Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (14 Viewers)

[fernandopartridge]

Week 17 : 21/05/20 - 27/05/20 355,167

End of May when they were telling us they were about to be testing 200k people a day they were actually only testing 355k for the whole week

Amazing

Remember saying it was about 50k a day. No mention oh this on the news. The media in this country is pathetic

 

---

[Sky Blue Pete]

Spain infections creeping up almost 1000

 

[chiefdave]

Week 17 : 21/05/20 - 27/05/20 355,167

End of May when they were telling us they were about to be testing 200k people a day they were actually only testing 355k for the whole week

Amazing

Its appalling, no wonder they have stopped saying how many people are tested every day. We were promised 100K people at day tested by the end of April, Week 13 (23 - 29 April) had 179,460 in total, an average of 25,637.

Then it was 200K a day by the end of May and as DOD says Week 17 has a total of 355,167, a daily average of 50,738.

So basically we've been getting a quarter of the tests promised. No doubt there will be zero consequences as usual. Watching this complete shambles of a government and then seeing poll after poll showing Labour failing to make any inroads into the Conservative lead is so frustrating.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Week 17 : 21/05/20 - 27/05/20 355,167

End of May when they were telling us they were about to be testing 200k people a day they were actually only testing 355k for the whole week

Amazing

They'll get away with it though. They always get away with it. Part of that is a largely compliant media but part is also an opposition that's too scared to put the boot in like it was with the great abstainers of 2015.

 

[fernandopartridge]

They'll get away with it though. They always get away with it. Part of that is a largely compliant media but part is also an opposition that's too scared to put the boot in like it was with the great abstainers of 2015.

Starmer is given open goal after open goal but is passing it around in the six yard box. You've got to play them at their own game. Use what they said and throw it back at them in the most vulgar way possible imo.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Starmer is given open goal after open goal but is passing it around in the six yard box. You've got to play them at their own game. Use what they said and throw it back at them in the most vulgar way possible imo.

He's gone full Chaplin

 

[chiefdave]

Lets hope this doesn't turn out to be a huge mistake as the consequences could be very serious
UK opts out of EU Covid-19 vaccine scheme

 

[clint van damme]

Lets hope this doesn't turn out to be a huge mistake as the consequences could be very serious
UK opts out of EU Covid-19 vaccine scheme

without clicking the link or reading the article I'm going to guess that joining this scheme will deny the tories the opportunity to award a lucrative government contract to something resembling a shell company owned by one of their cronies? How did I do?

 

[Ian1779]

They'll get away with it though. They always get away with it. Part of that is a largely compliant media but part is also an opposition that's too scared to put the boot in like it was with the great abstainers of 2015.

It’s OK though as they are ‘electable’ now...

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Lets hope this doesn't turn out to be a huge mistake as the consequences could be very serious
UK opts out of EU Covid-19 vaccine scheme

Sad indictment of my thoughts on this govt but my immediate thought was "got mates/donors who want the contract"

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It’s OK though as they are ‘electable’ now...

Bite the bullet and just merge Labour/Greens/LDs

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

It’s OK though as they are ‘electable’ now...

Starmer is showing his legal training. Often doesn't play well in that to do a lot of grandstanding and getting emotive. Of course there's a part of me that want him to really put the boot in on Johnson but it's become which bit do you pick? There's so many things that need to be made the most of PMQ's could last a whole day and you still wouldn't have covered them all.

Plus Johnson's forte is getting people into emotional exchanges. What he can't handle is calm, rational dissection of his statements and actions. Someone getting worked up he can do his little snide comments and get under someone's skin. When they don't rise to the bait he gets flustered, as we've seen.

Starmer's tactic is more death of a thousand cuts.

 

[clint van damme]

Starmer is showing his legal training. Often doesn't play well in that to do a lot of grandstanding and getting emotive. Of course there's a part of me that want him to really put the boot in on Johnson but it's become which bit do you pick? There's so many things that need to be made the most of PMQ's could last a whole day and you still wouldn't have covered them all.

Plus Johnson's forte is getting people into emotional exchanges. What he can't handle is calm, rational dissection of his statements and actions. Someone getting worked up he can do his little snide comments and get under someone's skin. When they don't rise to the bait he gets flustered, as we've seen.

Starmer's tactic is more death of a thousand cuts.

if that's his tactic it's not working.
I keep going back to Jenrick but he should have put the tories under so much pressure to get rid of him they had no choice.

Having just come out of austerity and now with the economy taking another hit due to the pandemic he managed to deprive some of the most needy communities in the country of 40 million in return for a 12 grand donation to the tory party.
Starmer last mentioned it two weeks ago and said we haven't heard the last, well when are we going to hear more. He's let them off the hook big time.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Bite the bullet and just merge Labour/Greens/LDs

As much as I think some sort of agreement between them to gain power they can't merge - the differences would tear it apart. Labour already has enough keeping the left and right of their party from self destructing. Add in the more right wing economics of the LD's and the 'woke' social policy of the hardcore left greens and it'll implode.

It's a shame they can't see the benefit of working together and letting some stuff go to ensure they get power like the factions in the Tories do at election time. They don't seem to be able to grasp it's better to have the power to enable 20% of your plans to become reality compared to 0% of your ideal because you don't get elected. You'd never get that much change done is 5 years anyway so focus on the best/most popular bits and concentrate getting them done in office so you get another term then you can go onto the next lot. Far better chance of hitting the bullseye each time by firing one arrow at a time. Try and fore the entire quiver in one go and the only thing you're likely to hit is your own foot.

Between the three of them you've got the basis of a decent pathway

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

As much as I think some sort of agreement between them to gain power they can't merge - the differences would tear it apart. Labour already has enough keeping the left and right of their party from self destructing. Add in the more right wing economics of the LD's and the 'woke' social policy of the hardcore left greens and it'll implode.

It's a shame they can't see the benefit of working together and letting some stuff go to ensure they get power like the factions in the Tories do at election time. They don't seem to be able to grasp it's better to have the power to enable 20% of your plans to become reality compared to 0% of your ideal because you don't get elected. You'd never get that much change done is 5 years anyway so focus on the best/most popular bits and concentrate getting them done in office so you get another term then you can go onto the next lot. Far better chance of hitting the bullseye each time by firing one arrow at a time. Try and fore the entire quiver in one go and the only thing you're likely to hit is your own foot.

Between the three of them you've got the basis of a decent pathway

I was being semi facetious, I do think though that informally collaborating to stand down in different constituencies for a better chance of non Tories winning would be workable. Same in Scotland against the SNP.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

if that's his tactic it's not working.
I keep going back to Jenrick but he should have put the tories under so much pressure to get rid of him they had no choice.

Having just come out of austerity and now with the economy taking another hit due to the pandemic he managed to deprive some of the most needy communities in the country of 40 million in return for a 12 grand donation to the tory party.
Starmer last mentioned it two weeks ago and said we haven't heard the last, well when are we going to hear more. He's let them off the hook big time.

It's still way too early to say it's not working. It does feel a bit to me that those on the left are looking to criticise him at every opportunity. He's had Johnson on the run and floundering more than Corbyn ever did. His approach is more Tory-like but is that a bad thing? They do keep winning elections after all. Even when Labour won it was more along using Tory methods in elections. Being militant doesn't get you into power.

We all know if he waded in at every opportunity you'd be having the criticism of "we're in the middle of a pandemic and people are dying. Now isn't the time". It's a fine line and arguably he's erring too far on the side of caution but his law background teaches that. Don't hit go until you're certain everything is in place.

As with the Jenrick thing. That should have led to his resignation already (should really result in prosecution) but maybe Starmer is making sure he's got all the evidence he needs to not only take out Jenrick but implicate more important people and the party. After all, it was a Tory party donation, not a personal one. You don't just arrest the petty criminal in an organised gang first chance you get - you do surveillance on them to try and get bigger fish.

 

[clint van damme]

It's still way too early to say it's not working. It does feel a bit to me that those on the left are looking to criticise him at every opportunity. He's had Johnson on the run and floundering more than Corbyn ever did. His approach is more Tory-like but is that a bad thing?

i don't agree with that entirely to be honest.
I've said on here before, (probably in this thread), no way his PMQ performances have been as good as his supporters make out and no way have they been as bad as his detractors on the left would have you believe either in my opinion.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

i don't agree with that entirely to be honest.
I've said on here before, (probably in this thread), no way his PMQ performances have been as good as his supporters make out and no way have they been as bad as his detractors on the left would have you believe either in my opinion.

That's a fair comment but I still maintain that Johnson has struggled more with Starmer on the whole than he did with Corbyn. That might have been due to the lack of the backbench rabble, but he definitely hates the calm forensic dissection a lot more than a passioned argument when he can pull all the 'loony leftie' schtick and use the clown persona to make them lose their cool. I honestly think Starmeris slowly getting under his skin as his usual tactics aren't working on him and he's getting more frustrated. 'Slowly, slowly, catchy monkey'.

 

[clint van damme]

That's a fair comment but I still maintain that Johnson has struggled more with Starmer on the whole than he did with Corbyn. That might have been due to the lack of the backbench rabble, but he definitely hates the calm forensic dissection a lot more than a passioned argument when he can pull all the 'loony leftie' schtick and use the clown persona to make them lose their cool. I honestly think Starmeris slowly getting under his skin as his usual tactics aren't working on him and he's getting more frustrated. 'Slowly, slowly, catchy monkey'.

Johnson does keep going back to Starmers perceived u-turn on schools returning. It's wearing a bit thin and he can't keep going on about that forever.
It's OK using the forensic approach but I feel Starmer needs a bit more aggression.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

That's a fair comment but I still maintain that Johnson has struggled more with Starmer on the whole than he did with Corbyn. That might have been due to the lack of the backbench rabble, but he definitely hates the calm forensic dissection a lot more than a passioned argument when he can pull all the 'loony leftie' schtick and use the clown persona to make them lose their cool. I honestly think Starmeris slowly getting under his skin as his usual tactics aren't working on him and he's getting more frustrated. 'Slowly, slowly, catchy monkey'.

I guess Johnson saw Corbyn as the ‘povvo on a scholarship’ whereas Starmer is the AAA student who won’t let him copy homework.

 

[Ian1779]

Starmer is showing his legal training. Often doesn't play well in that to do a lot of grandstanding and getting emotive. Of course there's a part of me that want him to really put the boot in on Johnson but it's become which bit do you pick? There's so many things that need to be made the most of PMQ's could last a whole day and you still wouldn't have covered them all.

Plus Johnson's forte is getting people into emotional exchanges. What he can't handle is calm, rational dissection of his statements and actions. Someone getting worked up he can do his little snide comments and get under someone's skin. When they don't rise to the bait he gets flustered, as we've seen.

Starmer's tactic is more death of a thousand cuts.

I don’t mind Starmer’s forensic approach to be honest - and I very much like the removal of the baying mob at PMQ’s because both together expose Johnson. Keeping it cool and calm is fine in the right scenarios and context. But what I want to see if Starmer look like he cares about something. As the Labour leader there are some things he should be passionate about, like the things he stood on in the leadership contest.

The NHS just as one example - should be taking the government to town on this. Calling out the hypocrisy of clapping for them every week and them stinging staff with a stealth tax on parking. Listening to Johnson taking about how nurses ‘saved’ his life and them failing to remunerate them adequately or not reinstate bursaries. Corbyn would have taken them to task on this, and public support would be there for it.... it’s so illogical.

 

[chiefdave]

For me the forensic approach as it keeps being called isn't fair removed from Corbyn's stance - two sides of the same coin. Look back at when Corbyn was first appointed leader and you'll see articles very similar to those about Starmer now. Praising him for not getting involved in shouting matches at PMQs "week-to-week, these quieter sessions are Jeremy Corbyn’s best approach to tussling with David Cameron".

Of course that doesn't translate to a soundbite for the 6 o'clock news or the next days papers. There's a danger of history repeating itself here. Lots of backslapping from Labour supporters on twitter about Starmer 'winning' PMQs but a failure to cut through to the wider electorate. The polls would certainly suggest that is the case at the moment.

For Labour the concern should be that with the baying masses of the Conservative back benchers absent and a government who are an unmitigated disaster who on a virtually daily basis are experiencing things that would have brought down previous governments, or at least causing serious issues, they are failing to make inroads. Yes it is years from the next election but that shouldn't allow complacency.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

I don’t mind Starmer’s forensic approach to be honest - and I very much like the removal of the baying mob at PMQ’s because both together expose Johnson. Keeping it cool and calm is fine in the right scenarios and context. But what I want to see if Starmer look like he cares about something. As the Labour leader there are some things he should be passionate about, like the things he stood on in the leadership contest.

The NHS just as one example - should be taking the government to town on this. Calling out the hypocrisy of clapping for them every week and them stinging staff with a stealth tax on parking. Listening to Johnson taking about how nurses ‘saved’ his life and them failing to remunerate them adequately or not reinstate bursaries. Corbyn would have taken them to task on this, and public support would be there for it.... it’s so illogical.

I get that, esp about the NHS. And while Corbyn would've made more of it, do we think it'd have been effective? It's an approach that consistently got batted away quite easily.

I'm hoping that Starmer is storing this up for later as surely an inquiry into this fiasco has to follow - just hit them with an absolute bombardment when they can't use the Covid crisis to deflect. When one issue is losing traction hit them with the next.

Doing so now I can just see the accusations of him using the NHS as a political football and it's not like it's going to have an effect in changing government. We've got 4 years until an election. Just because you've got the ammo now doesn't mean it's best or most effective to just fire it off because you can. Don't be afraid to store it up and use it on a big offensive later.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

For me the forensic approach as it keeps being called isn't fair removed from Corbyn's stance - two sides of the same coin. Look back at when Corbyn was first appointed leader and you'll see articles very similar to those about Starmer now. Praising him for not getting involved in shouting matches at PMQs "week-to-week, these quieter sessions are Jeremy Corbyn’s best approach to tussling with David Cameron".

Of course that doesn't translate to a soundbite for the 6 o'clock news or the next days papers. There's a danger of history repeating itself here. Lots of backslapping from Labour supporters on twitter about Starmer 'winning' PMQs but a failure to cut through to the wider electorate. The polls would certainly suggest that is the case at the moment.

For Labour the concern should be that with the baying masses of the Conservative back benchers absent and a government who are an unmitigated disaster who on a virtually daily basis are experiencing things that would have brought down previous governments, or at least causing serious issues, they are failing to make inroads. Yes it is years from the next election but that shouldn't allow complacency.

And for me Corbyn became less effective when he did start getting more vocal and passionate.

 

[clint van damme]

I'm hoping that Starmer is storing this up for later as surely an inquiry into this fiasco has to follow

waiting for an inquiry with this government would be a huge mistake.
We're still waiting on the Russia report and the Patel bullying inquiry and it also looks as though he's waiting for one on Jenricks antics. The longer the wait the less potency they'll carry.
And with Starmer dragging his feet on the leaked Labour report he'd be putting himself on thin ice.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

That bus driver in France who got attacked for telling passengers to put their masks on has had his life support machine switched off.

What an absolutely cowardly act.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

waiting for an inquiry with this government would be a huge mistake.
We're still waiting on the Russia report and the Patel bullying inquiry and it also looks as though he's waiting for one on Jenricks antics. The longer the wait the less potency they'll carry.
And with Starmer dragging his feet on the leaked Labour report he'd be putting himself on thin ice.

And if we don't get one hit them with that.

The Covid crisis is a difficult situation to negotiate. These things need looking into but right now it's too easy to be hit with the retort of "national crisis and you;re trying to political point score". They've already tried it when faced with criticism, saying there should be support during these times.

It does feel like the Tories are using the Trump playbook of throwing so much shit at once you can't focus on one because no sooner than you do they've done something else outrageous and it's "why aren't you mentioning that?"

Like if the kids are simultaneously jumping on the sofa while trying to jab a fork into the plug socket, writing on the walls and throwing the keys and phone down the toilet. Individually you'd be able to concentrate and tell them off. All at once and you're left paralysed as to what to sort first So write it all down and deal with them when it's calmed down a bit and ultimately they'll be less likely to get away with some of it which they will if you try and deal with it all at once.

 

[clint van damme]

And if we don't get one hit them with that.

The Covid crisis is a difficult situation to negotiate. These things need looking into but right now it's too easy to be hit with the retort of "national crisis and you;re trying to political point score". They've already tried it when faced with criticism, saying there should be support during these times.

It does feel like the Tories are using the Trump playbook of throwing so much shit at once you can't focus on one because no sooner than you do they've done something else outrageous and it's "why aren't you mentioning that?"

Like if the kids are simultaneously jumping on the sofa while trying to jab a fork into the plug socket, writin

I think you're massively over estimating the British publics appetite for truth and accountability from their government.

 

[Rusty Trombone]

An old clip, and not covid related, but a great Alan Partridge impression here by Matt Hancock.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

I think you're massively over estimating the British publics appetite for truth and accountability from their government.

I think you may be right, although I really think a lot of that is down to them just following their favoured right wing media opinion.

Mail etc tell them to get angry at Corbyn because his plans will bankrupt the country. Tories find the magic money tree and they tell them to laud them for their brave spending plans. Tell them all our ills are due to the EU and immigrants and they're straight on it. Maybe it's a confirmation bias and yet repeatng back to them what they already think and this provides them with the 'evidence'.

But it still needs to be done and ensure it's not biased or whitewashing or we're at a point where anyone can get away with practically anything. We're perilously close to that right now - both incompetence and corruption are rife and almost blatant and it needs to be dealt with severely, not with a couple of questions at PMQ's. We're beyond that.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

820 infections not great
148 deaths really not great at all

137 deaths last Saturday

oh well

 

[fernandopartridge]

820 infections not great
148 deaths really not great at all

137 deaths last Saturday

oh well

Seen some posts on twittee suggesting it's about 10 weeks for it to progress back up into big numbers after lockdown, that's what's happened in the American states where there has been a bigger second wave. Therefore October might see it here.

 

[clint van damme]

Bloody hell

 

[Skybluefaz]

Bloody hell

They are a different breed of entitled fucking idiots over there in the states. I heard an ex BBC reporter on the radio who now lives in Arizona telling the story about how a local politician was trying to encourage the use of face masks and the reply was 'only God has the right to tell me what to do' or some shit like that from some of the locals.

 

[clint van damme]

That bus driver in France who got attacked for telling passengers to put their masks on has had his life support machine switched off.

What an absolutely cowardly act.

those responsible may have did this for no discernible reason other than they don't like being told what to do but it certainly doesn't help the amount people buying into crackpot conspiracy theories about 5G and masks etc.
Either way utter scum.