Who really owns Coventry City Football Club? (2 Viewers)

[Tonylinc]

But who is going to take them on?

 

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[Tonylinc]

Clearly not. However if the likes of Shinwartra ran our club and pumped millions into it 90% would justify it. As Geoff Cook, Manchester City's CEO at the time said "he's a good guy to have a round of golf with". We embraced king a man with a string of offences and justified it with the fact "he had done his time". By that reckoning if Lee Hughes joined us after killing someone and scored a bucket load its fine "he's done his time". I can assure you if someone with the morals of Genghis Kahn ran this club and ran it well they're would be hand wringing all round. Well yes he killed millions but he plays a fine shot out of a bunker.....

I know what you are saying G but I think that times have moved on from the King debate. People are finally realising that English football cannot continue on its current path and that a real rethink is needed.

 

[kdrinkell]

As I said earlier, are the FA and FL fit for governance, do we need to overhaul the way our national sport is ran?

They are all the same aren't they the governing bodies/MP's have connections with them with money who want to invest……allegedly

 

[Moff]

Does there not come a point where it is no longer our game?

Tony, sadly its been gone and got the t-shirt!

 

[The Gentleman]

Exactly

Nice to see that the board administrator speaks for most of us and knows EXACTLY what we think.

 

[Moff]

First and foremost Hobo, a good post and a very interesting discussion point.

The thing with football, as Lord Summerisle intelligently pointed out, is that its a good place to clean your dosh, and that is where at some point in the future a club is going to fall flat on their face when someone investigates and finds it has links to some very dirty money.

As usual though, when it happens the MP's will hand wring mercilessly, the FA will conduct some sort of useless soulless investigation and the Government will order an enquiry which will be far from independent and geared to pander to whichever useless party is in power......and as usual the losers will be the fans of the club that has either been put out of business, or received such draconian punishment it would take years to get back to its original state, if ever.

 

[Tonylinc]

First and foremost Hobo, a good post and a very interesting discussion point.

The thing with football, as Lord Summerisle intelligently pointed out, is that its a good place to clean your dosh, and that is where at some point in the future a club is going to fall flat on their face when someone investigates and finds it has links to some very dirty money.

As usual though, when it happens the MP's will hand wring mercilessly, the FA will conduct some sort of useless soulless investigation and the Government will order an enquiry which will be far from independent and geared to pander to whichever useless party is in power......and as usual the losers will be the fans of the club that has either been put out of business, or received such draconian punishment it would take years to get back to its original state, if ever.

Oh, forgive me if I just commit suicide(not a criminal offence now).

 

[Moff]

oh, forgive me if i just commit suicide(not a criminal offence now).

wtf???

 

[Tonylinc]

wtf???

The point is that we can all do something about this with a concerted and controlled effort but nobody seems to be doing anything. We have to regain control of our national game. How do we do that?

 

[Moff]

The point is that we can all do something about this with a concerted and controlled effort but nobody seems to be doing anything. We have to regain control of our national game. How do we do that?

Sorry Tony, I wasn't sure what you originally meant.

Re above, be glad to hear if anyone has the answer. Sadly I think the FA are governing the game by the see no evil method.

 

[Florence1898]

Labovitch said in his interview on CWR last night, "the problem with Bing they never revealed who their investors are." A strange accusation because SISU haven't either. SISU and Arvo Master fund are hedge funds for anonymous investors. The later based in the Caymen Islands so no accounts business profile available in the UK.

Technically Otium own us run by Fisher and Labovitch. Yet both default to our owners and it seems clear Joy calls the shots. I am not sure that fits FL rules, technically Joy doesn't have to be fit and proper.

For example if Otium had failed to post accounts, Fisher and Labovitch would have been accountable, not Joy. Joy technically isn't responsible for anything that happens. How nice to be an owner without responsibility, it's not even her money.

Also funding seems to have moved away from SISU to Arvo Master Fund who now seem to hold the biggest stake. Most people think Joy is connected to them, but there is no documented proof I have seen.

So who is Arvo, is Joy a shepherd, a puppet or an owner?

Where does their money or investments come from. There is no evidence whether it is from hard earned enterprise, crime, drugs or terrorism? We know there is an incentive around tax incentive, some would view it as tax evasion. There are also genuine world wide concerns around hedge funds being used to launder money.

So the source of our funds gives me great concerns, it always has done to a degree. But with the bizarre business model these 'financial experts' run and lack of transparency with their accounting systems I.e our debt varies widely depending on who and which day you speak to them. Also with Otium officially taking over and certain accounts not now being required to be published due to liquidation, we seem to have conveniently lost some continuity around the acquired debt?

To me we seem to be funded (owned) by Arvo and there is no transparency to who they are.

Hobo your getting too warm for comfort. The Huntsman connection is through Salt Lake City, the money clearing house for much activity. The Hong Kong Judge would find this connection interesting. Whilst Sisu waste their time on pursuing a futile JR, there are others on the tail of the Sisu world.

 

[Hobo]

I would like to thank everyone that has contributed so far, as everyone I feel has made a valid contribution.

We haven't had the normal slanging match that most post degenerate to.

It seems we all have concerns, to some degree about the following:

1. The high level of financing the modern game consumes.
2. Where does it come from?
3. Who can provide it and does that raise concerns?
4. How do we, the FA and FL control it.
5. How it impacts on fans the traditional source of revenue for clubs.

Challenging times ahead for us fans. But these issues we must get under control if we want Football to remain in a healthy and sustainable state.

 

[Tonylinc]

Hobo your getting too warm for comfort. The Huntsman connection is through Salt Lake City, the money clearing house for much activity. The Hong Kong Judge would find this connection interesting. Whilst Sisu waste their time on pursuing a futile JR, there are others on the tail of the Sisu world.

Very interesting comment. Please expand.

 

[VegetableSamosa]

The point is that we can all do something about this with a concerted and controlled effort but nobody seems to be doing anything. We have to regain control of our national game. How do we do that?

This is going to come a bit out of left field and sound slightly ridiculous, but there bear with me. There's an election coming up. Back in the ol' days, we'd get the Union leader to stand for MP (Hello Bob, with your glorious moustache!) and he'd represent the interests of the workers. Well, can't we do the same here? Get people who genuinely care about Football to stand for MP and change it from the inside. I'm sure if they ran on a decent manifesto of points that represent the traditional football fan demographic but also had points to support the game, they'd garner a few votes. Just need a few clubs to do this and we might get somewhere. You don't even need to get elected, just have an independent party or candidate beat a major party (more than likely the Lib Dems) and you get some strong, national media coverage (see the guy who ran the Elvis Bus Pass Party) - it'd make people, and the parties, stand up and listen.

 

[Nick]

This is going to come a bit out of left field and sound slightly ridiculous, but there bear with me. There's an election coming up. Back in the ol' days, we'd get the Union leader to stand for MP (Hello Bob, with your glorious moustache!) and he'd represent the interests of the workers. Well, can't we do the same here? Get people who genuinely care about Football to stand for MP and change it from the inside. I'm sure if they ran on a decent manifesto of points that represent the traditional football fan demographic but also had points to support the game, they'd garner a few votes. Just need a few clubs to do this and we might get somewhere. You don't even need to get elected, just have an independent party or candidate beat a major party (more than likely the Lib Dems) and you get some strong, national media coverage (see the guy who ran the Elvis Bus Pass Party) - it'd make people, and the parties, stand up and listen.

I agree, but would the % of football fans be able to vote them in? For example if you took CCFC as an example then would there be enough oomph? I am not sure exactly what is needed to vote somebody in though.

 

[Nick]

The point is that we can all do something about this with a concerted and controlled effort but nobody seems to be doing anything. We have to regain control of our national game. How do we do that?

The thing is though, when you look at the top level of FIFA you can see how dodgy it is, I think everything should be sorted from the top down

 

[Hobo]

This is going to come a bit out of left field and sound slightly ridiculous, but there bear with me. There's an election coming up. Back in the ol' days, we'd get the Union leader to stand for MP (Hello Bob, with your glorious moustache!) and he'd represent the interests of the workers. Well, can't we do the same here? Get people who genuinely care about Football to stand for MP and change it from the inside. I'm sure if they ran on a decent manifesto of points that represent the traditional football fan demographic but also had points to support the game, they'd garner a few votes. Just need a few clubs to do this and we might get somewhere. You don't even need to get elected, just have an independent party or candidate beat a major party (more than likely the Lib Dems) and you get some strong, national media coverage (see the guy who ran the Elvis Bus Pass Party) - it'd make people, and the parties, stand up and listen.

I think you are right, we need political pressure and our elected leaders backing. But please not some self publicist like Nikki Sinclair.

Mind you our political parties not secure from dodgy backers and investments!

 

[VegetableSamosa]

I agree, but would the % of football fans be able to vote them in? For example if you took CCFC as an example then would there be enough oomph? I am not sure exactly what is needed to vote somebody in though.

Just looked at the Parliamentary Election Results for 2010 in Coventry... we wouldn't get someone elected to MP. We probably couldn't even get someone to beat one of the major parties. So, that scuppers my idea pretty much... unless you get media attention just from someone standing on that kind of platform. Be even better if we got it happening in several different cities. But yeah, for now discard my idea.

 

[Astute]

We don't have much of a chance. The FL sides with SISU. We don't know who is involved with SISU. Take it to MP's? Right honest lot they are OK lets take it to the very top. FIFA are all honest :thinking about:

It seems that a large amount of top people in top organisations are only in it for what they can take out. Why would they want to help us when there is nothing to take out?

 

[martcov]

We don't have much of a chance. The FL sides with SISU. We don't know who is involved with SISU. Take it to MP's? Right honest lot they are OK lets take it to the very top. FIFA are all honest :thinking about:

It seems that a large amount of top people in top organisations are only in it for what they can take out. Why would they want to help us when there is nothing to take out?

In our case ML is from the Tony Blair camp. Shows the connections between politics and hedge funds with shady backgrounds.... ML is using the same "skills" for SISU as for Blair. The game is not straight.

 

[mrtrench]

Labovitch said in his interview on CWR last night, "the problem with Bing they never revealed who their investors are." A strange accusation because SISU haven't either. SISU and Arvo Master fund are hedge funds for anonymous investors. The later based in the Caymen Islands so no accounts business profile available in the UK.

Technically Otium own us run by Fisher and Labovitch. Yet both default to our owners and it seems clear Joy calls the shots. I am not sure that fits FL rules, technically Joy doesn't have to be fit and proper.

For example if Otium had failed to post accounts, Fisher and Labovitch would have been accountable, not Joy. Joy technically isn't responsible for anything that happens. How nice to be an owner without responsibility, it's not even her money.

Also funding seems to have moved away from SISU to Arvo Master Fund who now seem to hold the biggest stake. Most people think Joy is connected to them, but there is no documented proof I have seen.

So who is Arvo, is Joy a shepherd, a puppet or an owner?

Where does their money or investments come from. There is no evidence whether it is from hard earned enterprise, crime, drugs or terrorism? We know there is an incentive around tax incentive, some would view it as tax evasion. There are also genuine world wide concerns around hedge funds being used to launder money.

So the source of our funds gives me great concerns, it always has done to a degree. But with the bizarre business model these 'financial experts' run and lack of transparency with their accounting systems I.e our debt varies widely depending on who and which day you speak to them. Also with Otium officially taking over and certain accounts not now being required to be published due to liquidation, we seem to have conveniently lost some continuity around the acquired debt?

To me we seem to be funded (owned) by Arvo and there is no transparency to who they are.

Whilst this is all true, it's hardly news - what is your rationale for posting it now?

 

[Nick]

In our case ML is from the Tony Blair camp. Shows the connections between politics and hedge funds with shady backgrounds.... ML is using the same "skills" for SISU as for Blair. The game is not straight.

Ahh, no link between acl and politics?

 

[Hobo]

Whilst this is all true, it's hardly news - what is your rationale for posting it now?

It was a few things that had me thinking over the last few days
1. Pondering over the accounts and the Arvo angle
2. ML on CWR saying Bing backers were anonymous (well so are SISU's)
3. The continual references to 'our owners', well who are they? SISU, Arvo, Joy or all of them.
4. The situation at Birmingham, Cardiff and Hull.
5. Grendel mentioning Blackpool owners on a thread.
It is not stuff I haven't thought about before Mr Trench but the above 5 points set it off again. Also I wondered how other people on the forum felt. I accept in SISU case the source of the funding maybe legitimate...it is the lack of transparency though that bothers me.

The big problem also for me is football clubs no longer rely on the gate money, it needs very wealthy investors, how vulnerable has it become and how sustainable is it?

 

[James Smith]

We don't have much of a chance. The FL sides with SISU. We don't know who is involved with SISU. Take it to MP's? Right honest lot they are OK lets take it to the very top. FIFA are all honest :thinking about:

It seems that a large amount of top people in top organisations are only in it for what they can take out. Why would they want to help us when there is nothing to take out?

To be fair to (Bollocks) Bob Ainsworth he has done a fair bit to publicise our plight, and he Isn't standing at the next election.

 

[martcov]

Ahh, no link between acl and politics?

The provincial dealings of a non descript relatively small city are no comparison to the shady international network of companies controlled/financed by anonymous wealthy investors - and directors with political contacts way more rich and powerful than our council. The difference for us is that we know ACL (ccc and higgs ) and can therotically vote our councillors out. So ACL any day if given the choice.

 

[bigfatronssba]

Ahh, no link between acl and politics?

I thought it was an independent private company?

 

[lordsummerisle]

I thought it was an independent private company?

Only when it suits apparently.

 

[bigfatronssba]

Only when it suits apparently.

Such as during judicial reviews?

 

[lordsummerisle]

RFC how would you feel if we had lost the services of Leon Clarke because the owners of Wolves were major investors in Arvo Master fund. Next on their list is Calum Wilson. How would the FL, you Or I know if another club wasn't influencing what is happening at Coventry? All hypothetical, but possible.

Pretty much already happened here with the conncection between Ranson's Hedge fund loaning money to Cardiff to buy players whilst he was Chairman.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2011/mar/31/ray-ranson-cardiff-city