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dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

stupot07 said:
So no mention of January?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

If this matter cannot be resolved by the turn of the year, then I and all of my colleagues on the Labour Group on Coventry City Council will look to put in place a process which ensures the best possible deal for the people of Coventry in relation to the Ricoh Arena

That was Oct 13. Unless you are trying to be pedantic the turn of the year is January in my book?

Then the follow up statement in January confirmed they were moving on.

Unfortunately for us they were not bluffing.

stupot07 · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
If this matter cannot be resolved by the turn of the year, then I and all of my colleagues on the Labour Group on Coventry City Council will look to put in place a process which ensures the best possible deal for the people of Coventry in relation to the Ricoh Arena

That was Oct 13. Unless you are trying to be pedantic the turn of the year is January in my book?

Then the follow up statement in January confirmed they were moving on.

Unfortunately for us they were not bluffing.

The best possible deal - £3.77m......

Tbf I skim read it looking for the word January.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

stupot07 said:
The best possible deal - £3.77m......

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

What is it compared to?

Rusty Trombone · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
What is it compared to?

Comparing it to keeping it, there's as yet no information to justify the sale. It seems a cheap price to me, if Higgs wanted out that's fair enough, but the Council should be looking long term. If the decision to sell now at such a price is a good deal, let's see the information.

dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

stupot07 said:
The best possible deal - £3.77m......

Tbf I skim read it looking for the word January.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

No worries I think you read CCFC's post not mine.
Weren't sure if you were demanding the specific word

I don't know if it was the best deal I just think the message was clear. Make an offer by January or we are looking elsewhere.

I think SISU had decided it was a sign of weaknesses and ACL would be broken and there was no one else. I don't think SUSU would have done the deal wasps did as I think they felt they could get even better.

I think SISU thinking the council was bluffing highlights why the council could not chance that SUSU were bluffing regarding a new stadium.

Most people did not see wasps coming.
Most people did not think we would get the move to Northampton.

The council could not chance not taking that wasps deal

letsallsingtogether · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
No worries I think you read CCFC's post not mine.
Weren't sure if you were demanding the specific word

I don't know if it was the best deal I just think the message was clear. Make an offer by January or we are looking elsewhere.

I think SISU had decided it was a sign of weaknesses and ACL would be broken and there was no one else. I don't think SUSU would have done the deal wasps did as I think they felt they could get even better.

I think SISU thinking the council was bluffing highlights why the council could not chance that SUSU were bluffing regarding a new stadium.

Most people did not see wasps coming.
Most people did not think we would get the move to Northampton.

The council could not chance not taking that wasps deal

But sisu are not to blame please look else where

dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

Rusty Trombone said:
Comparing it to keeping it, there's as yet no information to justify the sale. It seems a cheap price to me, if Higgs wanted out that's fair enough, but the Council should be looking long term. If the decision to sell now at such a price is a good deal, let's see the information.

I think it is one of them when you get the experts projecting the wealth and jobs it will generate. You will not know for a fact for years to come.
Tell you what though if SISU's lawyers lived in Coventry the wealth they are generating by telling Joy she has a good case. Would justify the sale itself as long as they bought their house on the right side of the kenilworth Road.
I just hope it doesn't cost wasps themselves anything, as I can't be arsed with another load of years wasted trying to break them!

Rusty Trombone · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
I think it is one of them when you get the experts projecting the wealth and jobs it will generate. You will not know for a fact for years to come.
Tell you what though if SISU's lawyers lived in Coventry the wealt they are generating by telling Joy she has a good case. Would generate the sake itself as long as they bought their house on the right side of the kenilworth Road.
I just hope it doesn't cost wasps themselves anything as I can't be arsed with another load of years wasted trying to break them!

If there is a sound basis for the decision what possible argument is there for not telling people what it is, just because you may not get to see the actual outcome for years shouldn't prevent the Council from explaining the logic.

dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

Rusty Trombone said:
If there is a sound basis for the decision what possible argument is there for not telling people what it is, just because you may not get to see the actual outcome for years shouldn't prevent the Council from explaining the logic.

The logic......

SISU 'we are building a new stadium outside Coventry' = job loses fall in money spent no high profile team in one of the largest cities in the country. Lowers the profile of the city.

Wasps = not perfect but goes some way to fill potential void left by CCFC. Brings fans in. Brings money into the Coventry economy. Brings job creation. Brings attention and raises the profile of the city.

You need to consider it as a a councillor not a CCFC fan

Neutral Fan · Dec 19, 2014

oldskyblue58 said:
and how does it work for say Swansea then ?

Swansea FC have the Primacy over other sports team that share the stadium.

If they didn't they couldn't be in the EPL.

Rusty Trombone · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
The logic......

SISU 'we are building a new stadium outside Coventry' = job loses fall in money spent no high profile team in one of the largest cities in the country. Lessons the profile if the city.

Wasps = not perfect but goes some way to fill potential void left by CCFC. Brings fans in. Brings money into the Coventry economy. Brings job creation. Brings attention and raises the profile of the city.

You need to consider it as a a councillor not a CCFC fan

That would justify not vetoing the sale of the Higgs shares to wasps, but doesn't explain why the Council had to sell its shares. The price seems cheap enough for wasps to still be interested in a 50% share, so wasps would still come in, all the expected benefits would still be there, with the added benefit that there's still a chance that the football club could buy into ACL in the future.

dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

Rusty Trombone said:
That would justify not vetoing the sale of the Higgs shares to wasps, but doesn't explain why the Council had to sell its shares. The price seems cheap enough for wasps to still be interested in a 50% share, so wasps would still come in, all the expected benefits would still be there, with the added benefit that there's still a chance that the football club could buy into ACL in the future.

I know what you are saying and
I don't know did wasps want all or nothing maybe?

Nick · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
I know what you are saying and
I don't know did wasps want all or nothing maybe?

It was 100% from the start though, the whole Higgs thing was a charade, as confirmed by intheknow.

Rusty Trombone · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
I know what you are saying and
I don't know did wasps want all or nothing maybe?

I can see that wasps would prefer it all, but I think they would also see that owning 50% of ACL for half the price is still better than renting in Wycombe in a small stadium without the extra revenues they can access through ACL.

Rusty Trombone · Dec 19, 2014

Nick said:
It was 100% from the start though, the whole Higgs thing was a charade, as confirmed by intheknow.

certainly it would appear that after the deal was first announced it was for 100%, I'm suggesting that better negotiations could and should have taken place, with the offer on the table only being Higgs share (assuming they were happy to sell).

ccfcway · Dec 19, 2014

CCFC said:
Jesus, you're more boring than ccfcway and his 3 weeks joke.

we cant all be as great and insightful as you !

Grendel · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
The logic......

SISU 'we are building a new stadium outside Coventry' = job loses fall in money spent no high profile team in one of the largest cities in the country. Lowers the profile of the city.

Wasps = not perfect but goes some way to fill potential void left by CCFC. Brings fans in. Brings money into the Coventry economy. Brings job creation. Brings attention and raises the profile of the city.

You need to consider it as a a councillor not a CCFC fan

They sold because the business was going belly up and to plug gaping holes in their budget.

Stop making up shit to justify and rationalise it as a big commercial decision.

skybluetony176 · Dec 19, 2014

Nick said:
It was 100% from the start though, the whole Higgs thing was a charade, as confirmed by intheknow.

Tell me. Did you believe everything that intheknow posted or just the bits that didn't make SISU the villains?

dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

Rusty Trombone said:
I can see that wasps would prefer it all, but I think they would also see that owning 50% of ACL for half the price is still better than renting in Wycombe in a small stadium without the extra revenues they can access through ACL.

Without speaking to wasps we will not know.
In the circumstances though the children's (just for you Nick) Charity have always said they wanted out. Recently on top of this they have been dragged into costly and time consuming legal battles. I know some are able to disengage from the fact it is a charity we are talking about when it comes to what's important for CCFC. However many can't I don't know and I am sure I will receive abuse from a minority for saying it. However I hope when the Wasps offer came in the council considered doing what is best for the charity as well as themselves

dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

Nick said:
It was 100% from the start though, the whole Higgs thing was a charade, as confirmed by intheknow.

Are you saying Wasps approached ACL and said we want to buy 100% of you we are not interested in anything less. If so yes that's what I am saying maybe that is what Wasps said

Grendel · Dec 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Are you saying Wasps approached ACL and said we want to buy 100% of you we are not interested in anything less. If so yes that's what I am saying maybe that is what Wasps said

Which means Lucas deceived the public with her media statements

dongonzalos · Dec 19, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
Tell me. Did you believe everything that intheknow posted or just the bits that didn't make SISU the villains?

Why does that make anyone a villain?

Nick · Dec 19, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
Tell me. Did you believe everything that intheknow posted or just the bits that didn't make SISU the villains?

So was he wrong do you think? What did he post that did make them the villains? There were no facts or news was there, just his opinions of them?

dongonzalos · Dec 20, 2014

Grendel said:
Which means Lucas deceived the public with her media statements

I don't know what you are referring to please explain where Anne Lucas would have lied if my 'guess' is accurate?
Not trying to stitch you up just genuinely don't know what specifically she said can you post it?

Rusty Trombone · Dec 20, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Without speaking to wasps we will not know.
In the circumstances though the children's (just for you Nick) Charity have always said they wanted out. Recently on top of this they have been dragged into costly and time consuming legal battles. I know some are able to disengage from the fact it is a charity we are talking about when it comes to what's important for CCFC. However many can't I don't know and I am sure I will receive abuse from a minority for saying it. However I hope when the Wasps offer came in the council considered doing what is best for the charity as well as themselves

The Council shouldn't be considering what's best for the Charity any more or less than considering what's best for CCFC.

certainly we won't know for sure whether wasps would have done a deal for 50%, not convinced you'd know for sure if you ask them either, but it looks to me that 50% is better for them than being elsewhere, but only my opinion.

skybluetony176 · Dec 20, 2014

Nick said:
So was he wrong do you think? What did he post that did make them the villains? There were no facts or news was there, just his opinions of them?

I'll use your favourite line, Ahem. Where did I say he posted things that made them out to be the villains?

I'm saying you dismissed pretty much everything he posted in defence of W's but have decided this one snippet is fact.

dongonzalos · Dec 20, 2014

Grendel said:
They sold because the business was going belly up and to plug gaping holes in their budget.

Stop making up shit to justify and rationalise it as a big commercial decision.

What 'shit' have I made up, prey tell, (however when you do please show how for a fact my opinion is 'shit') hence why it is my opinion and not stated by me as fact. I assume you have the facts. I would love to know them. I would only call your opinion on it 'shit' if I knew categorically you are wrong. I am all ears

Nick · Dec 20, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
I'll use your favourite line, Ahem. Where did I say he posted things that made them out to be the villains?

I'm saying you dismissed pretty much everything he posted in defence of W's but have decided this one snippet is fact.

By saying this:

Tell me. Did you believe everything that intheknow posted or just the bits that didn't make SISU the villains?

You are inferring that he said stuff to make them out to be the villains and I chose not to believe it.

I didn't dismiss anything, I may not agree with it but as he is quite clearly somebody from within wasps I didn't just dismiss it.

dongonzalos · Dec 20, 2014

Rusty Trombone said:
The Council shouldn't be considering what's best for the Charity any more or less than considering what's best for CCFC.

certainly we won't know for sure whether wasps would have done a deal for 50%, not convinced you'd know for sure if you ask them either, but it looks to me that 50% is better for them than being elsewhere, but only my opinion.

Unfortunately it is just your opinion likewise its just mine. If I was them and had the cash I would say all or nothing.
Yes they have to consider a local charity, CCFC then overriding the rest the 200,000 tax payers (a guess)

skybluetony176 · Dec 20, 2014

Nick said:
By saying this:

You are inferring that he said stuff to make them out to be the villains and I chose not to believe it.

I didn't dismiss anything, I may not agree with it but as he is quite clearly somebody from within wasps I didn't just dismiss it.

No I'm not. You've done that all by yourself.

Why was he quite clearly from Wasps?

Nick · Dec 20, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Unfortunately it is just your opinion likewise its just mine. If I was them and had the cash I would say all or nothing.
Yes they have to consider a local charity, CCFC then overriding the rest the 200,000 tax payers (a guess)

I personally think that CCC screwed the charity over a bit didn't they? Could be wrong but it looks like CCC accepted a low amount for their share which kind of forced the charity to do the same, Wasps then had the power of Veto over anything Higgs were ever going to do so they were stuck in the corner then weren't they if they ever wanted out?

Nick · Dec 20, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
No I'm not. You've done that all by yourself.

Why was he quite clearly from Wasps?

Seriously? Re-read your original post. If he hasn't said stuff making SISU out to be the villains then how the hell could I ignore it?

Trust me, he quite clearly is certainly very close But I guess they said they have no PR Machine so it can't be true.

Rusty Trombone · Dec 20, 2014

Nick said:
I personally think that CCC screwed the charity over a bit didn't they? Could be wrong but it looks like CCC accepted a low amount for their share which kind of forced the charity to do the same, Wasps then had the power of Veto over anything Higgs were ever going to do so they were stuck in the corner then weren't they if they ever wanted out?

If Higgs were that concerned they could have vetoed wasps buying the Council's share. Higgs had the power before wasps did.

Nick · Dec 20, 2014

Rusty Trombone said:
If Higgs were that concerned they could have vetoed wasps buying the Council's share. Higgs had the power before wasps did.

I guess so, was just a thought I had rather than fact and a loose comment from somebody close to the Higgs that said they were gutted about it.

dongonzalos · Dec 20, 2014

Nick said:
I personally think that CCC screwed the charity over a bit didn't they? Could be wrong but it looks like CCC accepted a low amount for their share which kind of forced the charity to do the same, Wasps then had the power of Veto over anything Higgs were ever going to do so they were stuck in the corner then weren't they if they ever wanted out?

I know what you are saying but the charity were the ones who kept saying we want out.
They seem like they have a strong board and to be fair they have had to be. I bet no other charity have had to fight an attack on them like this, most people will not be proactively fighting charities ( other than ironically governments). On the flip side most charities wouldn't m buy half a football management company.
It seems sentiment for the family of the charity and the city ruled over the mind

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