Lots of people have gone to jail for it. What do you think needs to be done about it? Can you please spell it out.
Who ensured the report was done
Answer the questionIn the minds of the victims-turned-campaigners, clearly not enough people have gone to jail.
There are more pertinent questions actually. First, do you believe the authorities have done enough on this? Second, do you believe there is ethnic/religious dimension to this? Third, do you believe there has been a cover up? Finally, should people be angry about this?
You don’t believe the more information from the report,It’s another embarrassing U-turn for the government, but at least he’s done it. Even if that makes him and his cabinet ‘far right’ now!
There’s been that many U-turns by this government already, it’s a worrying trend of bad political judgement.
As it has been for numerous governments of many parties over the years.It’s another embarrassing U-turn for the government, but at least he’s done it. Even if that makes him and his cabinet ‘far right’ now!
There’s been that many U-turns by this government already, it’s a worrying trend of bad political judgement.
As it has been for numerous governments of many parties over the years.
Answer the question
Do I believe the authorities have done enough?In the minds of the victims-turned-campaigners, clearly not enough people have gone to jail.
There are more pertinent questions actually. First, do you believe the authorities have done enough on this? Second, do you believe there is ethnic/religious dimension to this? Third, do you believe there has been a cover up? Finally, should people be angry about this?
Think there has to be questions on why it took so long from the first reported case in 2001 to get the first convictions in 2010.Do I believe there has been a cover up?
No, numerous convictions and there has already been the Jay report. What's being covered up?
FFS the enquiry is about organised gangs and you are proving yourselves to be a bunch of barrack room lawyers keen to debate the technical meaning of rape.
Pathetic.
Headlines chief?
No the enquiry is about child sexual exploitation. You just only care if you get to shout about brown people. Disgusting TBH.
Think its important not to group all victims together as they are not all of the same opinion. There is certainly a group that want another inquiry, and as they have some political figures involved who receive a lot of media coverage this message is possibly getting a disproportionate level of coverage.In the minds of the victims-turned-campaigners, clearly not enough people have gone to jail.
These are both already things aren't they? The re-opening of hundreds of cases was announced in January and we already have a mechanism for deporting non-UK criminals, albeit one that could probably do with improvement. Again, this is not something that needs a new inquiry that could potentially delay things by years.Reopen cold cases to prosecute more perpetrators. Deport any non-UK born criminals successfully convicted.
The first sentence should be easy enough to verify. To prove the second though, you’ll need evidence that similar crimes carried out by white British people were still investigated, or investigated more thoroughly than those by other groups.Yes, and what it find about the perpetrators of this? A disproportionate amount of the crimes were committed by non-UK nationals.
There was a systematic unwillingness to investigate those crimes due to fears of being labelled racist and/or inflaming community tensions.
That second paragraph is the actual scandal. We allowed this to happen because the perpetrators and victims were inconvenient for the authorities.
The first sentence should be easy enough to verify. To prove the second though, you’ll need evidence that similar crimes carried out by white British people were still investigated, or investigated more thoroughly than those by other groups.
I genuinely don’t know if that is the case.
That still doesn’t address the point.The Casey report said there was an unwillingness to investigate. Witness statements were altered and any mention of the offenders being Pakistani removed. It is a national scandal and the defensiveness and deflection on here just seems odd.
The Casey report said there was an unwillingness to investigate. Witness statements were altered and any mention of the offenders being Pakistani removed. It is a national scandal and the defensiveness and deflection on here just seems odd.
You laugh above, but the proof has not been given that there was discrimination against white British sex offenders.In a nutshell, this is what the scandal actually is. The report hasn’t stated that there was an unwillingness to go after white perpetrators because there is insufficient evidence. The evidence in the case of Pakistani perpetrators, the local authorities just did not want
The defensiveness and deflection is galling.
Even Baroness Casey’s comments of ‘being a gift racists’ is a slip of the mask that demonstrates why this was covered up. The truth is uncomfortable for our society to digest.
Starting to wonder if this will open in my lifetime. How are we so bad at infrastructure.The opening of HS2 will be delayed beyond the target date of 2033, the government will announce but it is not expected to say when the high speed railway line will begin operating.
And here was I thinking this was a scandal about girls being abused.In a nutshell, this is what the scandal actually is.
Yes, and what it find about the perpetrators of this? A disproportionate amount of the crimes were committed by non-UK nationals.
There was a systematic unwillingness to investigate those crimes due to fears of being labelled racist and/or inflaming community tensions.
That second paragraph is the actual scandal. We allowed this to happen because the perpetrators and victims were inconvenient for the authorities.
Thank you and that makes a huge amount of senseThis is the data from the original report
View attachment 43705
The Casey report then tries to factor in unrecorded ethnicity
View attachment 43707
So essentially we're back to what Casey said yesterday which is, despite numerous reports saying a change is needed, the data on ethnicity is very poor.
This is my concern with another inquiry really, we keep repeating the same process, draw roughly the same conclusions and do fuck all.
Great pointThe first sentence should be easy enough to verify. To prove the second though, you’ll need evidence that similar crimes carried out by white British people were still investigated, or investigated more thoroughly than those by other groups.
I genuinely don’t know if that is the case.
Great point
Yes it is and I’ve explained how that is downstream of the issue of accepting teenagers in inappropriate relationships. The stats show Pakistani origin men are overrepresented. Not that it’s exclusively Pakistani men. Kick all Pakistanis out as Douglas Carswell is currently arguing would not solve this problem.
What is the policy solution you are proposing? Is it by any chance “stop all immigration” like it is for every other policy challenge in the country?
No, it isn’t. The claim made is that these crimes weren’t investigated because of the racial profile of the offenders. That has not been proven and cannot be without evidence that ‘homegrown’ offenders were investigated but foreign ones were dismissed.Its missing the points that Casey made and diverting to something else - which seems very odd
No, it isn’t. The claim made is that these crimes weren’t investigated because of the racial profile of the offenders. That has not been proven and cannot be without evidence that ‘homegrown’ offenders were investigated but foreign ones were dismissed.
Again, you also have never worked with children.
It’s saying one needs a comparator to say whether one particular group or another recieved preferential treatmentIts missing the points that Casey made and diverting to something else - which seems very odd
That’s a brave clear statment claimed as factIts nothing to do with "accepting teenagers in inappropriate relationships" - I'd love to see you tell the victims that. Some were as young as 10 and were turned into prostitutes where a succession of men would one after the other rape them. Some were mentally traumatised already and some were disabled.
There were no "relationships"
Which is good evidence of a comparatorSo you dispute the findings? Fair enough but I would politely suggest her research is a bit more in depth than a guy on the internet.
Why was the racial profile of the offenders doctored in witness statements? Do you honestly believe if a person was white the word white would have been removed from a witness statement?
What happened in Rotherham is not in dispute, nor are the wider statistics. But for a national inquiry, I’d expect to see nationwide evidence of the police dismissing some demographics and pursuing others.So you dispute the findings? Fair enough but I would politely suggest her research is a bit more in depth than a guy on the internet.
Why was the racial profile of the offenders doctored in witness statements? Do you honestly believe if a person was white the word white would have been removed from a witness statement?
The first sentence should be easy enough to verify. To prove the second though, you’ll need evidence that similar crimes carried out by white British people were still investigated, or investigated more thoroughly than those by other groups.
I genuinely don’t know if that is the case.
And here was I thinking this was a scandal about girls being abused.
Make no mistake, the attempts to play down the ethnic elements of this abuse which may have helped to allow it to continue are an outrageous scandal, and if this enquiry brings those responsible to justice then I’m all for it. But if it serves as a vehicle to turn this scandal solely into a question of the merits of multiculturalism then I don’t see how that properly serves the victims.
Yes it is and I’ve explained how that is downstream of the issue of accepting teenagers in inappropriate relationships. The stats show Pakistani origin men are overrepresented. Not that it’s exclusively Pakistani men. Kick all Pakistanis out as Douglas Carswell is currently arguing would not solve this problem.
What is the policy solution you are proposing? Is it by any chance “stop all immigration” like it is for every other policy challenge in the country?
We do deport foreign criminals the laws have been there for a whileWhy bring it up? It hasn’t been brought up in the report.
It’s odd that you and Shhmeee talk about ‘inappropriate relationships’ between 16-17 year olds and people in their 20s. Yes, it’s odd but the legal age of consent is 16. The report is talking about specific organised gangs that targeted underage girls that were vastly overrepresented in certain ethnic groups.
The actual scandal is that the authorities knew what was going on but did not investigate suspects/prosecute perpetrators to the fullest extent of the law because they were concerned with being labelled racist and ‘inflaming community tensions’. This obviously exacerbated the problems in those communities because perpetrators were given carte blanche to commit offences.
There’s testimonies of ex-Labour MPs where they were told by party HQ to specifically not mention the ethnicity of offenders. Likewise, Dominic Cummings claims he’s seen documents where the DoE has been involved in cover ups.
It’s a scandal. Not only did establishment know about it, they gaslit the public by insisting that white perpetrators were the problem and therefore, any focus on other ethnic group meant you were racist and didn’t actually care about victims.
Incidents like this really does call into question the UK’s immigration policies post-1997. If our society fragments into community of communities, that’s not good. Different cultures have different values and what happens if this becomes a source of conflict?
It’s not a downstream and you’re fundamentally wrong on this. There’s not ‘relationships’, this is systemic raping of young girls where often there were 10s of people involved. In fact, there are multiple testimonies of people where they claimed to name around 100 perpetrators. This isn’t a ‘downstream of accepting teenagers in inappropriate relationships’.
Douglas Carswell wants to deport all offenders. Which, find me an ordinary person who doesn’t want to deport violent criminals? Even a majority of Green voters would deport criminals where sexual assault is concerned. This is a policy that is overwhelmingly supported by the public yet you mock it as extreme. Out of touch.
The policies? Be more selective when granting visas of low income migrants and deport foreign criminals and if the ECHR or Human Rights Act prevents this, then we need to look at amending the HRA and/or leaving the ECHR.
The ‘stop all immigration’ trope is just you lashing out because you’ve got no facts to fall back on.
We do deport foreign criminals the laws have been there for a while
Obviously tricky to deport a British person unless you change the law to include second generation immigrants. Don’t think that would work really
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?