Trump is my favourite comedian of the year already (13 Viewers)

[SBT]

Anyway, back to Venezuela, anyone who’s actually looked into Maduro’s regime won’t shed a tear at today’s news.

Judging by the response by yourself, SBT, Duffer and so on… either you’re partisan to Maduro because he is a “socialist” (in name only) or partisan against Trump.

Haven't seen windmilling like this since season 1 of Camberwick Green

 

---

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Are you seriously, for one minute, pretending that this is about deposing dictators?

It’s geopolitical. It so happens that Venezuela supports the enemies of the USA so of course deposing Maduro serves their interests.

The Venezuelan Opposition are also claiming Maduro’s exit was ‘negotiated’.

Have you seen what’s going on in the US? The president literally interfered in an election he lost and incited riots to prevent the transfer of power.

Clutching at straws. The transfer of power happened and Trump won the next election.

Seriously, take a few hours to read about Venezuela and you’ll see in Maduro what you constantly project onto Trump.

It’s mad that you’ve condemned military actions v Iran and Venezuela without condemning those regimes without the same intensity. It pretty much sums up the moral vacuum at the heart of many well meaning people of the left.

 

[Captain Dart]

All these interventions in Iran have done is make them even more determined to build a nuclear weapon so they’ll be left alone.

It's the 'great game' of the 21st Century.

Haven't you heard the US and Israel are stirring up protests there. Could be going very much like Ukraine 2014.

The British, French & Germans have been talking up war with Russia.

New pieces are on the table.

 

[duffer]

Have seen what’s going on in Iran? They’re shooting at protesters. It’s a possibility that it’s the beginning of the end for that regime too which, like Maduro, is a long time coming.

Anyway, back to Venezuela, anyone who’s actually looked into Maduro’s regime won’t shed a tear at today’s news.

Judging by the response by yourself, SBT, Duffer and so on… either you’re partisan to Maduro because he is a “socialist” (in name only) or partisan against Trump.

Off the bat, the intervention is only a worthwhile enterprise if there’s a succession plan in place for an interim government to organise new elections.

I'm not partisan to Maduro, but I do believe in international law and exposing the arrant hypocrisy of those pretending that Trump is doing this because he supports human rights and democracy.

I'm guessing your basic philosophy is "might makes right". If it isn't, then your argument makes no sense, even to yourself.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Other countries without democracy that Trump could focus on if he's a bit scared of Putin. Qatar, Saudi Arabia. No?

Turkmenistan, Eritrea, Afghanistan?

There's a long list that anyone can Google for themselves if they're labouring under the assumption that this is somehow about Trump supporting democracy or human rights.

Weakest argument ever, especially given his record in his own country.

On Afghanistan, Trump stayed in there and it was Biden who pulled out and let the Taliban take over.

Unlike the other countries, there isn’t a sophisticated opposition ready to take the reins and as our misguided attempts of nation building in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya has shown… you can’t just export democracy to societies who do not have the means to support it.

This line of argument that if you can’t intervene to overthrow tyrants everywhere, then you can’t do it at all is weak.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It’s geopolitical. It so happens that Venezuela supports the enemies of the USA so of course deposing Maduro serves their interests.

The Venezuelan Opposition are also claiming Maduro’s exit was ‘negotiated’.


Clutching at straws. The transfer of power happened and Trump won the next election.

Seriously, take a few hours to read about Venezuela and you’ll see in Maduro what you constantly project onto Trump.

It’s mad that you’ve condemned military actions v Iran and Venezuela without condemning those regimes without the same intensity. It pretty much sums up the moral vacuum at the heart of many well meaning people of the left.

The point I’m trying to make is that the sitting US president is the only one in the country’s history to say it is ‘his right’ to interfere in elections and be recorded pressuring state officials into giving him votes he didn’t receive.

He is no better than Maduro on this count. Vladimir Putin probably views Zelensky in the same light, so we should just let him go ahead and put Zelensky’s head on a pike.

 

[duffer]

It’s geopolitical. It so happens that Venezuela supports the enemies of the USA so of course deposing Maduro serves their interests.

The Venezuelan Opposition are also claiming Maduro’s exit was ‘negotiated’.


Clutching at straws. The transfer of power happened and Trump won the next election.

Seriously, take a few hours to read about Venezuela and you’ll see in Maduro what you constantly project onto Trump.

It’s mad that you’ve condemned military actions v Iran and Venezuela without condemning those regimes without the same intensity. It pretty much sums up the moral vacuum at the heart of many well meaning people of the left.

Moral vacuum? Have you looked at who you're cheering on here from behind the sofa. Christ. Hello pot, meet kettle

 

[PVA]

Trump has spent the past year castigating and denouncing Venezuelans and other South Americans as criminals, aliens, general lowlife scum etc etc, and now we're supposed to believe this action is to get rid of the oppressive leader so the people of Venezuela can live freely?

And it has absolutely nothing at all to do with Venezuela having the world's largest oil reserves.

No siree. It's because Trump is such a saint with the Venezuelans interests at heart.

 

[SBT]

It’s mad that you’ve condemned military actions v Iran and Venezuela without condemning those regimes without the same intensity. It pretty much sums up the moral vacuum at the heart of many well meaning people of the left.

I see once again we've already reached the point of "if you don't condemn X then you can't condemn Y". Pure intellectual bankruptcy.

 

[PVA]

Trump holding a press conference from Mar a Lago later.

Lazy c**t can't even be bothered to go to Washington, happy to order illegal strikes from home.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

The point I’m trying to make is that the sitting US president is the only one in the country’s history to say it is ‘his right’ to interfere in elections and be recorded pressuring state officials into giving him votes he didn’t receive.

He is no better than Maduro on this count. Vladimir Putin probably views Zelensky in the same light, so we should just let him go ahead and put Zelensky’s head on a pike.

This is a stretch BSB and either way, the end result was that Trump relinquished power peacefully and contested the next election and won. Drawing equivalence elsewhere is a weak argument.

In fact, for you to say he’s “no better than Maduro” tells everyone that you don’t a scooby about Maduro and Venezuela.

The Zelensky example is equally nonsense. Those elections were legitimate and recognised as such. Russia declared war over territory and at the heart of Putin’s circle, they quite literally do not believe Ukraine has a right to exist historically.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I see once again we've already reached the point of "if you don't condemn X then you can't condemn Y". Pure intellectual bankruptcy.

Not at all. If you want to condemn the strikes, go for it. The silence over Iran and Venezuela is deafening.

Two evil regimes that ought to be consigned to the dustbin of history.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

This is a stretch BSB and either way, the end result was that Trump relinquished power peacefully and contested the next election and won. Drawing equivalence elsewhere is a weak argument.

In fact, for you to say he’s “no better than Maduro” tells everyone that you don’t a scooby about Maduro and Venezuela.

The Zelensky example is equally nonsense. Those elections were legitimate and recognised as such. Russia declared war over territory and at the heart of Putin’s circle, they quite literally do not believe Ukraine has a right to exist historically.

Putin doesn’t think Zelensky won fairly, Trump doesn’t think Maduro won fairly. Why does Trump get to coup Maduro but Putin can’t coup Zelensky?

 

[duffer]

On Afghanistan, Trump stayed in there and it was Biden who pulled out and let the Taliban take over.

Unlike the other countries, there isn’t a sophisticated opposition ready to take the reins and as our misguided attempts of nation building in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya has shown… you can’t just export democracy to societies who do not have the means to support it.

This line of argument that if you can’t intervene to overthrow tyrants everywhere, then you can’t do it at all is weak.

You are factually incorrect on Afghanistan. Trump gave in to the Taliban there, and continued the withdrawal of U.S. troops even when they continued to attack the elected Afghan government. He did the exact opposite of what you claim.

Keep flogging that dead horse though, mate, are you still claiming this is Trump supporting human rights and democracy?

Timeline of U.S. Withdrawal from Afghanistan - FactCheck.org

We lay out many of the key diplomatic decisions, military actions, presidential pronouncements and expert assessments of the withdrawal agreement that ended the U.S. military's 20-year war in Afghanistan.

www.factcheck.org

 

[SBT]

Not at all. If you want to condemn the strikes, go for it. The silence over Iran and Venezuela is deafening.

Two evil regimes that ought to be consigned to the dustbin of history.

Can you point me to your extensive posts on the corruption of the Venezuelan regime that entitles you to comment on all this?

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Putin doesn’t think Zelensky won fairly, Trump doesn’t think Maduro won fairly. Why does Trump get to coup Maduro but Putin can’t coup Zelensky?

It’s not just Trump, it’s the entire West. Putin tried and failed to oust Zelensky so this rabbit hole is pretty pointless.

Do you think Maduro won fairly? I’m getting an impression that you think he had.

Let’s try to find common ground here. If Venezuelan democracy flourishes again, would this intervention be righteous? My answer to that is yes.

 

[duffer]

It's the usual rubbish argument; if you're condemning what Trump does, you must be supporting Iran, Muduro, the drug cartels, etc. etc.

It's a total nonsense, designed to deflect from the hypocrisy of the Trump fan boys and their own 'moral vacuum' (tm).

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It’s not just Trump, it’s the entire West. Putin tried and failed to oust Zelensky so this rabbit hole is pretty pointless.

Do you think Maduro won fairly? I’m getting an impression that you think he had.

Let’s try to find common ground here. If Venezuelan democracy flourishes again, would this intervention be righteous? My answer to that is yes.

The West decides what’s right and proper now does it? So we allow some dictators and some war criminals to do disgusting things just as long as they stay on our team. This is the sort of logic that leads to Russia and eventually China doing the same and rightly arguing that we have no moral leg to stand on.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

You are factually incorrect on Afghanistan. Trump gave in to the Taliban there, and continued the withdrawal of U.S. troops even when they continued to attack the elected Afghan government. He did the exact opposite of what you claim.

Keep flogging that dead horse though, mate, are you still claiming this is Trump supporting human rights and democracy?

Timeline of U.S. Withdrawal from Afghanistan - FactCheck.org

We lay out many of the key diplomatic decisions, military actions, presidential pronouncements and expert assessments of the withdrawal agreement that ended the U.S. military's 20-year war in Afghanistan.

www.factcheck.org

I’ve already said it’s geopolitical.

In this instance, authoritarian regimes side with Russia, China, Iran, NK and so on. Democratic ones side with the USA, Australia, UK, EU and so on. Therefore, deposing an authoritarian regime with (hopefully) a democratic one serves US (and the West’s) interests.

You claim that you care about international law. Very noble, but Russia, China, Iran and Venezuela do not care for it and play by their rules.

 

[Grendel]

It's the usual rubbish argument; if you're condemning what Trump does, you must be supporting Iran, Muduro, the drug cartels, etc. etc.

It's a total nonsense, designed to deflect from the hypocrisy of the Trump fan boys and their own 'moral vacuum' (tm).

Priceless.

 

[Captain Dart]

Only one thing is certain now, there will be a Hollywood movie about Delta Force kidnapping Maduro in about 4 years time.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

The West decides what’s right and proper now does it? So we allow some dictators and some war criminals to do disgusting things just as long as they stay on our team. This is the sort of logic that leads to Russia and eventually China doing the same and rightly arguing that we have no moral leg to stand on.

Just answer the questions, do you think Maduro won the election fairly in 2018?

If not, if democracy returns to Venezuela would this intervention be a good thing?

International law is a post-WW2 construct and most nations will bend/break the rules if it’s convenient to do so.

 

[Sick Boy]

It's about pillaging the country's oil reserves and that's it.

Oh...and creating a handy distraction.

 

[LarryGrayson]

I suspect that there won't be many Venezuelans shedding tears.
Or at least those that remain who haven't already fled or been executed without trial.

well they wont be fleeing to us cos well decide there rapists

 

[wingy]

Isreal and USA joined at the hip, bird's of a feather and all,this is just the warm up to bigger things probably China's signal to start on Taiwan?

 

[wingy]

It's about pillaging the country's oil reserves and that's it.

Oh...and creating a handy distraction.

He wants a puppet in there.

 

[PVA]

Just answer the questions, do you think Maduro won the election fairly in 2018?

If not, if democracy returns to Venezuela would this intervention be a good thing?

International law is a post-WW2 construct and most nations will bend/break the rules if it’s convenient to do so.

Do you genuinely believe this was about removing a dictator because the US can't abide the way Maduro has treated his citizens? And they just want to free Venezuela's citizens from this oppressive regime and give them fair democracy?

 

[wingy]

Greenland next.

Don't think so, Mark Carney is playing hardball.well at least financially guess he needs a distraction of sorts.

 

[Captain Dart]

Don't think so, Mark Carney is playing hardball.well at least financially guess he needs a distraction of sorts.

Greenland is a territory of Denmark.

 

[torchomatic]

Just answer the questions, do you think Maduro won the election fairly in 2018?

If not, if democracy returns to Venezuela would this intervention be a good thing?

International law is a post-WW2 construct and most nations will bend/break the rules if it’s convenient to do so.

Coincidentally, oil and mineral rich. Who would have thought?

 

[torchomatic]

Greenland is a territory of Denmark.

Copenhagen on high alert.

 

[wingy]

Greenland is a territory of Denmark.

Yeah I know that.

 

[Grendel]

For those who strangely dodge the question Maduro lost the election. Even equally corrupt countries like Brazil acknowledge it. Why no one answers this seems a bit odd.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

International law is a post-WW2 construct and most nations will bend/break the rules if it’s convenient to do so.

Almost there now. Why can the West do that but not the likes of Russia and China?

 

[Grendel]

Almost there now. Why can the West do that but not the likes of Russia and China?

You confuse the West with Super Powers