Sisu-ccfc-acl-wasps

Steve.B50

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2012
3,623
694
113
Can I ask a question and get the thoughts of others?
At the last SCG meeting I asked SW why they don't approach WASPS and ask to buy into ACL and own a little part of the stadium, say 10%. My question was just waved away.

However, why is this such a silly idea?
If our owners publically said they would like to buy into the Ricoh, firstly it would show long term financial commitment to the Club, secondly they would get 10% of any profits/ f&b (or 10% of any loss). Thirdly it would mean they would be talking in a positive manor to our landlords, (which I hope they are already doing so).
It would make sure we have a long term home and hopefully the opportunity in future years to buy more shares in the ground. Am sure it would cost a lot less to buy into a stadium than to build a new one.
Of course Wasps might say "no chance" but at least then we know the only other option is a new ground, but that means they have to do more than just talk the talk.

If they do eventually build a new ground we all have an idea of what costs are involved, who will own this venue and how our fan base will be effected even further. They would have to compete with the Ricoh for any events, pay and run the place and of course there is the time it will take to get this even to planning stage.

At these exciting times let's all stay positive and keep this thread on subject and not throw useless negatives comments into the debate.

Thoughts?
 

bradwellskyblues

Well-Known Member
Feb 27, 2008
578
228
43
sisu in the guise of tim fisher continually moan about the lack of revenue streams which is a valid argument strange that this summer they have given up on the club shop now run by an outside north eastern based company and also the matchday programme has been out sourced as well.
 

Terry Gibson's perm

Well-Known Member
Mar 17, 2014
12,668
4,833
163
Nuneaton
Can I ask a question and get the thoughts of others?
At the last SCG meeting I asked SW why they don't approach WASPS and ask to buy into ACL and own a little part of the stadium, say 10%. My question was just waved away.

However, why is this such a silly idea?
If our owners publically said they would like to buy into the Ricoh, firstly it would show long term financial commitment to the Club, secondly they would get 10% of any profits/ f&b (or 10% of any loss). Thirdly it would mean they would be talking in a positive manor to our landlords, (which I hope they are already doing so).
It would make sure we have a long term home and hopefully the opportunity in future years to buy more shares in the ground. Am sure it would cost a lot less to buy into a stadium than to build a new one.
Of course Wasps might say "no chance" but at least then we know the only other option is a new ground, but that means they have to do more than just talk the talk.

If they do eventually build a new ground we all have an idea of what costs are involved, who will own this venue and how our fan base will be effected even further. They would have to compete with the Ricoh for any events, pay and run the place and of course there is the time it will take to get this even to planning stage.

At these exciting times let's all stay positive and keep this thread on subject and not throw useless negatives comments into the debate.

Thoughts?

How would it work with bond?
Our beloved owners would also have to raise the money to do it and I can't imagine their investors have much appetite for something that has this bond against it.
We must now be so far down the line with our new ground that we don't need to invest in the current one:claping hands:
 

tim07

Well-Known Member
Feb 4, 2013
258
88
28
Ha, thought you were serious there for a second or two.....then I read the words 'new stadium'. (rofl) :facepalm:
 

Steve.B50

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2012
3,623
694
113
How would it work with bond?
Our beloved owners would also have to raise the money to do it and I can't imagine their investors have much appetite for something that has this bond against it.
We must now be so far down the line with our new ground that we don't need to invest in the current one:claping hands:

Good point, but by just publically making the offer it would show commitment and possibly force someone's hand.
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
15,677
7,431
263
Verona, Italy
Wasps have already said that ACL isn't for sale. Are you sure it's a good idea to get involved with a company with business morals like them as well? People complain about Sisu, we don't need to make it worse by getting involved with another similar company.
 

mrtrench

Well-Known Member
Aug 17, 2008
3,914
2,361
163
Somewhere between the waitress and her table.
You are missing the point. When Sisu said they wanted to own the Ricoh they didn't say 'and we want to pay a fair market price for it' did they?

If the latest litigation fails they'll have to be happy to run the club at zero cost to them and hope something happens.
 

Steve.B50

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2012
3,623
694
113
sisu in the guise of tim fisher continually moan about the lack of revenue streams which is a valid argument strange that this summer they have given up on the club shop now run by an outside north eastern based company and also the matchday programme has been out sourced as well.
Very true they are doing everything away from the actual football on a shoestring. So why not ask us as supporters to help, am sure we have many fans who would do jobs for free if it helped the team?
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2013
25,340
10,365
263
:
How would it work with bond?
Our beloved owners would also have to raise the money to do it and I can't imagine their investors have much appetite for something that has this bond against it.
We must now be so far down the line with our new ground that we don't need to invest in the current one:claping hands:
I would say that when the bond is due to be paid out on is the only time we'll get a chance of buying into ACL assuming that Wasps/ACL can't pay up what they owe. Of course we'll have our own ground long before that happens so... :laugh:

...sorry, I couldn't even finish saying that.
 

Steve.B50

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2012
3,623
694
113
Wasps have already said that ACL isn't for sale. Are you sure it's a good idea to get involved with a company with business morals like them as well? People complain about Sisu, we don't need to make it worse by getting involved with another similar company.
Thats why I said a small part of it.
As for a good idea, I am not sure, just asking the question as wanted some idea where we might be in a few years time.
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
Jul 9, 2011
25,231
4,763
113
Wasps wouldn't have bought CAL unless It was the whole 100%so passing some off seems unlikely but you never know I suppose.
I think If we're being serious there needs to be a ten year agreement reached while we find our way to a solution.
 

Steve.B50

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2012
3,623
694
113
Wasps wouldn't have bought CAL unless It was the whole 100%so passing some off seems unlikely but you never know I suppose.
I think If we're being serious there needs to be a ten year agreement reached while we find our way to a solution.
Very true, we need something to happen.

what do they have to loose by asking the question?
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2013
25,340
10,365
263
Wasps wouldn't have bought CAL unless It was the whole 100%so passing some off seems unlikely but you never know I suppose.
I think If we're being serious there needs to be a ten year agreement reached while we find our way to a solution.
We definitely need more security at the Ricoh. The current deal as far as we know offers non past the end off the season and maybe another two years after that.

I know some will shoot me down but now is the time to start negotiating. If only to extend the 2 year option on the current deal.

At the end of the day, even if SISU are serious about a new ground the current deal isn't long enough.
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
15,677
7,431
263
Verona, Italy
I'm not sure why there is this belief that Wasps are happy to accommodate us at every turn and are willing to help us.

They have had to appear that way in order to win the PR war. Quite why some on this forum continue to praise a board who moved there club 100 miles is beyond me. I work with an ex-Wasps supporter and the absurd claims made on here that their fans backed the move is a joke.

The prospect of playing away from the Ricoh after this season is very real. I'd like us to have nothing to do with Wasps while they are in the city. Rather than trying to form some kind of partnership, we should be looking to distance ourselves from them as much as possible
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
Mar 20, 2011
24,923
4,413
163
I don't understand why the bond Easps used for funding has any relevance to anything. It's not an asset backed security is it?
The Ricoh (250 year leasehold that is) has been used as Security on the bonds.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors :)
 
Last edited:

stupot07

Well-Known Member
Mar 20, 2011
24,923
4,413
163
Or the 250year lease?0:)
That's what I mean the leasehold not the freehold which belongs to the council. Wasps have said they don't want to share ownership so the door is closed. the costs and risks would out way the benefits of owning 10%.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors :)
 
Last edited:

wingy

Well-Known Member
Jul 9, 2011
25,231
4,763
113
I'm not sure why there is this belief that Wasps are happy to accommodate us at every turn and are willing to help us.

They have had to appear that way in order to win the PR war. Quite why some on this forum continue to praise a board who moved there club 100 miles is beyond me. I work with an ex-Wasps supporter and the absurd claims made on here that their fans backed the move is a joke.

The prospect of playing away from the Ricoh after this season is very real. I'd like us to have nothing to do with Wasps while they are in the city. Rather than trying to form some kind of partnership, we should be looking to distance ourselves from them as much as possible
Secure our future? Where and when there Is a potential lengthy Interim.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
Oct 16, 2010
17,281
1,338
163
Firstly I don't think Wasps would go for it

That aside I agree with the sentiment but only 10% is a waste of time, we'd need 50% to make it a feasible partnership. I'm pretty sure Wasps would have no intention of letting us buy into ACL but at the very least it may get a few supporters on side with a new stadium when it is rejected.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2013
25,340
10,365
263
Firstly I don't think Wasps would go for it

That aside I agree with the sentiment but only 10% is a waste of time, we'd need 50% to make it a feasible partnership. I'm pretty sure Wasps would have no intention of letting us buy into ACL but at the very least it may get a few supporters on side with a new stadium when it is rejected.
I can't see Wasps rejecting an approach for 10% is going to get anyone on board with a new ground. A business plan, stadium plan and progress on land purchase somewhere the majority if not all the fan base find acceptable on the other hand might do just that. You've got to be able to find the idea believable first before getting on board.
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2012
5,903
3,453
163
You are missing the point. When Sisu said they wanted to own the Ricoh they didn't say 'and we want to pay a fair market price for it' did they?
If you think that Wasps paid a fair market price then you are deluded.
 

Nick

Administrator
Feb 25, 2008
111,458
34,751
1,063
Coventry
Didn't wasps say they weren't looking to sell or invest in the football club?

They were always here for 100% and nothing less.

Think they would charge us 10% of what they paid or 10% of what they said in the bonds?
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
15,677
7,431
263
Verona, Italy
Didn't wasps say they weren't looking to sell or invest in the football club?

They were always here for 100% and nothing less.

Think they would charge us 10% of what they paid or 10% of what they said in the bonds?
They are a baston of honesty and fairness. How dare you doubt them. We are lucky to have them here looking out for us.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
Oct 16, 2010
17,281
1,338
163
I can't see Wasps rejecting an approach for 10% is going to get anyone on board with a new ground. A business plan, stadium plan and progress on land purchase somewhere the majority if not all the fan base find acceptable on the other hand might do just that. You've got to be able to find the idea believable first before getting on board.
I'm on about the concept and idea of a new stadium rather than SISU's failure to deliver a real plan for a new stadium, when Wasps reject this hypothetical offer a few fans may finally be swayed that are long term future lies away from the Ricoh under any ownership. We'd then need owners who can actually deliver a new stadium.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2013
25,340
10,365
263
I'm on about the concept and idea of a new stadium rather than SISU's failure to deliver a real plan for a new stadium, when Wasps reject this hypothetical offer a few fans may finally be swayed that are long term future lies away from the Ricoh under any ownership. We'd then need owners who can actually deliver a new stadium.
I think it's obvious that our long term future lies away from the Ricoh, unless somehow we can buy in. But apparently these new owners are currently as mythical as the new stadium SISU have promised everyone. So in the mean time the best thing for the club is a medium term solution at the Ricoh. A 10 year deal seems logical. It gives SISU enough time to exhaust there courtroom antics and sell up when they're finished.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
Oct 16, 2010
17,281
1,338
163
I think it's obvious that our long term future lies away from the Ricoh, unless somehow we can buy in. But apparently these new owners are currently as mythical as the new stadium SISU have promised everyone. So in the mean time the best thing for the club is a medium term solution at the Ricoh. A 10 year deal seems logical. It gives SISU enough time to exhaust there courtroom antics and sell up when they're finished.
Therein lies the problem

We have no hope under SISU

We have no hope at the Ricoh of getting back to the premier league

And neither look like changing anytime soon.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2013
25,340
10,365
263
Therein lies the problem

We have no hope under SISU

We have no hope at the Ricoh of getting back to the premier league

And neither look like changing anytime soon.
At least until SISU have exhausted their courtroom pursuit's. I don't think we'll know what their long term plan's will be until that happens.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2011
30,776
7,515
263
Cumbria
What was the fair market price?
The fair market price was 0, but they were happy to make a donation as it was a charity. That is what SISU said. Some on here agreed. But once Wasps paid much more than 0 the same people said they got it very cheaply :thinking about:

The value must now be minimum 35m as that is how much they managed to raise via bonds. So SISU would need to pay minimum 3.5m for a 10% stake. They didn't even want to pay that much for a 50% stake.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2011
30,776
7,515
263
Cumbria
What was the last we heard on the new stadium?
We were given the normal load of bullshit. Can't remember what was said. But can't remember the last time we got any truth.