Acl to comment on Ricoh arena position

[skybluelee]

I agree with this entirely, I say move Coventry United in there, ok it's not everybody's idea of a solution and I know the gates will be pathetically small to start of with, but it gives the people of Coventry a focus, and it's a acorn and given the right nurturing will grow into a tree.

If an hopefully when CCFC do return either probably as a newco then they can share the ground, why not.

This won't be popular with some folk.

Play in red and called United. I couldn't be less interested.

 

[Grendel]

Yes, I know it's not as simple as income - expenditure = a good business. I mean if ACL are sustainable, then they are not desperate surely?

It was purely a question of your post, not an argument over exact finances

My point though is that there does not seem an obvious regular glow of cash to the business is there? People quote the hotel and casino but I thought they didn't even own these. So what is there? The exhibition centre. If you own a lease on a football ground that is non productive there has to be maintenance costs that you are responsible for. That in itself is a drain. If be very surprised if monthly cash flow isn't a major concern with ACL.

 

[martcov]

The timing of the statement seems very odd. Makes you wonder if the Football League has decreed the payment isn't owed after all.

The football league is an owners club. Nothing to do with fans. They are obliged to look after the interests of the club owners. ACL are an irritant. The fans are causing embarassment and getting the league bad publicity - which could effect sponsorship - so that is the level of FL interest in fans.

They will not be helping ACL by giving information. They made, what they thought, was a simple deal, pay the 590,000 and we give you the share. Super. SISU agreed. ACL is kept quiet. Life goes on.

BUT SISU aren't like that. Now the league has a problem. SISU have found a new way of wriggling out of the deal, which the league probably never thought of. They probably didn't put any caveats in because they were looking for a way to keep the show going and maybe assumed SISU would be happy after swapping companies and breaking the lease.

What do they do now? Err think about a way out. That is why they cannot punish CCFC yet. They don't know what to do. The payment is obviously owed. That was the agreement otherwise they would have said so - and be out in one. SISU love litigation and are an owner in whose interests they must act. So a very difficult situation for the league. ACL have just stated the obvious. A bit hard for us to take, but in reality that is the position and the payment was agreed to by SISU.

As ACL say, SISU has signed a new deal in Northampton anyway. They are also trying to get leave of appeal - and at the same time talking about "healing and reconciliation".

What sort of people are SISU? Bonkers? Yes Tim you hit the nail on the head.

 

[Grendel]

The football league is an owners club. Nothing to do with fans. They are obliged to look after the interests of the club owners. ACL are an irritant. The fans are causing embarassment and getting the league bad publicity - which could effect sponsorship - so that is the level of FL interest in fans.

They will not be helping ACL by giving information. They made, what they thought, was a simple deal, pay the 590,000 and we give you the share. Super. SISU agreed. ACL is kept quiet. Life goes on.

BUT SISU aren't like that. Now the league has a problem. SISU have found a new way of wriggling out of the deal, which the league probably never thought of. They probably didn't put any caveats in because they were looking for a way to keep the show going and maybe assumed SISU would be happy after swapping companies and breaking the lease.

What do they do now? Err think about a way out. That is why they cannot punish CCFC yet. They don't know what to do. The payment is obviously owed. That was the agreement otherwise they would have said so - and be out in one. SISU love litigation and are an owner in whose interests they must act. So a very difficult situation for the league. ACL have just stated the obvious. A bit hard for us to take, but in reality that is the position and the payment was agreed to by SISU.

As ACL say, SISU has signed a new deal in Northampton anyway. They are also trying to get leave of appeal - and at the same time talking about "healing and reconciliation".

What sort of people are SISU? Bonkers? Yes Tim you hit the nail on the head.

Odd that ccfc92 asked me for proof. I'm sure he won't for this post even though it is emotive drivel with no factual detail.

 

[ccfc92]

My point though is that there does not seem an obvious regular glow of cash to the business is there? People quote the hotel and casino but I thought they didn't even own these. So what is there? The exhibition centre. If you own a lease on a football ground that is non productive there has to be maintenance costs that you are responsible for. That in itself is a drain. If be very surprised if monthly cash flow isn't a major concern with ACL.

yes, i see your point. a basic bank balance of 590k (for example) then run your slightly profiting business, and the 590k covers cash flow problems or unexpected circumstances, yes?

In that respect I agree. I just meant we don't know the ins and outs of ACLs bank balance (just like we don't know a lot of things re CCFC's situation ) but for all we know they could be running steadily, who knows.

 

[dongonzalos]

My point though is that there does not seem an obvious regular glow of cash to the business is there? People quote the hotel and casino but I thought they didn't even own these. So what is there? The exhibition centre. If you own a lease on a football ground that is non productive there has to be maintenance costs that you are responsible for. That in itself is a drain. If be very surprised if monthly cash flow isn't a major concern with ACL.

Do they not get money from conferences, gigs and people renting offices?

 

[fernandopartridge]

Well you are wrong again then.

Have you ever commented on a football thread?

 

[ccfc92]

Odd that ccfc92 asked me for proof. I'm sure he won't for this post even though it is emotive drivel with no factual detail.

on the contrary. I feel the FL need to set the record straight on this issue. I apologise for asking you a question.

 

[martcov]

Odd that ccfc92 asked me for proof. I'm sure he won't for this post even though it is emotive drivel with no factual detail.

Emotional drivel?

OK.

Who are members of the FL? Fans or clubs?

Have the FL denied that ACL are owed 590000 under the agreement?

Do SISU take part in litigation on regular basis?

Is the ACL statement hard to take for us? - Basically saying SISU must pay or else, and that there have been no approaches for an interim agreement?

Does the FL have a problem deciding what to do? If not, why aren't they doing anything?

How is that "emotional drivel"?

Sweeping the present situation under the carpet to suit yourself may be of help to you, but doesn't have an effect on the situation.

 

[Ian1779]

Since the JR result we've been by Anne Lucas that she's prepared to negotiate. But now it seems she's got fuck all authority to do so.

Michael then came up with his 'to good to be true deal' with fuck all detail. Turns out that actually him and his associates had no authority to offer deal, and clearly ACL would never have accepted it in a million years.

ACL claim to be owed 590K - this is generally not in dispute. But what they fail to acknowledge is that they have had 300K of it already.

It seems that there are more barriers to negotiation than just SISU.

 

[dongonzalos]

Since the JR result we've been by Anne Lucas that she's prepared to negotiate. But now it seems she's got fuck all authority to do so.

Michael then came up with his 'to good to be true deal' with fuck all detail. Turns out that actually him and his associates had no authority to offer deal, and clearly ACL would never have accepted it in a million years.

ACL claim to be owed 590K - this is generally not in dispute. But what they fail to acknowledge is that they have had 300K of it already.

It seems that there are more barriers to negotiation than just SISU.

Have SISU asked for a negotiation?

 

[Ian1779]

Have SISU asked for a negotiation?

How are we to know. But we get line... the only thing stopping us from returning is Joy Seppala. This is clearly not the case is it?

 

[shmmeee]

Since the JR result we've been by Anne Lucas that she's prepared to negotiate. But now it seems she's got fuck all authority to do so.

Michael then came up with his 'to good to be true deal' with fuck all detail. Turns out that actually him and his associates had no authority to offer deal, and clearly ACL would never have accepted it in a million years.

ACL claim to be owed 590K - this is generally not in dispute. But what they fail to acknowledge is that they have had 300K of it already.

It seems that there are more barriers to negotiation than just SISU.

When did they have the £300k?

 

[martcov]

Since the JR result we've been by Anne Lucas that she's prepared to negotiate. But now it seems she's got fuck all authority to do so.

Michael then came up with his 'to good to be true deal' with fuck all detail. Turns out that actually him and his associates had no authority to offer deal, and clearly ACL would never have accepted it in a million years.

ACL claim to be owed 590K - this is generally not in dispute. But what they fail to acknowledge is that they have had 300K of it already.

It seems that there are more barriers to negotiation than just SISU.

How have ACL had 300K already? The deal is SISU (OEG) pay ACL 590,000 in order to get the golden share. If ACL win the lottery they are still owed 590000.

SISU have invented a new reason not to pay money and the FL don't know how to react. They probably didn't foresee this happening.

 

[shmmeee]

How are we to know. But we get line... the only thing stopping us from returning is Joy Seppala. This is clearly not the case is it?

Well, its in Joys gift to settle the debts to be fair. She agreed to pay them.

 

[martcov]

How are we to know. But we get line... the only thing stopping us from returning is Joy Seppala. This is clearly not the case is it?

Err, yes it is.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

When did they have the £300k?

We have no clue, as the football league appear to have no clue.

Which is rare genius on their part really.

 

[shmmeee]

We have no clue, as the football league appear to have no clue.

Which is rare genius on their part really.

But why do we think they have? Or is this the Robinson/McGinnity guarantee against lost income?

 

[dongonzalos]

How are we to know. But we get line... the only thing stopping us from returning is Joy Seppala. This is clearly not the case is it?

From what you said about barriers

Anne has said the door is open for talks (no barrier)

Michael with due respect is not ACL (no barrier)

ACL has said any deal has to involve paying debts first, or I would guess they have to be part of the negotiation. This was the case on the Higgs negotiation so imagine this is standard and is not a shock to SISU?

Where is the barrier to Joy picking up the phone and reducing SISU's loses?

 

[Grendel]

yes, i see your point. a basic bank balance of 590k (for example) then run your slightly profiting business, and the 590k covers cash flow problems or unexpected circumstances, yes?

In that respect I agree. I just meant we don't know the ins and outs of ACLs bank balance (just like we don't know a lot of things re CCFC's situation ) but for all we know they could be running steadily, who knows.

All I am saying is if there is an issue I would call my friend Alan who would then tell Simon to stop mowing my lawn and put out a story that on the face of it looks pointless.

 

[Ian1779]

We have no clue, as the football league appear to have no clue.

Which is rare genius on their part really.

IIRC Simon I believe said that he was told by McGinnity or Robinson that they had paid 300K.... negotiated down from 500K

 

[Snozz_is_god]

How have ACL had 300K already? The deal is SISU (OEG) pay ACL 590,000 in order to get the golden share. If ACL win the lottery they are still owed 590000.

SISU have invented a new reason not to pay money and the FL don't know how to react. They probably didn't foresee this happening.

It'll be interesting when the FL call in the £1m bond, my guess is they won't get it.

 

[fernandopartridge]

From what you said about barriers

Anne has said the door is open for talks (no barrier)

Michael with due respect is not ACL (no barrier)

ACL has said any deal has to involve paying debts first, or I would guess they have to part if the negotiation. This was the case on the Higgs negotiation so imagine this is standard and is not a shock to SISU?

Where is the barrier to Joy picking up the phone and reducing SISU's loses?

Why can't they have a discussion about a return and how the 590k could be repaid?

 

[dongonzalos]

Money from the guarantors is understood to cover ACL’s ‘loss of earnings’ rather than the agreement for unpaid rent insisted on by the Football League

 

[dongonzalos]

Why can't they have a discussion about a return and how the 590k could be repaid?

Completely agree

The phone has to picked up and rang first for that to happen

 

[martcov]

It'll be interesting when the FL call in the £1m bond, my guess is they won't get it.

Certainly they won't pay. The only question is, is it due to ML not understanding the banking mechanisms, or has the Football League just got another 500K in a sponsorship deal and this should first be deducted from the 1m.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Money from the guarantors is understood to cover ACL’s ‘loss of earnings’ rather than the agreement for unpaid rent insisted on by the Football League

Easy for the football league to confirm that then.

Then no issue.

Only one organisation is causing doubt... and unusually it ain't SISU!

 

[blueflint]

Since the JR result we've been by Anne Lucas that she's prepared to negotiate. But now it seems she's got fuck all authority to do so.

Michael then came up with his 'to good to be true deal' with fuck all detail. Turns out that actually him and his associates had no authority to offer deal, and clearly ACL would never have accepted it in a million years.

ACL claim to be owed 590K - this is generally not in dispute. But what they fail to acknowledge is that they have had 300K of it already.



if they had received 300k they would not be owed 590k the 300k was not paid by SISU

It seems that there are more barriers to negotiation than just SISU.

 

[dongonzalos]

Easy for the football league to confirm that then.

Then no issue.

Only one organisation is causing doubt... and unusually it ain't SISU!

The loss if earnings bit will be in the contract signed by the guarantors.

 

[Como]

I am sure that ACL would like to have a club back at the Ricoh, am equally sure they would not want it to be SISU owned, who would?

Seems to me they are just stating the obvious. Sounds like they have doubts about getting the money they are owed and would anyone want to deal with a tenant with that track history, just setting yourself up for more grief.

 

[martcov]

Why can't they have a discussion about a return and how the 590k could be repaid?

I would guess that they have a bad credit rating, at least with ACL. A prudent business would only deal with them on a cash up front basis. No credit.

In this case, ACL seem to be acting as a prudent business.

 

[Ian1779]

From what you said about barriers

Anne has said the door is open for talks (no barrier)

Michael with due respect is not ACL (no barrier)

ACL has said any deal has to involve paying debts first, or I would guess they have to part if the negotiation. This was the case on the Higgs negotiation so imagine this is standard and is not a shock to SISU?

Where is the barrier to Joy picking up the phone and reducing SISU's loses?

Well the 590K itself is a barrier isn't it? There's no way the two parties trust enough to do the transaction directly.. so there must be some 3rd party involved. So why can we not get clarity about this?

There are two key points here.

The 300K - has it been paid?
Have SISU put the money in the ESCROW?

I don't believe that if this 'agreement' was put in place after Otium being issued the GS that ACL aren't all over every fine detail of it. They must know if either of these have occurred.

It seems to me that either ACL are being economical with information or both SISU and McGinnity/Robinson are lying.

 

[Ian1779]

Money from the guarantors is understood to cover ACL’s ‘loss of earnings’ rather than the agreement for unpaid rent insisted on by the Football League

Why should the club be responsible for the earnings of ACL when they gave nothing to the club which directly helped them achieve the revenue in the first place?

 

[Grendel]

How have ACL had 300K already? The deal is SISU (OEG) pay ACL 590,000 in order to get the golden share. If ACL win the lottery they are still owed 590000.

SISU have invented a new reason not to pay money and the FL don't know how to react. They probably didn't foresee this happening.

This is amazing news. You actually have the link to the statement from the football league regarding the issue if the golden share. Why are you hiding this? Sisu are gone tomorrow. Marty Cov is our saviour. Er, you do have the link don't you?

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

How are we to know. But we get line... the only thing stopping us from returning is Joy Seppala. This is clearly not the case is it?

Isn't it? Have you ever met her,talked to her? I have she doesn't compromise,doesn't negotiate Fisher said she is bonkers,wrong she is evil.