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USSR invades Ukraine. (11 Viewers)

  • Thread starter Alan Dugdales Moustache
  • Start date Feb 22, 2022
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shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,446
skybluetony176 said:
Had to look that up.
Click to expand...

One for the comic book nerds.
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,447
Putin the master strategist strikes again


 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,448
PVA said:
Putin the master strategist strikes again


Click to expand...

And Biden and his administration have also said that zekensky needs to be realistic.

so it’s a win win really from a world peace perspective- not there’s any threat to that anyway
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,449
The other message of course it’s sending is go into NATO territory Mr Putin you have a problem. Stay out of it and all is good
 
D

Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,450
Grendel said:
The other message of course it’s sending is go into NATO territory Mr Putin you have a problem. Stay out of it and all is good
Click to expand...
How can you use the words 'all is good' in light if the atrocities that people are suffering in Ukraine? I know they're not your family but...
 
Last edited by a moderator: Jun 29, 2022
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer and Alan Dugdales Moustache
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,451
Grendel said:
And Biden and his administration have also said that zekensky needs to be realistic.

so it’s a win win really from a world peace perspective- not there’s any threat to that anyway
Click to expand...

No I don't for one minute think WW3 is going to start but all Putin has done (so far) is crippled his army while everyone around him strengthens (apart from Ukraine, obviously).
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,452
Grendel said:
The other message of course it’s sending is go into NATO territory Mr Putin you have a problem. Stay out of it and all is good
Click to expand...
...apart from the huge number of atrocities committed, the people killed, displaced or being forced to live under occupation.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,453
Deleted member 9744 said:
How can you use the words 'all is good' in light if the atrocities that people are suffering in Ukraine? I know they're not your family but...
Click to expand...

Its fairly obvious the west won’t be involved or get involved unless borders are crossed
 
Reactions: RegTheDonk

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,454
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
...apart from the huge number of atrocities committed, the people killed, displaced or being forced to live under occupation.
Click to expand...

That’s war - ask Vietnam
 
D

Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 29, 2022
  • #4,455
Grendel said:
Its fairly obvious the west won’t be involved or get involved unless borders are crossed
Click to expand...
That has nothing to do with what I said about your comment. Usual deflection.

Addressing your comment, that's true with regard to NATO borders. However, a border has already been crossed.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,456
Deleted member 9744 said:
That has nothing to do with what I said about your comment. Usual deflection.

Addressing your comment, that's true with regard to NATO borders. However, a border has already been crossed.
Click to expand...

A nato border hasn’t hardly a deflection but a fact
 
D

Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,457
Grendel said:
A nato border hasn’t hardly a deflection but a fact
Click to expand...
It was a different point so it was a deflection.

The border between Russia and Ukraine is also a fact.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,458
Deleted member 9744 said:
It was a different point so it was a deflection.

The border between Russia and Ukraine is also a fact.
Click to expand...

So what? Other countries have been engaged in conflict without a mass involvement from every nato country

As it borders NATO countries there will be more interest but whatever the talk there is not going to be any direct action

In fact a cynical person could view the rhetoric from the White House suits a pretty obvious foreign policy view for decades that Russia is a big enemy and far more a threat than China (not true in reality)

So the best way to drain Russia resources and to look interested in to egg on the invaded country and let the occupation go on and on

No attempt has been made at negotiating some form of peace or even a cease fire which in itself is rather odd
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,459
Grendel said:
So what? Other countries have been engaged in conflict without a mass involvement from every nato country

As it borders NATO countries there will be more interest but whatever the talk there is not going to be any direct action

In fact a cynical person could view the rhetoric from the White House suits a pretty obvious foreign policy view for decades that Russia is a big enemy and far more a threat than China (not true in reality)

So the best way to drain Russia resources and to look interested in to egg on the invaded country and let the occupation go on and on

No attempt has been made at negotiating some form of peace or even a cease fire which in itself is rather odd
Click to expand...

No attempt? So all the times Ukrainian officials met for talks with Russian ones didn’t count?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,460
Brighton Sky Blue said:
No attempt? So all the times Ukrainian officials met for talks with Russian ones didn’t count?
Click to expand...

No attempt at mitigation from the us and NATO to get a practical solution and a settlement
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,461
Grendel said:
No attempt at mitigation from the us and NATO to get a practical solution and a settlement
Click to expand...

Which would basically see us telling Ukraine to suck it up and hand over territory just as we did 85 years ago in Czechoslovakia
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,462
Grendel said:
So what? Other countries have been engaged in conflict without a mass involvement from every nato country

As it borders NATO countries there will be more interest but whatever the talk there is not going to be any direct action

In fact a cynical person could view the rhetoric from the White House suits a pretty obvious foreign policy view for decades that Russia is a big enemy and far more a threat than China (not true in reality)

So the best way to drain Russia resources and to look interested in to egg on the invaded country and let the occupation go on and on

No attempt has been made at negotiating some form of peace or even a cease fire which in itself is rather odd
Click to expand...

Tbh I think the prevailing view in the Biden WH is that China is much more of a threat than Russia, and a lot of the US response to the Ukraine invasion is all about signalling to China what will happen if it tries something similar with Taiwan.
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer, shmmeee and Brighton Sky Blue

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,463
SBT said:
Tbh I think the prevailing view in the Biden WH is that China is much more of a threat than Russia, and a lot of the US response to the Ukraine invasion is all about signalling to China what will happen if it tries something similar with Taiwan.
Click to expand...

What would happen?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,464
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Which would basically see us telling Ukraine to suck it up and hand over territory just as we did 85 years ago in Czechoslovakia
Click to expand...

Well as ever with you the comparison is somewhat spurious
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,465
Grendel said:
What would happen?
Click to expand...
Well it's obviously not perfect, but I guess it's just showing that it isn't just walk in and people roll over - it takes resource and hassle.

As I said, by no means perfect and wouldn't stop them if they truly wanted to - but at least gives them something to weigh up whether they could be bothered, I guess.
 
Reactions: Otis
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,466
Grendel said:
Well as ever with you the comparison is somewhat spurious
Click to expand...

From where I’m standing they’re uncannily similar
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer and Grendel
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,467
Grendel said:
What would happen?
Click to expand...

Well it’s obviously not going to be the exact same playbook, given China’s extreme leverage over everyone, but the message they want to send is that the West will stand firm behind an invaded territory, even if it comes at major economic cost to all concerned.
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,468
Russian forces withdraw from Snake Island, strategically very important. Apparently as a result of Western missile systems.


Though Russia claim they are leaving as a goodwill gesture


 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,469
Ain’t in funny how someone who wants us to do nothing can still find the energy to slate others nations and their leaders for not doing as much as us. Duplicity.
 
D

Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,470
Grendel said:
Well as ever with you the comparison is somewhat spurious
Click to expand...
Why is it spurious? Please explain
 
D

Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,471
skybluetony176 said:
Ain’t in funny how someone who wants us to do nothing can still find the energy to slate others nations and their leaders for not doing as much as us. Duplicity.
Click to expand...
And won't answer as to whether he thinks Trump was a good President or not.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,472
Deleted member 9744 said:
Why is it spurious? Please explain
Click to expand...

Why? The poster who made the comment has offered zero explanation as to the “striking similarities”
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,473
Deleted member 9744 said:
And won't answer as to whether he thinks Trump was a good President or not.
Click to expand...

Oh dear is the UKIP Tonester off again?

Why you drone on I have no idea. I’m not American and I don’t live in America so I have no idea if he was good or not. I don’t actually care. As Jon Sopel said in a good article at least the chaos he bought was vaguely amusing compared to someone who looks like he should be in a care home

I couldn’t care less and I have no opinion on him. He was elected democratically and then unelected im not really interested
 
Reactions: Deleted member 9744
D

Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,474
Grendel said:
Why? The poster who made the comment has offered zero explanation as to the “striking similarities”
Click to expand...
It's clear what the similarities are but you seem unable to explain your claim that it is spurious.
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,475
Grendel said:
Why? The poster who made the comment has offered zero explanation as to the “striking similarities”
Click to expand...

Well let’s see

1937

Hitler decides there is a high number of ethnic Germans on Czechoslovak soil who are ‘being oppressed’
Hitler demands the territory be handed over
Munich agreement is signed bowing to the demand but does nothing except give Germany a head start on the subsequent invasion

2022
Putin complains of mistreatment of Russians in Donetsk and Luhansk
Putin invades from 3 directions under the aim of ‘liberating’ the oppressed Russians
Grendel proposes giving him what he wants and calls it spurious to make the same comparison as the head of the army

Let him crack on with it you said. How would things have turned out if we did?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,476
Deleted member 9744 said:
It's clear what the similarities are but you seem unable to explain your claim that it is spurious.
Click to expand...

ok I don’t see any so what similarities do you see?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,477
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Well let’s see

1937

Hitler decides there is a high number of ethnic Germans on Czechoslovak soil who are ‘being oppressed’
Hitler demands the territory be handed over
Munich agreement is signed bowing to the demand but does nothing except give Germany a head start on the subsequent invasion

2022
Putin complains of mistreatment of Russians in Donetsk and Luhansk
Putin invades from 3 directions under the aim of ‘liberating’ the oppressed Russians
Grendel proposes giving him what he wants and calls it spurious to make the same comparison as the head of the army

Let him crack on with it you said. How would things have turned out if we did?
Click to expand...

Russia have been for years declaring Ukrainian territory as Russian and when invading the much disputed Crimea I can’t remember a peep from you about that or other attempts to take over Donbass

Hitler had armed himself to the hilt and was preparing for a conquest of Europe - he also operated in an era where certain other nations had dictators with equal dubious intent

We have no formal treaty or legal obligation to Ukraine

NATO didn’t then exist - there was not a huge committed military alliance of nations who are signed up to protect each other

Hitler didn’t have nuclear weapons

The US had zero interest in Hitler - they have most certainly a huge interest in Mr Putin

Putin and his army is weak and has no capacity for a European invasion

China in economic strategic and political terms was non existent then and most certainly isn’t now

I think you are sitting in the 1930’s the only threat to global peace is if we actively defend a non NATO country which would open up a huge can of worms and potential dangers
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,478
Oh and Hitler had an army if 1.5 million committed to the ideology
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,479
PVA said:
Russian forces withdraw from Snake Island, strategically very important. Apparently as a result of Western missile systems.


Though Russia claim they are leaving as a goodwill gesture


Click to expand...

Great news. It’s strategically important if Russia want to take the south coast ports from what I understand.
 
Reactions: Otis
D

Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 30, 2022
  • #4,480
Grendel said:
Oh dear is the UKIP Tonester off again?

Why you drone on I have no idea. I’m not American and I don’t live in America so I have no idea if he was good or not. I don’t actually care. As Jon Sopel said in a good article at least the chaos he bought was vaguely amusing compared to someone who looks like he should be in a care home

I couldn’t care less and I have no opinion on him. He was elected democratically and then unelected im not really interested
Click to expand...
Amazing in light of all the evidence that you can't see he was terrible. Telling people to inject bleach alone is enough.
 
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