Difficult message but if you give money to Sisu you encourage them to stay. Cov fans should refuse to buy season tickets. It's your patriotic duty now to protect the club you love by forcing administration or a sale of the club. We aren't any old club we are CCFC. We aren't a small club we are a mod size club starved of cash. Do your duty refuse to buy a season ticket for 2012 off Sisu!
You are a traitor if you buy a season ticket next year! (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter OyJimmy
- Start date
Lets all sing together
New Member
So my old man in his late fifties is classed as a traitor , he's spent his entire life following city.
I'll pass your message on
I'll pass your message on
Skybluedar
New Member
Yeah this thread was always going to go that way. Starving SISU of cash unfortunately is essentially stopping supporting the club. True supporters don't do that.
mark82
Moderator
Think traitor is a bit harsh although what OyJimmy says is true to a certain extent, it could prolong SISU's stay. At the end of the day SISU will only think it is a small proportion of fans that are disgruntled as most will moan on here and then carry on as normal. The (relatively small) protest held the other week is good for raising awareness but at the end of the day there were still 9000 paying customers at that match. So why would SISU take any notice?
Sisu-infidels
New Member
Sorry but this is a ludicrous thing to say, I am as anti sisu as can be but to call supporters traitors is wrong! I want to support my team and I will do so with or without sisu but wat I will do is join in and make life as hard for sisu as possible while they are here! If we don't support the team next season then where? League 2? I'm sure those who choose to not buy a ticket will refrain from coming all season..... Unless of course we are table toppers and heading for promotion?
Buy your ticket not to support sisu but to support the lads who pull on the shirt! Is it their fault were run by clowns?
lifelongcityfan
Well-Known Member
if all 9000 tickets renew SISU will walk away with 2m and then probably put the club in admin.... no way Im parting with my cash whilst they are around.
ohitsaidwalker king power
Well-Known Member
This is a tough call... my head says no, based on my pure disgust at SISU... but 33 straight years as a season ticket holder and an 11 year old who loves CCFC pull my heart strings the opposite way... like most I loathe what the faceless wonders have done to our club, but I'm Sky Blue, always will be...like my father and my grandfather I'll go to my grave being so.
I respect the sentiment behind your view OP... but please don't call me a traitor.
:blue:
I respect the sentiment behind your view OP... but please don't call me a traitor.
:blue:
skyblueben83
New Member
Can understand your anger but shouldn't ask fans to abandon their club because of the owners!
Although I'm not happy with SISU capital, they have made many mistakes and it is time for them to go we have to remember that they did rescue the club and put a lot of money in to clear the debts left by previous owners.
Should expect that they'd want some of that money back before they just walk away. Everyone assumes Hoffman's a saviour and forgets he was a huge part of the SISU board who originally took control, now he wants the club on the cheap and expects SISU to just walk away.
Whatever happens the fans are the victims! That's why we should just stick together and support the team, like all good fans should!
PUSB!
Although I'm not happy with SISU capital, they have made many mistakes and it is time for them to go we have to remember that they did rescue the club and put a lot of money in to clear the debts left by previous owners.
Should expect that they'd want some of that money back before they just walk away. Everyone assumes Hoffman's a saviour and forgets he was a huge part of the SISU board who originally took control, now he wants the club on the cheap and expects SISU to just walk away.
Whatever happens the fans are the victims! That's why we should just stick together and support the team, like all good fans should!
PUSB!
Sky Blue Sheepy
New Member
I support my team, regardless of whos in charge. Get off your high horse and get back to being a sofa supporter
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cov_russell
Facebook User
The club has borrowed against next years season ticket sales and so SISU will not receive the funds from them.
J
Jack Griffin
Guest
This article is the only source I know that talks about a loan & it only discuses an advance on THIS YEARS season ticket sales to cover the first few months of this season
http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/co...e-payments-and-season-tickets-92746-29031366/
So what is your source cov_russell, I'd like to know?
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Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
CCFC was here long before SISU, and it will be there (in whatever form), long after they're gone. It hurts and it's bitterly frustrating, but the SISU era *will* draw to a close and a better one will come of it.
PUSB.
PUSB.
Dated jul 11 2011 - so it's THIS seasons tickets.
rob9872
Well-Known Member
Err not imo. They would already have most of teh cash for this years in June so would not need or be able to mortgage against it. Therefore I guess it is next years.
cov_russell
Facebook User
It says next year's season tickets. I took that to mean the season tickets sold in 2012.
This is what OSB58 wrote in the FAQ-2 Money Talks in the Board/finance section:
Other Loans The club and group has taken out other loans notably against the Ryton facility and ticket sales. This is not unusual but not desirable either. The alternative is however, given SISU will not put in further major funds, that the club fails to meet its debts and goes into administration. Might not be what we want to see but it keeps the club going. Hopefully these facilities will be only short term. However as the loans are secured on assets (eg Ryton) it puts these assets at risk if the loans are not repaid. Plus such loans incur interest and make the losses bigger
And Yes ... it's THIS seasons tickets.
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cov_russell
Facebook User
By 11th July 2011 I would imagine that most of the season tickets for the 2011/2012 season would have been sold and so you could not use them as security on a loan. Therefore, it must be the season tickets for the 2012/2013 season that the article is referring to.
TheUKGryphon
New Member
The traitors are the people who will bail. SISU may be w@nkers, but if the squad ain't got the fans then they've got nothing. Staying away from the ground will being about more expediantly the very thing we all fear the most. The death of Coventry City Football club. I for one, will bleed sky blue until I or the club dies, which ever comes first. I'm also pissed off that this has even been suggested by a so called supporter. Shame!
mark82
Moderator
I'd be surprised if they could take out a loan against 2012/13 season tickets without knowing which division we will be in next season. They would not be able to give adequate supporting evidence to the bank.
Here's a very good and informative piece from OSB58:
Firstly I would like to say thank you to those who replied to a question I raised regarding the apparent mortgage of season ticket income. The claims surrounding these apparent loans have been bugging me. So what is it we know
well firstly it was made public by an article in the CT 11th July 2011 http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/cov...2746-29031366/ (Cheers Jack for the link)
this would appear to be the only source of "facts" regarding the season ticket "mortgage"
so what is said
It refers to next season in the article so that would be the 2011/12 season judging by the date of the article (not as some here seem to imply next seson 2012/13). So thats one piece of misinformation put to bed.
So what is actually going on .....
taking it away from football altogether consider this .....
You want to buy a new car. You take a trip to Joe Bloggs Motors find a car you want and decide to purchase. Your choices are to pay outright in cash, pay on credit card or to take out a finance agreement to cover the cost. Paying by cash or credit card gives Joe Bloggs Motors the money for the car immediately, no loan is created and you get the car. However you cannot afford that and take out the finance agreement with ABC loans finance Ltd. You get the car but you have a loan but that loan isnt with Joe Bloggs Motors it is with ABC Loans finance, effectively the garage sells the debt you have to the finance company which gives the garage the money upfront, you the car and the finance company a legal debt that you owe to ABC not the garage. All very normal.
Now substitute Season ticket for car, CCFC for the garage, and Season Ticket Credit Ltd for the finance company.
CCFC have not I am pretty sure mortgaged the season ticket income. They have sold the debt to STC ltd who paid a discounted amount to CCFC up front. Discounted because the payment scheme is on 0% finance so they make their money buying say £1m of season ticket debt for a lesser figure of perhaps £900k (its a guess No one knows the figure outside of the club and finance company). As someone who has taken advantage of the payment scheme then i can tell you I owe STC Limited not CCFC. If i default it is the finance company that will take action not CCFC, it is STC that take the finance risk and own the debt not CCFC. There is no mortgage on the season ticket income, there is no debt owed by fans and owned by CCFC to secure it.
So CCFC would be left with cash from season tickets bought outright (cash or credit card) and the funds received from STC Ltd. Why would anyone then mortgage money they already had to receive less (because of finance charges) than they had in the first place? Just wouldnt happen.
Also in the article is that we mortgaged the League prize money - check the rules this has always been a no no. We would have been under a transfer embargo. Did we actually sign players - yes. You are not allowed to mortgage League transfer money but the league could withold it and apply it directly to football & HMRC debts - no evidence of this either.
So you have to ask why print such an article which is put forward as fact? Who benefits and who is misleading and using the fans by making the claims? There is no evidence of such a mortgage and if looked at logically and properly the claims do not stack up. SISU cant rebutt the claims because no one would or want to believe them - mud sticks. There is no mortgage on season ticket income 2011/12 or 2012/13 in my opinion
Dont get me wrong I dont want SISU at the club, I will and have criticise(d) much of what they have done. However if we are going to chip at them to weaken and remove them do it from firm ground, anything else weakens our arguement and we know we are right - they need to go. Spurious claims peddled to the fans as fact by some parties do not help
Firstly I would like to say thank you to those who replied to a question I raised regarding the apparent mortgage of season ticket income. The claims surrounding these apparent loans have been bugging me. So what is it we know
well firstly it was made public by an article in the CT 11th July 2011 http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/cov...2746-29031366/ (Cheers Jack for the link)
this would appear to be the only source of "facts" regarding the season ticket "mortgage"
so what is said
It refers to next season in the article so that would be the 2011/12 season judging by the date of the article (not as some here seem to imply next seson 2012/13). So thats one piece of misinformation put to bed.
So what is actually going on .....
taking it away from football altogether consider this .....
You want to buy a new car. You take a trip to Joe Bloggs Motors find a car you want and decide to purchase. Your choices are to pay outright in cash, pay on credit card or to take out a finance agreement to cover the cost. Paying by cash or credit card gives Joe Bloggs Motors the money for the car immediately, no loan is created and you get the car. However you cannot afford that and take out the finance agreement with ABC loans finance Ltd. You get the car but you have a loan but that loan isnt with Joe Bloggs Motors it is with ABC Loans finance, effectively the garage sells the debt you have to the finance company which gives the garage the money upfront, you the car and the finance company a legal debt that you owe to ABC not the garage. All very normal.
Now substitute Season ticket for car, CCFC for the garage, and Season Ticket Credit Ltd for the finance company.
CCFC have not I am pretty sure mortgaged the season ticket income. They have sold the debt to STC ltd who paid a discounted amount to CCFC up front. Discounted because the payment scheme is on 0% finance so they make their money buying say £1m of season ticket debt for a lesser figure of perhaps £900k (its a guess No one knows the figure outside of the club and finance company). As someone who has taken advantage of the payment scheme then i can tell you I owe STC Limited not CCFC. If i default it is the finance company that will take action not CCFC, it is STC that take the finance risk and own the debt not CCFC. There is no mortgage on the season ticket income, there is no debt owed by fans and owned by CCFC to secure it.
So CCFC would be left with cash from season tickets bought outright (cash or credit card) and the funds received from STC Ltd. Why would anyone then mortgage money they already had to receive less (because of finance charges) than they had in the first place? Just wouldnt happen.
Also in the article is that we mortgaged the League prize money - check the rules this has always been a no no. We would have been under a transfer embargo. Did we actually sign players - yes. You are not allowed to mortgage League transfer money but the league could withold it and apply it directly to football & HMRC debts - no evidence of this either.
So you have to ask why print such an article which is put forward as fact? Who benefits and who is misleading and using the fans by making the claims? There is no evidence of such a mortgage and if looked at logically and properly the claims do not stack up. SISU cant rebutt the claims because no one would or want to believe them - mud sticks. There is no mortgage on season ticket income 2011/12 or 2012/13 in my opinion
Dont get me wrong I dont want SISU at the club, I will and have criticise(d) much of what they have done. However if we are going to chip at them to weaken and remove them do it from firm ground, anything else weakens our arguement and we know we are right - they need to go. Spurious claims peddled to the fans as fact by some parties do not help
Last edited by oldskyblue58; 29-11-2011 at 11:05 AM.
mark82
Moderator
I can see both sides. He could say that by buying a season ticket it will bring about the demise of the club as money will go to SISU and the club won't see any of it. SISU will then hang on for more dragging the club into oblivion and selling off assets to cover their "investment".
cov_russell
Facebook User
I stand corrected, after reluctantly reading the entire Telegraph article, it seems the loan was taken out in the first half of 2011 against the 2011/2012 season ticket sales.
It does look more like this seasons tickets as they refer to covering wages for june etc,the interesting one for me was the money from the league £2.5m. did'nt realise they got that ,just thought it was the prem amount of £2.2m.,so around £3.5m. season ticket money ,+£4.7m. from league and prem
