education has fallen mainly on deaf ears, unless you include people looking into the government’s record on recruiting math teachers



And now he’s facing an investigation

Rishi Sunak investigated over declaration of interest

The prime minister faces a declaration of interest inquiry over a childcare firm his wife has shares in.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

Sunak having a nightmare today. Firstly his statement on math’s education has fallen mainly on deaf ears, unless you include people looking into the government’s record on recruiting math teachers



And now he’s facing an investigation

Rishi Sunak investigated over declaration of interest

The prime minister faces a declaration of interest inquiry over a childcare firm his wife has shares in.

www.bbc.co.uk

His wife has shares in so many companies and fields it must be hard for him to keep up.

 

[Ian1779]

Sunak having a nightmare today. Firstly his statement on math’s education has fallen mainly on deaf ears, unless you include people looking into the government’s record on recruiting math teachers



And now he’s facing an investigation

Rishi Sunak investigated over declaration of interest

The prime minister faces a declaration of interest inquiry over a childcare firm his wife has shares in.

www.bbc.co.uk

When is Johnathon Gillis coming out to tell us that ‘maths is woke’

 

[David O'Day]

When is Johnathon Gillis coming out to tell us that ‘maths is woke’

Always said Princethorpe College was full of wrongs uns

 

[chiefdave]

"Adults should be able to do maths"

Statistics watchdog rebukes Sunak over inaccurate asylum backlog figures

Head of UK Statistics Authority says outstanding cases had risen, not halved as PM had claimed

www.theguardian.com

 

[BodicoteSkyBlue]

Didn’t know Phil Mitchell was the treasurer of the SNP

 

[David O'Day]

awks

 

[fernandopartridge]

Fancy being outwitted by this boring Tory c**t

 

[David O'Day]

Fancy being outwitted by this boring Tory c**t

nicely edited before the reply

it ended with sunak being reduced to thinkinh "sir softie" was a killer line

 

[fernandopartridge]

nicely edited before the reply

it ended with sunak being reduced to thinkinh "sir softie" was a killer line

Great

 

[1nilandwe...]

PMQs was an embarrassment today. The whole thing was a shambles, and poorly controlled by the Speaker, but then the exchanges were basically..

"You don't hate the bad guys enough"
"No, you don't hate the bad guys. We are trying to stop the bad guys"
"I hate the bad guys, you seem to love the bad guys"
"No, you love the bad guys, and all of your mates do too"

I get that Starmer is supposed to be appealling to a certain section of voters that might switch from blue to red, but Jesus wept.
And then this "Sir Softie, soft on crime" stuff?
Who is advising these people?!

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

PMQs was an embarrassment today. The whole thing was a shambles, and poorly controlled by the Speaker, but then the exchanges were basically..

"You don't hate the bad guys enough"
"No, you don't hate the bad guys. We are trying to stop the bad guys"
"I hate the bad guys, you seem to love the bad guys"
"No, you love the bad guys, and all of your mates do too"

I get that Starmer is supposed to be appealling to a certain section of voters that might switch from blue to red, but Jesus wept.
And then this "Sir Softie, soft on crime" stuff?
Who is advising these people?!

What it really highlights is what they think of the general public

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

What it really highlights is what they think of the general public

Yeah
Thats why Farage can be the answer which is outrageous
The labour movement representing their peers those many decades ago and forming the Labour Party has long lost its meaning and livelihood
I wonder if there’s is a person that can unite the populace from within the party system or if that sort of democracy is dead

 

[duffer]

Yeah
Thats why Farage can be the answer which is outrageous
The labour movement representing their peers those many decades ago and forming the Labour Party has long lost its meaning and livelihood
I wonder if there’s is a person that can unite the populace from within the party system or if that sort of democracy is dead

Entirely my personal opinion Pete, but I don't think that sort of person would actually be allowed to be a part of the current Labour party.

They're currently too busy fighting for the Daily Mail vote to allow someone who stands up for the poor, the oppressed, or the working class, to rock the boat.

I'd like to think that this lunatic attack approach isn't really Starmer's idea, but maybe, like his apparent honesty, his supposed fundamental decency is also just a thin veneer. Maybe it'll turn out that his much-claimed competency is just a fart in the wind too...

 

[dutchman]

Farage is a bigger threat to the Tories than Starmer.

 

[David O'Day]

the whole rabb situation makes sunak look awful, well even more awful.

if the report cleared hi they would of announced straight away but they ae trying to find a way to spin it so he can keep his job