Tommy Robinson (3 Viewers)

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Nick said:
Are you still upset because I called him a little bitch and that he was crying in between disproving what you say and not letting you turn it into a discussion about Islam?.

There you go again. Trying to suggest I am upset when all I did was point out that your polemic use of language weakens your case. You’re unable to have a discussion without resorting to childish name calling.

And it’s obvious why you don’t want to talk about Islam even though it goes to the very heart of the debate. You don’t want me to embarrass you like I did with Tony when he posted about anti Semitism in Christianity.

I don’t even agree with a lot of what TR says about Muslims. But according to you and others on here I accept everything he says without question.

Nick · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
There you go again. Trying to suggest I am upset when all I did was point out that your polemic use of language weakens your case. You’re unable to have a discussion without resorting to childish name calling.

And it’s obvious why you don’t want to talk about Islam even though it goes to the very heart of the debate. You don’t want me to embarrass you like I did with Tony when he posted about anti Semitism in Christianity.

I don’t even agree with a lot of what TR says about Muslims. But according to you and others on here I accept everything he says without question.

I asked if you were upset because you ignored actual points to bring the wording up.

I've had a discussion, meanwhile you try to take it off on a tangent about Islam.

You have accepted things he has said without question, that's why I'm saying it.

I'm not really worried in the slightest about you embarrassing me when it comes to religion, I don't claim to know about it so you probably would.

It's the same as you don't know about his latest visit to prison so you are being embarrassed.

What next? You don't like it because I don't let you take it off on a discussion about Islam away from things he has bullshitted to distract.

Sick Boy · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
Where’s your evidenc? Oh right you don’t have any. You’re just making shit up.

It's on his prison complaint form that was posted in this thread.

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Nick said:
So you didn't know about who populates it then if you didn't know the catchment area? That is exactly what my point was, that you only knew things about it that he had put out because of an agenda.

Maybe we just find it funnier to let you walk into things with your lack of knowledge and look silly? Saying "catchment area" is exactly that, nobody said it was located in Luton as it isn't. You thought you had hit a jackpot and were disproving people talking about the muslim population of Luton by saying where it was.

It's actually Onley as well.

My point was that the term “catchment area” was misleading because if someone didn’t know the prison was in Rugby they would assume it was in Luton. Assuming Tony knew it’s location, his use of the phrase was disingenuous.

As I said before, if I pulled you and others up for every misleading use of language I’d have to make this a FT job. Anyway people can make up their own minds. You’re destroying your own arguments with the polemic language, ad hominems, and straw manning.

Nick · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
My point was that the term “catchment area” was misleading because if someone didn’t know the prison was in Rugby they would assume it was in Luton. Assuming Tony knew it’s location, his use of the phrase was disingenuous.

As I said before, if I pulled you and others up for every misleading use of language I’d have to make this a FT job. Anyway people can make up their own minds. You’re destroying your own arguments with the polemic language, ad hominems, and straw manning.

Of course Tony knew his location, he lives by it. The catchment area was relevant in the discussion.

You are the one making it about language because I called him a little bitch.

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Sick Boy said:
It's on his prison complaint form that was posted in this thread.

And as I pointed out the “racist” part entered the discussion only because the complaint form required a box to be filled. But you and Nick try to spin it as being a complaint about racism when it wasn’t. And nicks now trying to wriggle out of it by saying he never claimed that TR had used the word “racism”. Wriggle, wriggle, wriggle.

I see you still refuse to condemn the verses in the Quran and Hadith that call for the murder of Jews, gays, and apostates. People can draw their own conclusions about your motives.

Nick · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
And as I pointed out the “racist” part entered the discussion only because the complaint form required a box to be filled. But you and Nick try to spin it as being a complaint about racism when it wasn’t. And nicks now trying to wriggle out of it by saying he never claimed that TR had used the word “racism”. Wriggle, wriggle, wriggle.

I see you still refuse to condemn the verses in the Quran and Hadith that call for the murder of Jews, gays, and apostates. People can draw their own conclusions about your motives.

It was a tick box, pretty sure it isn't required.

I didn't say he used the word racism, I quoted exactly what I meant.

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Nick said:
Of course Tony knew his location, he lives by it. The catchment area was relevant in the discussion.

You are the one making it about language because I called him a little bitch.

I’m making it about language because I am trying to help you make a stronger argument so we can have an intelligent discussion.

Sick Boy · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
And as I pointed out the “racist” part entered the discussion only because the complaint form required a box to be filled. But you and Nick try to spin it as being a complaint about racism when it wasn’t. And nicks now trying to wriggle out of it by saying he never claimed that TR had used the word “racism”. Wriggle, wriggle, wriggle.

I see you still refuse to condemn the verses in the Quran and Hadith that call for the murder of Jews, gays, and apostates. People can draw their own conclusions about your motives.

One of my best friends is Jewish and I am also good friends with his uncle who also happens to be Jewish AND gay.

I also live in the UK's gay capital.

I'll let people draw conclusions from that, thanks.

Anyway, I've already condemned any religious text or text in general that calls for anyone to be killed.

Deleted member 5849 · Aug 7, 2018

Sick Boy said:
One of my best friends is Jewish and I am also good friends with his uncle who also happens to be Jewish AND gay.

I also live in the UK's gay capital.

I'll let people draw conclusions from that, thanks.

You're Jewish and gay?

Nick · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
I’m making it about language because I am trying to help you make a stronger argument so we can have an intelligent discussion.

No, what you mean is you want to steer it away from a discussion I know more about to something else.

I don't really think I need help, I've pointed out things he has made up and things he has exaggerated.

I've got no interest in going over the rules of Islam or some other shite so you can show off your intelligence.

I'll stick to being blunt with facts and logic

Grendel · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
And as I pointed out the “racist” part entered the discussion only because the complaint form required a box to be filled. But you and Nick try to spin it as being a complaint about racism when it wasn’t. And nicks now trying to wriggle out of it by saying he never claimed that TR had used the word “racism”. Wriggle, wriggle, wriggle.

I see you still refuse to condemn the verses in the Quran and Hadith that call for the murder of Jews, gays, and apostates. People can draw their own conclusions about your motives.

95% of the Muslim don’t actually followed that doctrine though. Until very recently the Muslim community has lived in this country without a second thought.

The advent of extremism is a result of our absurd decision to interfere in Middle East politics. It’s created a movement of extremism which has impacted small elements of the Muslim community in our society. There is yes a problem with Pakistan males in large deprived areas. But there is not in the vast majority of the Muslim community.

Robinson uses the extremism as a mirror to equally reflect hatred and anger and violence in the white community

I’m amazed you have any time for it as you are clearly far from stupid.

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Nick said:
It was a tick box, pretty sure it isn't required.

I didn't say he used the word racism, I quoted exactly what I meant.

You said it was a complaint about racism. Your post was meant to mislead anyone who didn’t know what the complaint was really about. Glad to see you finally admitted it was just a tick box.

But even now you are making assertions without evidence. How do you know a tick wasn’t required in order for the complaint to be processed? More important, how do you know that TR didn’t think it was required?

Are you going to retract your erroneous assertion that it was a complaint about racism?

Nick · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
You said it was a complaint about racism. Your post was meant to mislead anyone who didn’t know what the complaint was really about. Glad to see you finally admitted it was just a tick box.

But even now you are making assertions without evidence. How do you know a tick wasn’t required in order for the complaint to be processed? More important, how do you know that TR didn’t think it was required?

Are you going to retract your erroneous assertion that it was a complaint about racism?

Where did I say it wasn't a tick box? He ticked it to show the basis of his complaint to say it was racial and bullying didn't he?

Why would it be required to tick them? What if their complaints aren't about bullying or racial and want some loo roll? (It isn't required by the way)

Are you that desperate you are trying to instinuate he didn't know how to fill out a complaint form? Jeez.

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Grendel said:
95% of the Muslim don’t actually followed that doctrine though. Until very recently the Muslim community has lived in this country without a second thought.
I’m amazed you have any time for it as you are clearly far from stupid.

I'm not sure where you get the 95% figure from. In addition your post refers to "Muslims" whereas the survey data show that the views differ greatly across countries.

How about providing links next time? Here's some for you to be going on with, including some from the UK which refute your 95% claim:

83% of Pakistanis support stoning adulterers
78% of Pakistanis support killing apostates
Pakistan: New Poll Shows 78 Percent of Pakistanis Support Death Penalty for Leaving Islam | Responsible for Equality And Liberty (R.E.A.L.)

ICM Poll: 40% of British Muslims want Sharia in the UK
Poll reveals 40pc of Muslims want sharia law in UK

GfK NOP: 28% of British Muslims want Britain to be an Islamic state
http://www.civitas.org.uk/pdf/ShariaLawOrOneLawForAll.pdf

NOP Research: 68% of British Muslims support the arrest and prosecution of anyone who insults Islam;
Many British Muslims Put Islam First
http://www.webcitation.org/5xkMGAEvY

Pew Research (2010): 82% of Egyptian Muslims favor stoning adulterers
70% of Jordanian Muslims favor stoning adulterers
42% of Indonesian Muslims favor stoning adulterers
82% of Pakistanis favor stoning adulterers
56% of Nigerian Muslims favor stoning adulterers
Muslim Publics Divided on Hamas and Hezbollah

ICM Poll (2016): 23% of British Muslim support the introduction of Sharia in the UK "instead of British Law"
More than half of Muslims want gay sex to be outlawed, ICM poll reveals | Daily Mail Online

ICM Poll (2016): 21% of British Muslims decline to condemn stoning adulterers.
More than half of Muslims want gay sex to be outlawed, ICM poll reveals | Daily Mail Online

Sky Blue Pete · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
I'm not sure where you get the 95% figure from. In addition your post refers to "Muslims" whereas the survey data show that the views differ greatly across countries.

How about providing links next time? Here's some for you to be going on with, including some from the UK which refute your 95% claim:

83% of Pakistanis support stoning adulterers
78% of Pakistanis support killing apostates
Pakistan: New Poll Shows 78 Percent of Pakistanis Support Death Penalty for Leaving Islam | Responsible for Equality And Liberty (R.E.A.L.)

ICM Poll: 40% of British Muslims want Sharia in the UK
Poll reveals 40pc of Muslims want sharia law in UK

GfK NOP: 28% of British Muslims want Britain to be an Islamic state
http://www.civitas.org.uk/pdf/ShariaLawOrOneLawForAll.pdf

NOP Research: 68% of British Muslims support the arrest and prosecution of anyone who insults Islam;
Many British Muslims Put Islam First
http://www.webcitation.org/5xkMGAEvY

Pew Research (2010): 82% of Egyptian Muslims favor stoning adulterers
70% of Jordanian Muslims favor stoning adulterers
42% of Indonesian Muslims favor stoning adulterers
82% of Pakistanis favor stoning adulterers
56% of Nigerian Muslims favor stoning adulterers
Muslim Publics Divided on Hamas and Hezbollah

ICM Poll (2016): 23% of British Muslim support the introduction of Sharia in the UK "instead of British Law"
More than half of Muslims want gay sex to be outlawed, ICM poll reveals | Daily Mail Online

ICM Poll (2016): 21% of British Muslims decline to condemn stoning adulterers.
More than half of Muslims want gay sex to be outlawed, ICM poll reveals | Daily Mail Online

The only relevant stats are uk ones.

Grendel · Aug 7, 2018

Sky Blue Pete said:
The only relevant stats are uk ones.

Oh I looked at one - the Sharia law one - I assume it’s the discredited rubbish by the policy exchange - a far right group with a racist agenda.

If so It’s a discredited survey. I can’t be bothered to look at the rest.

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Sky Blue Pete said:
The only relevant stats are uk ones.

I included both UK and non-UK because Grendel referred generically to "Muslims". I see you have no comment about the UK surveys.

Grendel · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
I included both UK and non-UK because Grendel referred generically to "Muslims". I see you have no comment about the UK surveys.

I do I looked at one that I assume was a discredited far right one and clearly meant uk Muslims. Catholics in Africa want homosexuals executed so of course we can only focus on Britain

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Grendel said:
Oh I looked at one - the Sharia law one - I assume it’s the discredited rubbish by the policy exchange - a far right group with a racist agenda.

If so It’s a discredited survey. I can’t be bothered to look at the rest.

Your assumption is wrong. It is an ICM poll commissioned by the Daily Telegraph.

This really illustrates the issue. When I put evidence right under your noses you say you can't be bothered to look. Some people are beyond help.

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Grendel said:
I do I looked at one that I assume was a discredited far right one and clearly meant uk Muslims. Catholics in Africa want homosexuals executed so of course we can only focus on Britain

It might help to stop making assumptions (like your 95% one that was plucked out of your ass) and actually look at the evidence.

Grendel · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
It might help to stop making assumptions (like your 95% one that was plucked out of your ass) and actually look at the evidence.

So is this a poll that’s 12 years old?

Sky Blue Pete · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
I included both UK and non-UK because Grendel referred generically to "Muslims". I see you have no comment about the UK surveys.

Ok it was the daily mail so mmmmmmmm and I’m happy that people feel strongly about their faith and hold to it mostly but where the acts they are condoning are things like murder you have to question its legitimacy

skybluetony176 · Aug 7, 2018

An insider reveals Tommy Robinson's far-right platform is actually a 'get rich quick' scheme | The Canary

I see another news outlet has picked up on this. Can’t see that any of the majors has. Maybe a freedom of speech issue. If only Stephen Yaxley-Lennon was here, he’d expose it.

singers_pore · Aug 7, 2018

Grendel said:
So is this a poll that’s 12 years old?

Do you expect me to spend time searching for an earlier one just for you to turn round and say you can't be bothered to look at it? There are literally dozens of such surveys out there, many from highly reputable organizations such as ICM, Gallup and Pew. At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter what evidence I provide does it? You are locked into your assumptions and refuse to consider the evidence.

Still waiting for evidence to back up your 95% statistic. I suspect I'll be waiting a long time.

Macca · Aug 7, 2018

Sick Boy said:
One of my best friends is Jewish and I am also good friends with his uncle who also happens to be Jewish AND gay.

I also live in the UK's gay capital.

I'll let people draw conclusions from that, thanks.

Dangerous invitation on here!

Are you the fruity Rabbi of West Sussex?

AVWskyblue · Aug 7, 2018

singers_pore said:
I knew full well the location and population of Onsley. If you look back you will see I was responding Tony’s comment about Onsley being in TR’s “catchment area” which was obviously misleading because it suggested that Onsley was near to Luton. Maybe you and Tony should choose your words more carefully.

It's Onley

Sent from my 5010X using Tapatalk

Nick · Aug 8, 2018

AVWskyblue said:
It's Onley

Sent from my 5010X using Tapatalk

Don't bring things like that into it, all you need to know about it is what Tommy Robinson has said about it and you will know everything you need to know.

skybluetony176 · Aug 8, 2018

Nick said:
Of course Tony knew his location, he lives by it. The catchment area was relevant in the discussion.

You are the one making it about language because I called him a little bitch.

Not only do I live near by I know people who work there very well so was able to fact check his claims very easily and confirm that he was always going to moved from Hull to a prison in the catchment area for where he lives as soon as space became available, that just so happened to be Onley. Just to be clear I didn’t know he was there until it was reported that his little protest group were planning on going there to protest after the London protest. It never happened apparently in the end.

Nick · Aug 8, 2018

skybluetony176 said:
Not only do I live near by I know people who work there very well so was able to fact check his claims very easily and confirm that he was always going to moved from Hull to a prison in the catchment area for where he lives as soon as space became available, that just so happened to be Onley. Just to be clear I didn’t know he was there until it was reported that his little protest group were planning on going there to protest after the London protest. It never happened apparently in the end.

I was trying to keep it simple...

skybluetony176 · Aug 8, 2018

Nick said:
I was trying to keep it simple...

Probably best. Given the mentality of his followers.

Captain Dart · Aug 8, 2018

singers_pore said:
There are Imams who say it’s fine for Muslim men to rape non Muslim women because it’s in the Quran and Hadith. I’ve never heard a Christian or atheist say anything like that. Hence you are making a false equivalenc.

Although that sort of shit is also in the Bible, which was a one of the sources Mohamed plagiarised to invent his religion as well as earlier myths and existing Arab beliefs, laws & customs.

shmmeee · Aug 8, 2018

singers_pore said:
And as I pointed out the “racist” part entered the discussion only because the complaint form required a box to be filled. But you and Nick try to spin it as being a complaint about racism when it wasn’t. And nicks now trying to wriggle out of it by saying he never claimed that TR had used the word “racism”. Wriggle, wriggle, wriggle.

I see you still refuse to condemn the verses in the Quran and Hadith that call for the murder of Jews, gays, and apostates. People can draw their own conclusions about your motives.

The only extremism Nick is interested in happens on the football pitch and involves two footed tackles. Have a word.

Grendel · Aug 8, 2018

singers_pore said:
It might help to stop making assumptions (like your 95% one that was plucked out of your ass) and actually look at the evidence.

The comment was relating to extremism. There are I think around 2.6 million Muslims in the uk. Extremists identified are at 25,000 according to reports. So even if you factor out the very young and the very elderly then it’s never going to exceed 5% that practice extreme behaviour.

The point was that the vast majority exist without any interference into the uk way of life.

Ashdown · Aug 8, 2018

Grendel said:
The comment was relating to extremism. There are I think around 2.6 million Muslims in the uk. Extremists identified are at 25,000 according to reports. So even if you factor out the very young and the very elderly then it’s never going to exceed 5% that practice extreme behaviour.

The point was that the vast majority exist without any interference into the uk way of life.

25,000 is way too many ! That volume of 'Enemies of the state' doesn't sit well with me at all. I do agree with you though, if we hadn't interfered with Middle East and North African dictatorships then there wouldn't be a fraction of the problem.

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