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The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (11 Viewers)

  • Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
  • Start date Jun 8, 2016
Forums New posts

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%
  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed Jun 15, 2016.
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Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,481
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Might need some migrants who can educate children, because we don't have enough. Or to provide medical care, because we don't have enough. Or for scientific research, because we don't have enough. And we don't have enough because education is horrendously underfunded and teaching has been in crisis for years.
Click to expand...
Yet we keep needing even more because of the population going up so fast. We need schools building. We need hospitals building. We need homes building. We need more teachers. We need mire medical staff. We need HR2 to take the strain off the railway network (allegedly). And the more the population goes up the more we need. To pay for this the tax we pay needs to go up.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,482
Astute said:
Yet we keep needing even more because of the population going up so fast. We need schools building. We need hospitals building. We need homes building. We need more teachers. We need mire medical staff. We need HR2 to take the strain off the railway network (allegedly). And the more the population goes up the more we need. To pay for this the tax we pay needs to go up.
Click to expand...

They should invest in the current networks across the country rather than the vanity project.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,483
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Who has been worst affected and did we already have it within our power to do something?
Click to expand...
Of course we did. But the more that move here the worse the situation gets. The worse the situation gets the mire get affected by it. The more that get affected by it the more that will vote leave.

Why else are right wingers getting more votes throughout the EU? Different people get affected in different ways. You can't just say someone is thick for wanting to leave the EU.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,484
Astute said:
Of course we did. But the more that move here the worse the situation gets. The worse the situation gets the mire get affected by it. The more that get affected by it the more that will vote leave.

Why else are right wingers getting more votes throughout the EU? Different people get affected in different ways. You can't just say someone is thick for wanting to leave the EU.
Click to expand...

And yet again it returns to your issues with internal EU FoM.
 
Reactions: clint van damme and martcov

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,485
Sick Boy said:
They should invest in the current networks across the country rather than the vanity project.
Click to expand...
As I said.....allegedly. Yes it would help. People could get a direct train instead of joining the present networks. But 100 billion plus that it looks like and not the 56 billion as they tell us?
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,486
Astute said:
Of course we did. But the more that move here the worse the situation gets. The worse the situation gets the mire get affected by it. The more that get affected by it the more that will vote leave.

Why else are right wingers getting more votes throughout the EU? Different people get affected in different ways. You can't just say someone is thick for wanting to leave the EU.
Click to expand...

I didn't say that did I. I repeat-immigration is greater from outside the EU and the Tories did nothing to address it because deep down they know that we lack enough of our own workers to fill the gap. If you're blaming immigration for your woes and think leaving the EU will solve it you're looking in the wrong direction. That and we already had the power to send back EU migrants.

Arguments about not wanting more integration with Europe I disagree with, but are at least based on the objective reality of where the EU is heading. But let's be honest, it wasn't about that for most Leave voters according to any poll done on the subject.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,487
Astute said:
As I said.....allegedly. Yes it would help. People could get a direct train instead of joining the present networks. But 100 billion plus that it looks like and not the 56 billion as they tell us?
Click to expand...

I have to get a train to work each day, it’s a 5 minute journey. It’s delayed by at least 10 mins a day and it’s not even peak rush hour
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,488
Sick Boy said:
And yet again it returns to your issues with internal EU FoM.
Click to expand...
Why is it my issue?

It is an issue. Some....including yourself.....try to make out it isn't an issue. You try and tell those affected by homelessness that it isn't an issue. Yes it is down to both Labour and the Tories. But our constant population shooting up makes a massive difference. And until the government pulls its finger out it will continue to make a difference.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,489
Brighton Sky Blue said:
I didn't say that did I. I repeat-immigration is greater from outside the EU and the Tories did nothing to address it because deep down they know that we lack enough of our own workers to fill the gap. If you're blaming immigration for your woes and think leaving the EU will solve it you're looking in the wrong direction. That and we already had the power to send back EU migrants.

Arguments about not wanting more integration with Europe I disagree with, but are at least based on the objective reality of where the EU is heading. But let's be honest, it wasn't about that for most Leave voters according to any poll done on the subject.
Click to expand...
Some put it down to a lack of intelligence. Yeah OK. So intelligent people only voted remain?

My woes? I'm doing OK thanks. You ask how people are affected. I replied. It became my problem.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,490
Sick Boy said:
I have to get a train to work each day, it’s a 5 minute journey. It’s delayed by at least 10 mins a day and it’s not even peak rush hour
Click to expand...
The lines have reached their peak all over. Something needs to be done. And there isn't enough room on the roads for more cars. The railways needs billions investing all over. But so do the roads.
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,491
Astute said:
Some put it down to a lack of intelligence. Yeah OK. So intelligent people only voted remain?

My woes? I'm doing OK thanks. You ask how people are affected. I replied. It became my problem.
Click to expand...

I meant 'you' in place of 'one'. It sounds harsh but sorry, the general public is reasonably selfish and not that bright.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,492
Astute said:
Why is it my issue?

It is an issue. Some....including yourself.....try to make out it isn't an issue. You try and tell those affected by homelessness that it isn't an issue. Yes it is down to both Labour and the Tories. But our constant population shooting up makes a massive difference. And until the government pulls its finger out it will continue to make a difference.
Click to expand...

So how far back to go? Do you have issues with the Indian and Pakistani communities who were effectively invited over here? The government needs to actually invest money across the country rather than fixating on the SE and take some responsibility. Of course it suits them for others to be blamed for their inability to invest, it’s letting them off the hook.

It’s not as thought there is mass unemployment with British people out of work and foreigners stealing their jobs.

Do you also take issue with people living longer? I recently saw a statistic that 25% of the UK population will be 65+ in 2050. If that’s the case, hopefully the country will still be attractive for migrants to come here!
 
Reactions: martcov

SIR ERNIE

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,493
Grendel said:
And really thick to vote for Corbyn as leader of the new revolution and believe he was pro Europe
Click to expand...

haha yes and incredibly dense to march through London with Remainers singing ‘Oh Jeremy Corbyn’.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,494
Astute said:
The lines have reached their peak all over. Something needs to be done. And there isn't enough room on the roads for more cars. The railways needs billions investing all over. But so do the roads.
Click to expand...

To be fair they seem to have been widening the M1 for the last 10 years and installing smart motorways. Saying that I actually managed to walk into a pothole in Brighton today and actually got my leg stuck in it haha.

It’s shocking that it’s cheaper to drive than get a train, I’m off up to the Midlands this weekend and sold my car so am the mercy of the train. It’s something like 70 for a weekend return, it’s nonsense
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,495
Sick Boy said:
To be fair they seem to have been widening the M1 for the last 10 years and installing smart motorways. Saying that I actually managed to walk into a pothole in Brighton today and actually got my leg stuck in it haha.

It’s shocking that it’s cheaper to drive than get a train, I’m off up to the Midlands this weekend and sold my car so am the mercy of the train. It’s something like 70 for a weekend return, it’s nonsense
Click to expand...

I used to make that journey and only afforded it by changing a few million times and booking centuries in advance. Maybe exaggerating slightly.
 
Reactions: Sick Boy

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,496
Brighton Sky Blue said:
I used to make that journey and only afforded it by changing a few million times and booking centuries in advance. Maybe exaggerating slightly.
Click to expand...

I used to do it on the Kensington Olympia line up to Watford, if I was particularly poor it’d end up being the London Midland from Mk, which was dreadful.
 
Last edited: Dec 6, 2018
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,497
Grendel said:
I don’t know if I imagined it but I’m sure he said on one post he takes something like a model uk telephone box on these tours
Click to expand...

No, not at the moment. I did have a full size replica of the door area of Number 10 Downing Street though...( used that for the England stand in Hamburg in the World Cup Village in the Public viewing area in 2006 and other things ), and I did actually have a model telephone cell and a red post box at one time though. Used them on Britain promotions and Road Shows. So you were not that far wrong, just well out of date.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,498
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
If not, I'm sure he'll put you right .
Click to expand...

Of course I will. Fact based discussions are always better.
 

SIR ERNIE

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,499
Interesting shift in the ‘Will the UK exit by 29.03.19’ betting market.

For the first time ‘No’ is now odds on favourite over ‘yes’.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,500
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
Hard to disagree with this. Engineers, dentists, doctors, nurses, scientists, plasterers, bricklayers, electricians etc. What we don't need is strawberries from eastern England 365 days a year .
Click to expand...

Do we get them? A mine of information.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,501
Astute said:
Yet we keep needing even more because of the population going up so fast. We need schools building. We need hospitals building. We need homes building. We need more teachers. We need mire medical staff. We need HR2 to take the strain off the railway network (allegedly). And the more the population goes up the more we need. To pay for this the tax we pay needs to go up.
Click to expand...

Age plays a role as well. The baby boomers will be needing more care in the next few years.
 

Alan Dugdales Moustache

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,502
martcov said:
Of course I will. Fact based discussions are always better.
Click to expand...
Not in your case they're not. You're much better with scaremongering hysterics and telling us about your successful life.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,503
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
Not in your case they're not. You're much better with scaremongering hysterics and telling us about your successful life.
Click to expand...

Do you ever contribute to the debate or do you just make snide remarks all the time?
 
Reactions: Sick Boy and martcov

Alan Dugdales Moustache

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,504
clint van damme said:
Do you ever contribute to the debate or do you just make snide remarks all the time?
Click to expand...
Yes to both. It's not really a debate though is it ? Mainly mudslinging and blame, so piss taking is far, far better. If you're talking about your euro mate he's absolutely class.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,505
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
Yes to both. It's not really a debate though is it ? Mainly mudslinging and blame, so piss taking is far, far better. If you're talking about your euro mate he's absolutely class.
Click to expand...

I'd say by and large it is a debate. It's been going on for over 2 years and yes, at times, it's descended onto mudslinging but in general it's people expressing their point of view on one of the biggest political issues for decades

I don't think anyone is claiming to be an expert but I think we've all learnt a little bit along the way and when you look at some of the bollocks spouted by our politicians I don't think the contributors to 5his thread have? in general, done too badly.
 
Reactions: SIR ERNIE, Astute and Sick Boy

Alan Dugdales Moustache

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 6, 2018
  • #25,506
clint van damme said:
I'd say by and large it is a debate. It's been going on for over 2 years and yes, at times, it's descended onto mudslinging but in general it's people expressing their point of view on one of the biggest political issues for decades

I don't think anyone is claiming to be an expert but I think we've all learnt a little bit along the way and when you look at some of the bollocks spouted by our politicians I don't think the contributors to 5his thread have? in general, done too badly.
Click to expand...
Good post.
One particular participant thinks they are the font of all knowledge and doesn't mind being increasingly belligerant towards those who are obviously seen as inferior. He needs a bit of ribbing but he's taking it in a very good spirit.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,507
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
Not in your case they're not. You're much better with scaremongering hysterics and telling us about your successful life.
Click to expand...

I haven’t said my life is successful. You said something that wasn’t true and Grendel said something that wasn’t far off. You asked me what I was doing and I told you. As for any scaremongering tactics, don’t blame me for pointing out the arguments of experts and other facts. Just believe in Brexit and we’ll be fine.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,508
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
Yes to both. It's not really a debate though is it ? Mainly mudslinging and blame, so piss taking is far, far better. If you're talking about your euro mate he's absolutely class.
Click to expand...

We were doing alright until you barged in.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,509
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
Yes to both. It's not really a debate though is it ? Mainly mudslinging and blame, so piss taking is far, far better. If you're talking about your euro mate he's absolutely class.
Click to expand...

The snide remarks bit I get, but apart from the comment on 365 days of Eastern English strawberries, I have not noticed any meaningful contributions.
 
Last edited: Dec 7, 2018

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,510
Brighton Sky Blue said:
I meant 'you' in place of 'one'. It sounds harsh but sorry, the general public is reasonably selfish and not that bright.
Click to expand...
Half correct.

The general public is selfish. They want what they see is best for themselves. You see as staying in the EU as best for you. So it is what you want. Sod those affected by anything. It is natural. If you were not selfish you would consider others more. But when you consider others more you get it rammed down your throat that you are biased

It is dead simple. Not everyone does well out of us being in the EU. But it seems like you see them as being selfish for wanting to leave the EU.

Thick? So intelligent people voted remain and thick people voted leave? Thanks for calling me intelligent :shifty:

If you are intelligent as you say how about recognising the problems millions of people suffer and try considering why they voted leave. Then join me on having it rammed down your throat that you are biased against the EU when all you are doing is looking at both sides of the coin.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,511
Sick Boy said:
So how far back to go? Do you have issues with the Indian and Pakistani communities who were effectively invited over here? The government needs to actually invest money across the country rather than fixating on the SE and take some responsibility. Of course it suits them for others to be blamed for their inability to invest, it’s letting them off the hook.

It’s not as thought there is mass unemployment with British people out of work and foreigners stealing their jobs.

Do you also take issue with people living longer? I recently saw a statistic that 25% of the UK population will be 65+ in 2050. If that’s the case, hopefully the country will still be attractive for migrants to come here!
Click to expand...
Issues?

There is a big difference between having to apply so the numbers can be controlled and what must be at least half a billion that have the passport that gives them the right to come here without permission.

Are you saying we had the problems back then that we have now?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,512
Sick Boy said:
To be fair they seem to have been widening the M1 for the last 10 years and installing smart motorways. Saying that I actually managed to walk into a pothole in Brighton today and actually got my leg stuck in it haha.

It’s shocking that it’s cheaper to drive than get a train, I’m off up to the Midlands this weekend and sold my car so am the mercy of the train. It’s something like 70 for a weekend return, it’s nonsense
Click to expand...
Same as everything. Supply and demand.

The wife went to Manchester with a mate last weekend. 2 hours in car or £150 each on the train. They were having a drink so got the coach for £15.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,513
martcov said:
Age plays a role as well. The baby boomers will be needing more care in the next few years.
Click to expand...
And all these millions of people coming here will need care in the future. Where does it stop?
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,514
Astute said:
Issues?

There is a big difference between having to apply so the numbers can be controlled and what must be at least half a billion that have the passport that gives them the right to come here without permission.

Are you saying we had the problems back then that we have now?
Click to expand...

FOM gives them permission. You claim that millions are suffering because of the EU. That is very debatable. The main reason being the collapse in 2008 and the resulting austerity program, together with neglect of most places north of Watford Gap. You turn it into EU membership and blame all problems on FOM. Thus letting the Tories off the hook. Yet you claim to be a remainer and a labour supporter.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Dec 7, 2018
  • #25,515
Astute said:
Issues?

There is a big difference between having to apply so the numbers can be controlled and what must be at least half a billion that have the passport that gives them the right to come here without permission.

Are you saying we had the
back then that we have now?
Click to expand...

Half a billion includes us and who says how many will make use of that right? The trend is downwards anyway as other countries get richer and the pound continues to fall
 
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