Nick
Administrator
So people aren't going to go next season because of views held by many but we should build a massive stadium just in case we get a cup draw against Liverpool?
The Ricoh very much was an issue with empty seats and atmosphere.
It would make them think , unfortunately due to the views held by many that ain't going to happen is it.
However if we somehow mounted a promotion push it would happen & the missing thousands would overcome their personal views- which takes us back to the original point, that the Ricoh was never the issue begind empty seats and atmosphere, the dross on the green bit in the middle was the issue.
So people aren't going to go next season because of views held by many but we should build a massive stadium just in case we get a cup draw against Liverpool?
The Ricoh very much was an issue with empty seats and atmosphere.
Who is saying we should build a 'massive stadium'?
Building a stadium to cater for people who refuse to go "because of their views" on the basis we might get a big cup game is silly.
As I said, the way to show it wouldn't be big enough is for everybody to go to games to show them it just isn't viable. If we get 10-15K home fans next season then it just shows that it is about right.
10-15k at St Andrews?
We won the league and only lost at home once last season and averaged 6,667. What would that have been playing in Cov in our own ground? You can without doubt double it, and we'd probably have ended with 15k or so average. Makes no sense to factor that in & limit crowds in a division above to that much. I agree with the principle of starting sensible, but what we are aiming at is too low.
I think 25k is sensible if we stay in championship if we went up bigger I’d down then 20k could be too big.
Need some more progress before worrying about a few thousand seats here and there
Did you get to many games last season?
The reason I am asking is that people who have sat at an empty Ricoh week in, week out will probably see things a lot differently. It isn't a dig.
The return from Sixfields was another indicator. "When city come back I will get my season ticket", "CCFC moving has ruined my life". Everybody vanishes after the first game back.
I got to 11 home games and 3 away, and I don't take it as a dig anyway, I'm not exactly around the corner & I've 'paid my dues' during the good times & bad. I am able to do them all next year aside from some midweek (covid allowing), so very happy about that.
The reason people do that- give it the big talk then not bother coming back is simple- we let them down. We never maintained any kind of success for several decades, of course people aren't going to keep coming back. Its different now- might not be in 5 years of course- but where we are now, for a club our size, having about 15,000 tickets max available is too small. I don't want 40,000 or even 30,000, but taking all factors into account & assuming we keep up the progress we see now & goodwill between fans & club, 20,000 home tickets would have been sensible, giving a capacity somewhere in the region of 24,000.
Everybody had better get their season tickets ordered then and a sell out every game, better atmosphere.
Then if we got promoted to the Premier League then it could be looked at adding a few more thousand seats.
The way to show it isn't enough is to sell out every game next season when we can go back, that would make them think then.
Yeah and then in the year we spend building an upgrade we get relegated and you lot moan about a soulless bowl again.
RoS is right. The Ricoh was a ground for a Prem team that never came. The problem was relegation and a decade of failure, not the stadium design.
For the record I’d have an 18k capacity at this new ground, because I think if we could support much bigger we should be at the Ricoh and 18k provides a nice space for smaller stuff aside from football.
But the idea that HR was ever anything but a morgue most days, or that the Ricoh itself is to blame for the poor atmosphere is nonsense.
So let's build another one for a Prem team on the hope we get there again?
"We Let them down". Really? Let's build them a seat in case we win a few games or get Liverpool at home for them to want to come back?
I don't see the issue with starting off at 20,000 and then adding to it when it gets to the point where every game is sold out by season tickets only consistently. It needs to be sustainable, rather than if we are doing a bit shit on the pitch it's half empty because we have fickle fans.
A quick Google tells me that MK Dons managed to do it on a £30m budget. Also their stadium is built for potential future expansion which is something we should do, just in case the Robbins juggernaut continues to the promised land.
Of course fans make the atmosphere, but stadiums can be designed to keep the noise in. The Ricoh was never designed to hold a good atmosphere, and having 2/3 of the seats empty every week obviously doesn’t help. The truth is we’re very rarely gonna have anywhere near a full house at the Ricoh, it’s much too big for us. A more compact ground with potential for expansion would be perfect.
Agree with your final point, would hate for it to be like Shrewsbury’s.
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So let's build another one for a Prem team on the hope we get there again?
For the record I’d have an 18k capacity at this new ground, because I think if we could support much bigger we should be at the Ricoh and 18k provides a nice space for smaller stuff aside from football.
But the idea that HR was ever anything but a morgue most days, or that the Ricoh itself is to blame for the poor atmosphere is nonsense.
I don’t think we will get back to the Prem any time soon. But if we did, and we did what to you suggest, if we were to get relegated (more than likely) we’d be in exactly the same situation you’re complaining about. The issue is one of relegation not stadiumdesign is my point.
It’s also a building of trust and respect to see change and optimism and turning up not just When we win but because we have an identity, we feel valued as supporters, the team engage and we have a common vision"We Let them down". Really? Let's build them a seat in case we win a few games or get Liverpool at home for them to want to come back?
I don't see the issue with starting off at 20,000 and then adding to it when it gets to the point where every game is sold out by season tickets only consistently. It needs to be sustainable, rather than if we are doing a bit shit on the pitch it's half empty because we have fickle fans.
It’s also a building of trust and respect to see change and optimism and turning up not just When we win but because we have an identity, we feel valued as supporters, the team engage and we have a common vision
Personally I think the Ricoh is a soulless bowl with far too many seats that are too far away from the pitch. It’s never felt like home for me. I’d love to make a fresh start at a new stadium designed to create a great atmosphere, and without all the baggage and bad memories of the Ricoh.
If this goes ahead, I hope they learn from the mistakes at the Ricoh. I’d love it to be 2-tiers all the way round so we can just use the bottom tier if attendances fall (see MK Dons). Having all the fans on one side at the Ricoh makes for a poor atmosphere.
Love the idea of having one stand with the 2-tone cheques.
Appreciate there’s a long way to go for this to become a reality, but bloody hell I’m excited by the prospect of it!
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You could make up for HR because at least it felt like "home" a bit more.
Plus you would sometimes get approached by prozzies after the game.
Yes, we let them down. Season after Northampton when all these people were going to come back- 17th in League One, procession of manager changes, Russell Slade and umpteen anonymous loanees, zero to get behind shortly followed up by relegation to the bottom division. Then Robins came back, we improved without ever really challenging and 4,000 immediately reappeared.
But you'd had time to make HR feel like home.
If you got taken as a kid even if it was a small crowd and not a great game it felt exciting and busy. You can't recreate that sense of wonder as an adult at a new ground. I bet the first time you had sex wasn't the greatest but you look back on it fondly because it was a first experience. If you had that same thing now you'd find it totally underwhelming.
For a comparable experience you'd need to ask those 20-somethings whose first game was at the Ricoh. They've probably got fond memories of that first game and it would feel like 'home' to them.
I'm sure when we moved to HR there were people at the time complaining it didn't feel the same or like 'home'.
A lot of sense coming from both sides of the debate on here. The desire to escape the Ricoh is well-intentioned, and the chances of us returning there on favourable terms seems pretty remote atm. With the team doing well, there's more good will for the owners' intentions than there has been in a decade. The case for a fresh start is (temporarily, at least) more compelling than it ever was, including at Highfield Road.
I'm just not convinced that trying another flatpack stadium with a hypothetical rail station, only this time in a different part of the city's outskirts, is going to obviously be better than what we could/should have with the Ricoh. Let alone a good way to spend 30 million quid. Surely as a fanbase we would know better than most that you can't just stadium-build your way into stability? What happens if we move to Warwick Uni only to plummet into L2 again? Build a fourth stadium in Binley?
How about we build a stadium for each potential division. I’d argue non league and below is taken care of. Ricoh for the Prem. Butts for L2, Warwick Uni for Championship. Just need a 12k ground for L1 and we’re sorted.
Stoke are an interesting example. Stadium was renowned for being shite, windswept, desolate when they were down among the dead men. Then it suddenly had a cracking atmosphere!Yes, but we could also ask how, as an example, Stoke went from 16k to selling out 28k every match in one season, while seemingly transforming their ground from a hated soulless bowl to a loud cauldron which teams hated going to. Success is the answer. We are on the right trajectory, so while I don't think anyone is saying we need 30k immediately, building the 48th biggest ground in the country and 4th smallest in the division (for a team that can produce 40,000 fans instantly when success comes calling) is pretty strange.
How about we build a stadium for each potential division. I’d argue non league and below is taken care of. Ricoh for the Prem. Butts for L2, Warwick Uni for Championship. Just need a 12k ground for L1 and we’re sorted.
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