The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (15 Viewers)

[Grendel]

It’s hardly an assumption to recognise that a £120B stimulus package is only going to have a positive effect on the economy, yet it’s still stalling. According to you they never happened in the first place until I repeatedly corrected you. You're at least admitting that you were wrong on that score. You’re now trying to play down the effect of the things you never understood were happening so we’re not even progressing. Do you know what the Term Funding Scheme actually promoted?

How is the economy actually stalling in your view?

 

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[skybluetony176]

How is the economy actually stalling in your view?

You haven’t answered my question yet. You go first before I have to state the obvious to you again.

 

[Grendel]

You haven’t answered my question yet. You go first before I have to state the obvious to you again.

With respect Tony I think you’ve exceeded your level of understanding on this - I maintain my stance - the stimulus package was a reaction to a negative view on how the economy will fare and is also politically motivated - the economy by any metric has not stalked

 

[martcov]

With respect Tony I think you’ve exceeded your level of understanding on this - I maintain my stance - the stimulus package was a reaction to a negative view on how the economy will fare and is also politically motivated - the economy by any metric has not stalked

That is the idea. If the economy looks like faring badly you do something. I don’t see how that is political. 0,2% GDP is not roaring.

 

[Grendel]

That is the idea. If the economy looks like faring badly you do something. I don’t see how that is political. 0,2% GDP is not roaring.

Can Italy do this?

 

[skybluetony176]

With respect Tony I think you’ve exceeded your level of understanding on this - I maintain my stance - the stimulus package was a reaction to a negative view on how the economy will fare and is also politically motivated - the economy by any metric has not stalked

My level of understanding? I at least understood that there was stimulus packages in the first place. Whatever my level of understanding is it’s clearly way above yours considering you’re blissfully unaware of what has and hasn’t happened.

 

[Grendel]

My level of understanding? I at least understood that there was stimulus packages in the first place. Whatever my level of understanding is it’s clearly way above yours considering you’re blissfully unaware of what has and hasn’t happened.

Nope - you’ve assumed the package was a requirement and the £40 billion is a real figure when it’s made up shite

Oh and I’m really looking forward to matts reply to my last question or perhaps you can help him out

 

[skybluetony176]

Can Italy do this?

Distraction again. Just admit you haven’t a clue. You’re right in Roman Empire/Holy Roman Empire territory again.

 

[Grendel]

Distraction again. Just admit you haven’t a clue. You’re right in Roman Empire/Holy Roman Empire territory again.

Nope I’m clearly not. Can Italy do this Tony? If not explain why

 

[skybluetony176]

Nope - you’ve assumed the package was a requirement and the £40 billion is a real figure when it’s made up shite

Oh and I’m really looking forward to matts reply to my last question or perhaps you can help him out

It was clearly a requirement when you look at GDP. How can someone think they’re as clever as you do when you’re not even aware of the basics? You wasn’t even aware that there were stimulus packages to the point that you confidently declared that Carney never tapped into his £250B war chest when in fact half went on one single package.

Too busy helping you out with the basics of what’s actually happened to help anyone else out. I suspect Mart is just going to do another Holy Roman Empire on you again so doesn’t need my help anyway.

 

[skybluetony176]

Nope I’m clearly not. Can Italy do this Tony? If not explain why

Yes you are. Why don’t you tell us what the Term Funding Scheme was and why exactly it was started? What was the aim of the Scheme? What was it designed to offset? What industry did it promote?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

With respect Tony I think you’ve exceeded your level of understanding on this - I maintain my stance - the stimulus package was a reaction to a negative view on how the economy will fare and is also politically motivated - the economy by any metric has not stalked

Because we haven’t left yet and the terms of departure are still unknown. If Brexit is cancelled the pound will soar

 

[martcov]

Nope I’m clearly not. Can Italy do this Tony? If not explain why

Populist useless government?

 

[Grendel]

Populist useless government?

Can you please answer the question

 

[martcov]

Can you please answer the question

I have. The GDP got worse after they took over.

 

[Grendel]

I have. The GDP got worse after they took over.

So were they allowed as a sovereign nation to take action? We all know the answer - why not admit it needed certain “others” to decide what’s best for them

 

[Grendel]

Yes you are. Why don’t you tell us what the Term Funding Scheme was and why exactly it was started? What was the aim of the Scheme? What was it designed to offset? What industry did it promote?

May well do Tony - lets do a deal - I’ll answer it if you answer why you avoided the thread concerning ccc despite numerous requests for you to participate

 

[skybluetony176]

May well do Tony - lets do a deal - I’ll answer it if you answer why you avoided the thread concerning ccc despite numerous requests for you to participate

Because it annoyed you and others who were creaming yourselves over it. I’ve already told you that. Over to you.

 

[Grendel]

Because it annoyed you and others who were creaming yourselves over it. I’ve already told you that. Over to you.

No Tony you refused to answer - we have all noticed it - did it compromise you?

 

[martcov]

So were they allowed as a sovereign nation to take action? We all know the answer - why not admit it needed certain “others” to decide what’s best for them

As a sovereign nation they have lived above their means for years. They had agreed to try and stop increasing sovereign debt. Then came the populists and changed the plan. Eventually settling for a relatively minor adjustment. The whole farce didn’t help Italy and increased interest rates.

 

[Grendel]

As a sovereign nation they have lived above their means for years. They had agreed to try and stop increasing sovereign debt. Then came the populists and changed the plan. Eventually settling for a relatively minor adjustment. The whole farce didn’t help Italy and increased interest rates.

So are they allowed to act without the say so of merkel and co?

Can we move on to Greece once you throw in the towel on this one?

 

[skybluetony176]

No Tony you refused to answer - we have all noticed it - did it compromise you?

Still annoying you by the sounds of it. Still amusing me that it annoys you also.

Are you going to answer the question or continue the distraction?

 

[skybluetony176]

As a sovereign nation they have lived above their means for years. They had agreed to try and stop increasing sovereign debt. Then came the populists and changed the plan. Eventually settling for a relatively minor adjustment. The whole farce didn’t help Italy and increased interest rates.

Italy’s GDP has plummeted since they got in so much Grendull can use it as an argument that our own economy hasn’t stalled. In comparison.

 

[martcov]

So are they allowed to act without the say so of merkel and co?

Can we move on to Greece once you throw in the towel on this one?

What has Merkel got to do with it?

 

[Grendel]

What has Merkel got to do with it?

Oh has she not commented on it and said what needed to be done?

 

[martcov]

Oh has she not commented on it and said what needed to be done?

She doesn’t decide what Italy have to do. Italy is a member of a monetary union. They answer to them and not to Merkel.

 

[Grendel]

She doesn’t decide what Italy have to do. Italy is a member of a monetary union. They answer to them and not to Merkel.

So she has not directed a view then? Why are you swivelling and spinning? Has she ever been involved in discussions with other Eu countries on debt or budgets?

 

[martcov]

Oh has she not commented on it and said what needed to be done?

Yes, she has said she will help, but that Italy has to remember it’s responsibility to the Eurozone ( of which it is a member of ).

Note, „it’s responsibility to the Eurozone.“

The Italian government are screwing their economy on their own.

 

[Grendel]

Yes, she has said she will help, but that Italy has to remember it’s responsibility to the Eurozone ( of which it is a member of ).

Note, „it’s responsibility to the Eurozone.“

The Italian government are screwing their economy on their own.

So they have complete autonomy?

 

[martcov]

So they have complete autonomy?

Of course not. They are in a monetary union and have to keep within the rules. They bent the rules and made concessions to their voters. Made it in effect more expensive to employ people and reduced the incentive to work. Interest rates have risen and the hoped for stimulus hasn’t happened. We’ll see how long the government sticks together.

 

[Astute]

Again ignoring the tangible fact that there has been a £120B stimulus package directly from the referendum result. The tangible things that have happened since the referendum concludes that they’re right. Our economy has faltered despite this and other stimulus packages. It would have been much worse if they hadn’t. This isn’t one of your factless assumptions, this is what has actually happened. Your assumption that Carney hasn’t dipped into his £250B war chest is just pure ignorance. As I’ve repeatedly pointed out to you £120B on one of several packages alone . You’re not even aware of what has happened, how does that qualify you to judge the BOE’s forecasting ability?

Factless assumptions?

You are using words instead of facts. We now have record employment. How many countries in the EU can say this? Countries throughout the EU are struggling. Even Germany only just missed being in recession by 0.1%. If we were fully dependent on the EU we would also be in the shite.

You like to mention exchange rates because the £ has devalued. But what you refuse to admit or you don't understand is this is good news for many. This is why most countries in the Euro are struggling and will continue to struggle. They are tied to the strength of Germany. They desperately need to devalue.

In fact I have tried to educate you on the matter countless times before. So not going further on the subject yet again. You must understand by now. We don't want a strong £. It is good for going on holiday but it makes our goods very expensive.

You make out that it is bad that the £ has fallen. But that is the market value of it all going wrong. We are priced at that now. That is why we get a sudden movement whenever we get what some call good news. But our goods are much cheaper so we can sell more.

 

[Astute]

The economy has stabilised as the result of his actions. To claim that everything would have been Hunky Dory is pushing it.

Stabilised?

The only thing that has stabilised is the comments from those who predicted we would crash and burn. The economy didn't go wrong. It has stayed strong unlike those from many countries in the EU.

Look at the predictions from those running the EU last year. Germany to continue to be strong. The UK the weakest of all the EU countries. You proudly showed us their predictions. But you didn't proudly show us the truth just a few months later. Why was that?

 

[Astute]

It was clearly a requirement when you look at GDP. How can someone think they’re as clever as you do when you’re not even aware of the basics? You wasn’t even aware that there were stimulus packages to the point that you confidently declared that Carney never tapped into his £250B war chest when in fact half went on one single package.

Too busy helping you out with the basics of what’s actually happened to help anyone else out. I suspect Mart is just going to do another Holy Roman Empire on you again so doesn’t need my help anyway.

So you don't have a clue then. Yet you still try to argue the point.

Any stimulus is a waste of time with dodgy foundations. This is why it won't work for Italy or many other countries in the Euro. Just look at the amount of money being pumped into their economies. That is why we were lucky not to have been pushed into the Euro. Even those who campaigned for us to join the Euro eventually admitted it was a very good move to stay out of it. Otherwise we would be struggling badly without the ability to have a floating currency to how we are doing. This is how the world markets work. Even Mart won't try to deny this. But you will. This shows your lack of understanding on the matter.

This is why I say it could go badly for a few years if we crash out of the EU without a trade deal. But our currency would then go to a level where we would be able to do well again. Holidays would be expensive. But our goods would become very cheap. So there wouldn't be much of a drop. This is why it is false news to say a bad hit would last generations. If it comes from those who are knowledgeable on the subject they are coming out with lies. This is why Carney had to change his tune.

 

[Astute]

Because we haven’t left yet and the terms of departure are still unknown. If Brexit is cancelled the pound will soar

But if the £ soars it will be bad for our exports. We don't want that to happen. But the EU does.....

But at least our holidays would become cheaper...

 

[Astute]

Yes, she has said she will help, but that Italy has to remember it’s responsibility to the Eurozone ( of which it is a member of ).

Note, „it’s responsibility to the Eurozone.“

The Italian government are screwing their economy on their own.

Being financially tied to how Germany is doing screws them more than anything. And you k ow this. But it helps Germany more than anything else so you are happy with this.