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The PR game (6 Viewers)

  • Thread starter oldskyblue58
  • Start date Sep 24, 2013
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kmj5000

Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #36
theferret said:
Again, you are missing the point. CCFC could not afford the rent. Do you not get that distinction? Or are you saying it is the duty of the owners of a football club to continually subsidise it and not wish for it to become self-sufficient and self-financing?
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But they can afford to alienate 8000+ fans and the entrance fees they would have paid to come and watch the team they once supported........? Can't afford the rent....? Can't afford not to, surely? It's just bollocks, and you know it!
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #37
Sky Blue Kid said:
Grenduffy....It means he couldn't be arsed to look at any facts - he'd prefer to talk out of his arse.............................................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Says the man who bases facts on "Estimates" lmfao.
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The estimated facts quote is so old it's going to soon be appearing on the antiques road show.

I don't actually believe I said it in the context you use anyway.
 
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theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #38
kmj5000 said:
But they can afford to alienate 8000+ fans and the entrance fees they would have paid to come and watch the team they once supported........? Can't afford the rent....? Can't afford not to, surely? It's just bollocks, and you know it!
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I could answer, but then you could also read the whole thread because I think you'll find this point had been answered (twice).
 

skybluelee

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #39
bigfatronssba said:
But they have never answered as to why they just didn't stay at the Ricoh until this mythical new ground is built?

The fundementals are the club is over £2m a year worse off than had it stayed at the Ricoh.
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Thanks, saved me a post! Although surely the fig is closer to £4m?
 

Sky Blue Kid

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #40
theferret........I could point out that SISU had negotiated a deal to buy 50% of ACL last year - agreed (in writing) by all parties, only for the council to walk away......................................................................................Put up a link please.
 

davebart

Active Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #41
I think it is wonderful how Cov fans can keep up this - its SISUs fault - no its ACL/CCCs fault - endlessly. There seems to be infinite ways of people saying exactly the same thing day after day after day.
 

Sky Blue Kid

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #42
Grenduffy....The estimated facts quote is so old it's going to soon be appearing on the antiques road show. I don't actually believe I said it in the context you use anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Eeerrrrrr your a lying twat mate you meant it EXACTLY in the context. Claiming a website you use claim undisclosed fees to be a FACT!
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #43
Sky Blue Kid said:
Grenduffy....The estimated facts quote is so old it's going to soon be appearing on the antiques road show. I don't actually believe I said it in the context you use anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Eeerrrrrr your a lying twat mate you meant it EXACTLY in the context. Claiming a website you use claim undisclosed fees to be a FACT!
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Really? Do you have a link?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #44
theferret said:
I could point out that SISU had negotiated a deal to buy 50% of ACL last year - agreed (in writing) by all parties, only for the council to walk away. But then, I have pointed this out many times and it falls on deaf ears. Not sure how you reconcile that fact with the "couldn't be arsed" statement.
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But it was SISU that walked away as they wanted the whole thing for much less. We would have known every bit of detail from Timothy if it was ACL that walked away......and a good chance of another court battle.
 

Sky Blue Kid

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #45
Tell you what Grenduffy YOU put up a link to show me that you didn't use it in the context I use?
 
T

theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #46
Sky Blue Kid said:
theferret........I could point out that SISU had negotiated a deal to buy 50% of ACL last year - agreed (in writing) by all parties, only for the council to walk away......................................................................................Put up a link please.
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Where have you been? This has been talked about endlessly and TF's comments on the matter regurgitated time and time again. I'm not sure have much more to say on it.

For what it's worth, the quotes are below. All true? The lack of any sort of denial from ACL or CCC on this suggests it probably is. I doubt even TF would lie about a signed document that didn't exist, given that this very issue is the subject of a JR.

Why it matters I don't know, most people know this, and most people don't care - it's all 'ACL good, SISU bad' like some fucking Orwellian nightmare. Anyhow, the quotes you wanted (taken from a CET interview):

"We made an incredibly generous offer. ACL’s bankers were willing to support the offer which would have stopped them from foreclosing on ACL and which would have left ACL debt free, while the council’s deal has not. For reasons which are beyond us, the council then spent £14m of public money to take over as ACL’s bankers and, hence, terminated discussions."

"A deal was on the table in December last year – reached without expensive advisers – which would have provided a viable commercial solution for ACL and the club, but ACL declined it and went on to launch a series of legal measures using two law firms."

"In an attempt to put both the club and ACL on a sound financial footing we had a series of meetings in 2012 aimed at resolving the financial difficulties facing both parties.

"As part of this, we reached agreement with the council to buy out the ACL debt in return for a half share in the stadium business and extension of ACL’s lease to 125 years, which means it remain 100 per cent council-owned – we would just access the revenues, which is crucial. This deal was documented, signed by all parties and then reneged on by the council. The council made the problem even worse by then using public funds, something that is now subject to the judicial review proceedings."

"We need to be very clear that this is not about ownership of the freehold in the stadium which would have continued to be held by the council, with the club taking back the 50 per cent interest in head-leaseholder ACL which it was always intended to have."
 
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theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #47
Astute said:
But it was SISU that walked away as they wanted the whole thing for much less. We would have known every bit of detail from Timothy if it was ACL that walked away......and a good chance of another court battle.
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Uh? This has been mentioned continuously by TF, it was the point when everything broke down. Are people still unaware of this?

It's like Groundhog Day in here.
 

Sky Blue Kid

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #48
Lmfao......Says Fisher with not one Iota of proof put forward! All this declared by Fisher who is well known to...how can I say this?....bend the truth or even.......Lie through his fecking teeth!!!.... FFS anyone putting up anything remotely like you have just done would be "Shouted down" and called an "ACL lover" Get a grip for fecks sake!!!
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #49
theferret said:
Uh? This has been mentioned continuously by TF, it was the point when everything broke down. Are people still unaware of this?

It's like Groundhog Day in here.
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So what Timothy considers to have been a good offer must have been a good offer?

I was on about the offer made to take over the Higgs share. They only wanted their money back. SISU walked away from that. Wanted the whole thing for not much more.....hence the judicial review and then challenging it because the judge saw right through what they were doing.
 
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theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #50
Sky Blue Kid said:
Lmfao......Says Fisher with not one Iota of proof put forward! All this declared by Fisher who is well known to...how can I say this?....bend the truth or even.......Lie through his fecking teeth!!!.... FFS anyone putting up anything remotely like you have just done would be "Shouted down" and called an "ACL lover" Get a grip for fecks sake!!!
Click to expand...

Grow up you clown.

Given the tendency for ACL to jump up and down and issue angry press statements in response to anything TF says that they don't agree with, the COMPLETE ABSENCE of any denial of these claims are more than enough evidence that this signed document exists and the statements are true. TF has spun and lied many times, but I for one believe him on this issue, and this very claim was put to PWKH on here and no denial was forthcoming. Get over it, there was a deal and the council reneged. Just as SISU reneged of the revised rent deal that followed early in 2013. Why that is so difficult to get your head around I have no idea.
 
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Tonylinc

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #51
Well, I must have been living on another planet for some time as I certainly do not recall such a statement. You say that it was in a CET interview. Send me a link.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #52
Sky Blue Kid said:
Tell you what Grenduffy YOU put up a link to show me that you didn't use it in the context I use?
Click to expand...

So you lied - well you have form for that don't you? Perhaps your live streaming beamed the words estimated facts during the bury game and you got confused.
 
T

theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #53
Astute said:
So what Timothy considers to have been a good offer must have been a good offer?

I was on about the offer made to take over the Higgs share. They only wanted their money back. SISU walked away from that. Wanted the whole thing for not much more.....hence the judicial review and then challenging it because the judge saw right through what they were doing.
Click to expand...

Well it couldn't have been that bad if all sides signed a headline agreement could it?

And no, the JR followed the breakdown of the deal TF was referring to, which concerned the purchase of the 50% stake owned by the council, not the Higgs share which was not part of those negotiations. The council agreed to sell THEIR share of ACL to SISU in return for SISU paying off the mortgage in full. They agreed, then changed their mind. Fine, people are allowed to do that, but that is happened is not really in doubt.
 

ohitsaidwalker king power

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #54
Tonylinc said:
Well, I must have been living on another planet for some time as I certainly do not recall such a statement. You say that it was in a CET interview. Send me a link.
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Heres an interesting CT link Tony..

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/judge-throws-out-sky-blues-5667471


"Mr Justice Males has made the reasons for his judgment very clear. We note, in particular, his reference to the withholding of lawfully owed rent by SISU as a means of exerting pressure on ACL in commercial negotiations, which had led to an unsatisfied judgment in the High Court in ACL’s favour.”
 
T

theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #55
Tonylinc said:
Well, I must have been living on another planet for some time as I certainly do not recall such a statement. You say that it was in a CET interview. Send me a link.
Click to expand...

Oh FFS http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sp...ews/coventry-city-chief-executive-tim-4010343

Question 9 I think. Given that this interview prompted a 1000 page thread on here, I'm amazed at how so many seem oblivious to its existence. The extent to which some people are willing to go to absolve the council of any blame is staggering.
 

Sky Blue Kid

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #56
@ theferret........http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/exclusive-sisu-strikes-coventry-city-3019922>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>This is a legitimate link!!! and we all know who reneged on this don't we eh?
 

hill83

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #57
If it doesn't fit with the general consensus on here it gets roundly ignored. You know that ferret, and don't pretend otherwise.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #58
theferret said:
Oh FFS http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sp...ews/coventry-city-chief-executive-tim-4010343

Question 9 I think. Given that this interview prompted a 1000 page thread on here, I'm amazed at how so many seem oblivious to its existence. The extent to which some people are willing to go to absolve the council of any blame is staggering.
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What amazes me the most is the amount of people on here that use the comment of some people seeing the council as not to blame in any way. Name me anyone who thinks this way? The vast majority see SISU more to blame than the council though. This is nothing similar to what you keep saying though.
 
T

theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #59
Sky Blue Kid said:
@ theferret........http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/exclusive-sisu-strikes-coventry-city-3019922>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>This is a legitimate link!!! and we all know who reneged on this don't we eh?
Click to expand...

Are you questioning the legitimacy of my CT link now? At least mine is clickable.
 

ohitsaidwalker king power

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #60
theferret said:
Are you questioning the legitimacy of my CT link now? At least mine is clickable.
Click to expand...

and post 54.. ?
 
T

theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #61
hill83 said:
If it doesn't fit with the general consensus on here it gets roundly ignored. You know that ferret, and don't pretend otherwise.
Click to expand...

Aye. I guess people see what they want to see and hear what they want to hear. It's a tactic I employ regularly when in the company of my wife, so I shouldn't be too judgmental.
 
T

theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #62
ohitsaidwalker king power said:
and post 54.. ?
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...is completely irrelevant.
 

hill83

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #63
theferret said:
...is completely irrelevant.
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I was about to say this. It's a valid link with valid information, but has nothing to do with the point at hand. Might as well post a link to the villa website.

So in conclusion, post 54: 4/10.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #64
theferret said:
...is completely irrelevant.
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In what way?

Shows why SISU walked away from the Higgs share.....unless you are saying the judge is part of the conspiracy trying to prove that the council are free of all blame :thinking about:
 
T

Tonylinc

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #65
theferret said:
Oh FFS http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sp...ews/coventry-city-chief-executive-tim-4010343

Question 9 I think. Given that this interview prompted a 1000 page thread on here, I'm amazed at how so many seem oblivious to its existence. The extent to which some people are willing to go to absolve the council of any blame is staggering.
Click to expand...
Tim Fisher.....a source of honesty and integrity???????/
 

ohitsaidwalker king power

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #66
theferret said:
...is completely irrelevant.
Click to expand...

hill83 said:
I was about to say this. It's a valid link with valid information, but has nothing to do with the point at hand. Might as well post a link to the villa website.

So in conclusion, post 54: 4/10.
Click to expand...

In your opinion.. this thread is about PR?..PR is about hearts and minds is it not....public relations.. for me this was SISUs number 1 PR faux pas... up until then most moderates like me(as was) had more than a degree of empathy with the 'must reduce the rent argument'.....but then this.. ILLEGAL ACT.... if that doesnt self defeat a PR battle, nowt will?
Lets not forget
 

hill83

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #67
Tonylinc said:
Tim Fisher.....a source of honesty and integrity???????/
Click to expand...

Of course not, but it's been out there to be denied by the council for months and never has been. That's good enough for some.
 

hill83

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #68
ohitsaidwalker king power said:
In your opinion.. this thread is about PR?..PR is about hearts and minds is it not....public relations.. for me this was SISUs number 1 PR faux pas... up until then most moderates like me(as was) had more than a degree of empathy with the 'must reduce the rent argument'.....but then this.. ILLEGAL ACT.... if that doesnt self defeat a PR battle, nowt will?
Lets not forget
Click to expand...

Point taken, fully legitimate link within the context of the thread as a whole.

I'll up it to a 9/10.
 
T

theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #69
Astute said:
In what way?

Shows why SISU walked away from the Higgs share.....unless you are saying the judge is part of the conspiracy trying to prove that the council are free of all blame :thinking about:
Click to expand...

I think your post #54 links to a different article than mine.
 
T

theferret

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 24, 2013
  • #70
hill83 said:
Point taken, fully legitimate link within the context of the thread as a whole.

I'll up it to a 9/10.
Click to expand...

ohitsaidwalker king power apologist.
 
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