who thinks we will be liquadated if sisu dont win the judicial review (5 Viewers)

[wingy]

Whilst at the moment the business world is in awe of Sisu's fiscal and managerial competence?[/QUOTE

Sure they would have had the nose In the trough with those LLoyds Bank and Royal Mail floatations ,what a convenient bonus .

 

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[Ian1779]

There's a big difference between fucking up a business and actively seeking to destroy a 100 year old professional sports team. Their company of businesses would fall apart if they allowed CCFC to go to the wall.

 

[Jack Griffin]

There's a big difference between fucking up a business and actively seeking to destroy a 100 year old professional sports team. Their company of businesses would fall apart if they allowed CCFC to go to the wall.

They are on target to lose real big then.

 

[skybluetony176]

Points deductions aside, I don't think there is any evidence that a liquidation event would occur seriously. There is simply no logic to it. Now before the inevitable comments that they haven't applied much logic so far - financially it doesn't makes sense - they wouldn't even have the golden share as an asset to recoup on, PR wise it would destroy the SISU group of companies, and they would stand to lose far more than what they put into CCFC.

There's no logic (where the clubs concerned) in the Northampton move either, financial or otherwise. Sorry, you opened the door ;-) . What's the golden share worth? More than a seasons lost ticket revenue from playing in Northampton? I think you're wrong about the PR. The type of people who invest in hedge funds are only likely to be impressed with that type of ruthlessness, much the same way as they would be at a hedge fund who will take on a local authority and not think twice about counter suing a charity for ten times the amount that they are looking to recover from you. They have a different take on positive and negative PR to the average CCFC supporter

 

[Ian1779]

The golden share would not be their asset though? It would go back to the FL, and so would not generate any financial return. The only way the golden share will offer any kind of financial incentive is if it is intact - so SISU selling the club as it is.

You're only surmising on what type of people 'hedge funds' are, and their take on PR. Lets not forget that CCC and many other councils invest in hedge funds on a regular basis, so surely they are also condoning the action they seek to condemn.

You have no evidence other than your opinion - neither do I in fairness.

 

[dongonzalos]

The small bit I understand is that an appointed liquidator has an obligation to sell off the companies assets (golden share).

So can somebody buy the Golden share and the name?

 

[wozey]

Can any of us actually say what we think will happen because we seem to be guessing the actions of morons and they never act in the expected way

 

[Astute]

There's a big difference between fucking up a business and actively seeking to destroy a 100 year old professional sports team. Their company of businesses would fall apart if they allowed CCFC to go to the wall.

They have liquidated businesses in the past. That's what hedge funds do. They have been threatening to liquidate our club for over two years now. Are you saying that they are full of shit?

 

[dongonzalos]

Sorry Ian just saw your post.

Would SISU not sell the Holden share with permission from the FL with the FL having final say over the suitability of a purchaser.

I agree they would not liquidate they would sell Ryton, CCFC (squad and Golden Share) and the academy.

The question is what would they get?

Also would they do one final push for the play off places before trying to sell?

 

[chiefdave]

You can't sell the golden share, what you can sell is what we would consider the football club and the league will then grant you the golden share. The value is in the right to have it (ie the continuation of the club) rather than the share itself.

 

[Astute]

Sorry Ian just saw your post.

Would SISU not sell the Holden share with permission from the FL with the FL having final say over the suitability of a purchaser.

I agree they would not liquidate they would sell Ryton, CCFC (squad and Golden Share) and the academy.

The question is what would they get?

Also would they do one final push for the play off places before trying to sell?

If they liquidated our club everything would get sold. The money would go to the creditors. And the creditors are themselves. I could see them doing it for two reasons. One is to show in future dealings that they don't care about anything. The second one would be out of spite.

 

[Ian1779]

They have liquidated businesses in the past. That's what hedge funds do. They have been threatening to liquidate our club for over two years now. Are you saying that they are full of shit?

How many business have the SISU group of companies actually liquidated? I assume you'll know exactly seeing as you are so certain.


Also saying there is a threat of liquidation due to financial difficulties is not the same as saying 'we are going to liquidate this business'.

 

[Ian1779]

You can't sell the golden share, what you can sell is what we would consider the football club and the league will then grant you the golden share. The value is in the right to have it (ie the continuation of the club) rather than the share itself.

If the club were to be liquidated - we would probably lose our place in the football pyramid and have to re-apply several leagues below. There is no financial value to anyone in it.

 

[Astute]

You have no evidence other than your opinion - neither do I in fairness.

They HAVE liquidated businesses in the past. They HAVE been threatening to liquidate our club for over two years. This is not an opinion as you say.

So what hedge funds have CCC been investing in?

 

[Astute]

How many business have the SISU group of companies actually liquidated? I assume you'll know exactly seeing as you are so certain.


Also saying there is a threat of liquidation due to financial difficulties is not the same as saying 'we are going to liquidate this business'.

Are you telling me that you haven't read about their past? I suppose you haven't read about Joys integrity being questioned by a judge a few years ago. That was whilst trying to do a forced sale of a company to themselves IIRC. Or do you just have selective memory?

 

[Astute]

If the club were to be liquidated - we would probably lose our place in the football pyramid and have to re-apply several leagues below. There is no financial value to anyone in it.

Do you think that Joy will suddenly worry about the future of our football club and us fans?

 

[Ian1779]

They HAVE liquidated businesses in the past. They HAVE been threatening to liquidate our club for over two years. This is not an opinion as you say.

So what hedge funds have CCC been investing in?

You know damn well that I cannot prove which ones they've invested in.

http://www.efinancialnews.com/story...-steps-up-push-for-pooled-uk-council-pensions

Now this article talks about how local councils invest in hedge funds. In fact the first line says £171 billion. Now are we really saying that CCC would be the only council not to do this?

As for my point - you can surely prove that. If they HAVE definitely liquidated businesses you will be able to tell me which ones.

 

[Ian1779]

Are you telling me that you haven't read about their past? I suppose you haven't read about Joys integrity being questioned by a judge a few years ago. That was whilst trying to do a forced sale of a company to themselves IIRC. Or do you just have selective memory?

So questioned integrity = liquidated business. Good to see how you did the maths there.

 

[Astute]

Also saying there is a threat of liquidation due to financial difficulties is not the same as saying 'we are going to liquidate this business'.

Give us the freehold or we will liquidate the club is more or less what they were saying. If it was about our clubs viability we wouldn't be stranded in Northampton. They are after all or nothing.

Is it a threat or a promise?

 

[Ian1779]

Give us the freehold or we will liquidate the club is more or less what they were saying.

I must have missed that quote - when did they say that..... more or less of course.

 

[Sky Blue Harry H]

I've been following all the arguments and...

 

[Astute]

You know damn well that I cannot prove which ones they've invested in.

http://www.efinancialnews.com/story...-steps-up-push-for-pooled-uk-council-pensions

Now this article talks about how local councils invest in hedge funds. In fact the first line says £171 billion. Now are we really saying that CCC would be the only council not to do this?

As for my point - you can surely prove that. If they HAVE definitely liquidated businesses you will be able to tell me which ones.

Why don't you just do a Google search? I am on my phone so can't do a lot.

 

[Astute]

I must have missed that quote - when did they say that..... more or less of course.

Have you refused to read anything that you could see as anti SISU? It is all out in the open and SISU never denied it. But I suppose you know that.

 

[Ian1779]

Why don't you just do a Google search? I am on my phone so can't do a lot.

I tried - to be fair I wouldn't imagine that it would be that easy to find that sort of stuff out. I assumed given your statement you already knew the answer.

 

[Hobo]

I think they would try and sell. But liquidation would not surprise me either, they don't seem to do logic.

 

[spoon]

Sisu v Tucker suggests they have as Tucker for kpmg seem to be claiming professional costs as liquidators. But that's me trying to read legalise with no professional background so welcome to be corrected by those who have

 

[Ian1779]

Have you refused to read anything that you could see as anti SISU? It is all out in the open and SISU never denied it. But I suppose you know that.

There's a difference between suggesting scenarios that could occur in the future and what they would actually do. It's like the bloody Jehovah's witnesses... everything taken literally.

And no, there is plenty of things that SISU have fucked up royally - they should have done things right when they first took over. They also are not going to just roll over and give up the club... so I want them to sort their shit out and fix it. But the idea of them liquidating CCFC is laughable... I can't believe so many sensible people think it would occur.

We might have differing opinions about why and how we are here - but it's like saying CCC would knock down the Ricoh if they lost the JR.

 

[Astute]

I tried - to be fair I wouldn't imagine that it would be that easy to find that sort of stuff out. I assumed given your statement you already knew the answer.

And yes I do but can't post a link. It was even stated in the High Court recently. Didn't you even read about what went on there?

 

[wingy]

Didn't they have some conflab with one of the motorway services outfits ,Moto...Forte?? That Belgian Steel company??

 

[Astute]

But the idea of them liquidating CCFC is laughable... I can't believe so many sensible people think it would occur.

Reduced to twisting words now?

There is a massive difference between would and might.

Would there be a tax benefit of liquidating our club?

Would they be much better off trying to find a buyer?

Or is Joy just full of bluster?

 

[skybluetony176]

Didn't they have some conflab with one of the motorway services outfits ,Moto...Forte?? That Belgian Steel company??

Welcome break from memory. Alot of parallels with us. If I remember correctly they tried to wrestle control by blocking refinancing of debt. They were shareholders but not majority, I think they only had enough to be considered junior shareholders (whatever that means). If you Google sisu/welcome break there's loads on it, including an interview with Joy after using the courts as an attempt to stop the refinancing so they could do it. I think they failed too iirc.

 

[dongonzalos]

There's a difference between suggesting scenarios that could occur in the future and what they would actually do. It's like the bloody Jehovah's witnesses... everything taken literally.

And no, there is plenty of things that SISU have fucked up royally - they should have done things right when they first took over. They also are not going to just roll over and give up the club... so I want them to sort their shit out and fix it. But the idea of them liquidating CCFC is laughable... I can't believe so many sensible people think it would occur.

We might have differing opinions about why and how we are here - but it's like saying CCC would knock down the Ricoh if they lost the JR.

I know the last paragraph was not serious.
However I feel if CCC lose the JR the judge will not allow any remedies

 

[skybluefred]

There seems to be some confusion regarding the Golden Share. It belongs to the FL, it cannot be sold but if the Club is sold
the FL will normal grant the share to the new owner if the FL deem them suitable. In the event of liquidation the GL is returned to the FL
And Coventry City FC cease to exist and the City part of the name can never be used again. Any new Club would have to start in
non league football and would therefore not need a Golden Share.

 

[Bill Glazier]

No, I agree, it's far better to keep the club stumbling along for the next 4/5 years,incurring further losses, and still get nothing because it will still be worth FA then!

After all, these are professional investors - they know what they are doing!

You are having a laugh. Buying Coventry City was a monumental blunder.

 

[NorthernWisdom]

Which is a very fair point indeed. Liquidate, get nothing, carry on for say 5 years as we are and continue to hemorrhage money.

Not pretty whichever way you look at it.

You don't get nothing anyway, you'd get the value of whatever value the assets realised on sale.