New Coventry City FC stadium plan seems 'crazy', says football finance expert (2 Viewers)

[olderskyblue]

ha what like the times we were playing at Sixfields months ago and I said Pressley didn't really have a clue when he needed to make changes, or the time I pointed out Thorn was dog shit? It was taken as nonsense then too.

Nick, if you drew a picture of a clock on a piece of paper, the time would be right twice a day....

 

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[Nick]

I think I know what you are tying to say. But there will always be room for interpretation in anything we write and when we publish it.

I would hope you have read enough of my stuff by now to realise I do try and present the information objectively and aim to provide as full a picture as possible by providing as much information as I can.

I'm not saying I, or the paper, is perfect and doesn't make mistakes or errors of judgment. We do.

You had missed my bit on the end which I put on to make it clear, it wasn't personal to you but more likely to newspapers full stop.

The team are on a good run, the sun is trying to shine. Sometimes the local media could give it the "get down the ricoh with your old shirt tomorrow, get behind the local footy team" rather than the "SISU are calling you all wankers and have had it away with your nan outside the gala, boo at them" the day before.

I'm not saying put a massive advert on the front page, but maybe give the city a bit of a feel good about the football team (not the owners) rather than waiting until the day before a game that could see us win 3 on the bounce to drop a nothing story type bombshell.

 

[skybluesam66]

simon - i am an expert
my contribution - which i expect to see as tomorrow;s headline

Coventry will win the champions league in the next 5 years, playing on a pitch made of fine gold leaf , thanks to the generosity of tim fisher's personal donations

 

[Godiva]

How could I possibly have known what the answer was going to be before I asked the question?

Do you honestly think we wouldn't have run the story if he was in favour of the idea? Of course we would!

Oh, I'm sure you would, but that's not my point. You ask an 'expert' on a subject specific to us and get a general reply. If I am diagnosed with cancer I am not interested in a general lecture in oncology, I want an expert to analyse the illness and decide the best treatment for me.

The questions you left out, when you partly quoted my post, would 'help' the reader to understand, if he was giving a general 'lecture', or if he had actually analysed the clubs specific situation to be able to dismiss the 'treatment' the club owners and management says is the best.

 

[Nick]

Nick, if you drew a picture of a clock on a piece of paper, the time would be right twice a day....

Very true, which is why when I draw a picture of a clock I put it away and only show it off twice a day

 

[torchomatic]

You would hope people aren't that dim not to attend because of non-stories like these, but unfortunately some are that dim.

You had missed my bit on the end which I put on to make it clear, it wasn't personal to you but more likely to newspapers full stop.

The team are on a good run, the sun is trying to shine. Sometimes the local media could give it the "get down the ricoh with your old shirt tomorrow, get behind the local footy team" rather than the "SISU are calling you all wankers and have had it away with your nan outside the gala, boo at them" the day before.

I'm not saying put a massive advert on the front page, but maybe give the city a bit of a feel good about the football team (not the owners) rather than waiting until the day before a game that could see us win 3 on the bounce to drop a nothing story type bombshell.

 

[Nick]

You would hope people aren't that dim not to attend because of non-stories like these, but unfortunately some are that dim.

People are though, that is the issue.

It is like West Ham fans not going because Karen Brady was wearing a horrible dress on the apprentice. People will decide whether they are going to the game based on what shit Tim Fisher has spoken, rather than wanting to watch their team. People don't jump up and down when we score because of SISU or Tim Fisher, do they?

 

[lewys33]

As much as I think this is a non-story, I can't wait for the Les Reid exclusive on the call for an independent inquiry that will no doubt be published today after this.

 

[SimonGilbert]

simon - i am an expert
my contribution - which i expect to see as tomorrow;s headline

Coventry will win the champions league in the next 5 years, playing on a pitch made of fine gold leaf , thanks to the generosity of tim fisher's personal donations

I want to see some credentials sir!

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Looks like the joint CCC/Wasps PR machine is working overtime.

 

[skybluesam66]

I want to see some credentials sir!

i didnt say what i am an expert in - but i am as much an expert as the person whose story you have printed

 

[Nick]

As much as I think this is a non-story, I can't wait for the Les Reid exclusive on the call for an independent inquiry that will no doubt be published today after this.

Why not have a mass Observer / CET brawl on a field for charity? I'd want to watch / read about it and would also make a bit of cash.

There would be clipboards and cardigans everywhere.

 

[SimonGilbert]

i didnt say what i am an expert in - but i am as much an expert as the person whose story you have printed

Without seeing credentials, I can't accept that. Sorry.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Answer nicks point simon. Why why why why why?

 

[Monners]

Answer nicks point simon. Why why why why why?

Delilah?

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Dressing some random person up and calling him an expert so he can give you the answer which suits your agenda isn't newsworthy.

 

[Skyblueweeman]

Digressing slightly, does anyone else think the CTs website is absolute toilet? No other website I visit (yes, including the naughty ones) freezes as much when you load a page or goes completely blank when you've clicked through to an article, only to have to click back on your browser to see the article you wanted to in the first place.

Oi...Gilbert! Speak to your techie people...you're website is totally un-user friendly.

WM

 

[SimonGilbert]

Dressing some random person up and calling him an expert so he can give you the answer which suits your agenda isn't newsworthy.

Good job we didn't do that then.

 

[torchomatic]

Not just you, SBW. I don't think I've ever seen such an ad intense site either.

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Why is it crazy anyway? considering the current deal which is supposedly so amazing (but is still pretty shit) is only for 3 more years until ACL can demand whatever they want.
Seems like good planning to me

 

[skyblueinBaku]

Not just you, SBW. I don't think I've ever seen such an ad intense site either.

The ads with audio that auto start wind me up. I get part way through reading an article and have to scroll back to the top of the page to shut the bloody thing up.

 

[torchomatic]

That's because you're not an "expert". Don't say you are or else they'll try and interview you.

Seems like good planning to me

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Good job we didn't do that then.

But if you did do that, this is exactly the same response I would expect anyway.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Digressing slightly, does anyone else think the CTs website is absolute toilet? No other website I visit (yes, including the naughty ones) freezes as much when you load a page or goes completely blank when you've clicked through to an article, only to have to click back on your browser to see the article you wanted to in the first place.

Oi...Gilbert! Speak to your techie people...you're website is totally un-user friendly.

WM

That's what happens when the main function of the website is advertising

 

[chiefdave]

It's unfair he has seen the business plans and nobody else can!

Was going to say the same thing. As he's clearly seen full details of the business plan for both staying at the Ricoh and for building a new ground can we expect the CT to be publishing those details for us all to see? As unlikely as it may be it could be the case that the lease at a new stadium is £100K a year and we get all revenues, could the expert explain how we would be better off staying at the Ricoh than moving to a new ground on that basis?

But should we not print things that are perceived to be negative?

I don't think anyone is suggesting nothing negative should be printed however this expert isn't really adding anything to the debate. In fact you could view it as an attempt to rock the boat. At a time when for the first time in months there is some positivity in the fanbase we have had two negative pieces based on comments from this expert. I presume he didn't just ring up out of the blue and offer his opinion so what is the motivation behind this type of piece?

Non time-sensitive content is regularly held by news outlets for days after interviews have taken place. It's a way of ensuring we have content everyday, especially when people are away from work - like I am today.

I don't recall several days of articles with quotes from experts after Wasps accounts were released showing them to be in a far from stable financial position.

Has nobody at the CET picked up on Tony Mowbray's dig at the pitch after the game the other night? Was quite blatant wasn't it? The playing surface has been a biggish talking point at the Ricoh.

Good point but it I won't hold my breath waiting for anything that might shows Wasps in a negative light.

Why is it crazy anyway? considering the current deal which is supposedly so amazing (but is still pretty shit) is only for 3 more years until ACL can demand whatever they want.
Seems like good planning to me

There seems to be a lot of holes in the experts opinion. As you say it completely disregards the fact that we only have a short term deal. Is the new stadium plan still crazy if Wasps put the rent up to £2m a year?

There's also no mention of the impact of SCMP / FFP. Without stadium ownership it looks like an occasional trip to the bottom end of the championship is the best we can hope for. The article ignores that, in fact it makes no mention of what level the club can be competitive at if we do stay at the Ricoh.

Can we perhaps have clarification on how the arrival of Wasps is a financial benefit to CCFC as that seems a strange statement to make.

He also says we should build a new stadium if we get in the championship, why would he do that when he's saying we are better off staying at the Ricoh? And how quickly does he think a new stadium would happen, we can't just knock one up over the close season following promotion. Should we waiting until we go up and then if we go down again stop work on it?

 

[fernandopartridge]

How could I possibly have known what the answer was going to be before I asked the question?

Do you honestly think we wouldn't have run the story if he was in favour of the idea? Of course we would!

Why was the story commissioned? I suspect it was commissioned with the headline in mind (because that's what your readers want to hear as much as it may be true)

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

“If the team gets back into the Championship, maybe then they should look at building a new stadium, but what they have got seems like a pretty good deal to me.

As chiefdave points out, should we reach the championship should we start building one and then stop if we are relegated because the current deal doesn't allow us to be competitive in the championship.

“My personal view, based on research and evidence, is that I’m a big fan of multi-use stadiums - particularly in League One and League Two.

Surely the new stadium shows ambition to reach and be stable in the championship, whereas if we want to be L1/L2 club the rental deal at the Ricoh is best (he is a big fan of multi use stadiums in the lower leagues). That is essentially what he is saying isn't it? In L1/L2 renting at the Ricoh is best, if we ever want to return to championship and one day premier league then our own stadium is best. So in actual fact he is supporting the new stadium, yet the headline is just the word crazy.

If you ignore the crazy headline he is actually backing the stadium, assuming that the fans/owners want to be at least a championship club. Its just the telegraph concentrate on the negative because it suits them.

The headline could have easily been
'Football expert says Coventry City should build there own stadium if they want to be compete in the championship'

Or 'Ricoh rent deal viable in leagues 1 and 2 according to expert'

Or 'Expert says a new stadium would make CCFC a more attractive proposition to a lucrative takeover' and it wouldn't have been untrue

 

[martcov]

“If the team gets back into the Championship, maybe then they should look at building a new stadium, but what they have got seems like a pretty good deal to me.

As chiefdave points out, should we reach the championship should we start building one and then stop if we are relegated because the current deal doesn't allow us to be competitive in the championship.

“My personal view, based on research and evidence, is that I’m a big fan of multi-use stadiums - particularly in League One and League Two.

Surely the new stadium shows ambition to reach and be stable in the championship, whereas if we want to be L1/L2 club the rental deal at the Ricoh is best (he is a big fan of multi use stadiums in the lower leagues). That is essentially what he is saying isn't it? In L1/L2 renting at the Ricoh is best, if we ever want to return to championship and one day premier league then our own stadium is best. So in actual fact he is supporting the new stadium, yet the headline is just the word crazy.

If you ignore the crazy headline he is actually backing the stadium, assuming that the fans/owners want to be at least a championship club.

No, he seems to be saying that a reboot maybe necessary before we get anywhere ( first Part of story ) and a Deal at the Ricoh is the best Route whilst we are in our current Position. To build a stadium now is Crazy. The situation is too complicated ( and there is the posibilty of a further Relegation ) which may put off Investors in the stadium or Club.

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

The reboot was nonsense and was widely derided by many, suddenly he's a genius.

 

[chiefdave]

No, he seems to be saying that a reboot maybe necessary before we get anywhere ( first Part of story ) and a Deal at the Ricoh is the best Route whilst we are in our current Position. To build a stadium now is Crazy. The situation is too complicated ( and there is the posibilty of a further Relegation ) which may put off Investors in the stadium or Club.

However he says a reboot is possible in the event of relegation as the players will be out of contract. The same players will also be out of contract if we are not relegated.

He also states a rental deal is viable in L1 but seems to imply this is not the case in the Championship which is actually exactly the same thing Fisher said when stating the need for a new stadium!

Finally he says the club will be a hard sell without its own stadium. While SISU say they aren't interested in selling there are many, including the Trust, who are pushing for them to sell. It would appear in order for that to be a realistic prospect stadium ownership is needed.

 

[martcov]

The reboot was nonsense and was widely derided by many, suddenly he's a genius.

Yes, but that is what he actually said. He may not be a Genius, but he probably knows more about Football finance than most of us and JS. I can't see him knowing all of the facts though in our complicated case ( putting it politely ). I would like CCFC to drop the stadium idea for the time being and try to get an Extension of this relatively cheap deal from ACL. Getting the team in a good Position should be the first priority as that would increase revenue immediately.

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

Yes, but that is what he actually said. He may not be a Genius, but he probably knows more about Football finance than most of us and JS. I can't see him knowing all of the facts though in our complicated case ( putting it politely ). I would like CCFC to drop the stadium idea for the time being and try to get an Extension of this relatively cheap deal from ACL. Getting the team in a good Position should be the first priority as that would increase revenue immediately.

And he's said the current deal is great for a L1/L2 club, which is what we are at the moment. But surely if we have aspirations to be back in the championship in the near future then surely we are all now in agreement that a new stadium is the way forward?

 

[martcov]

And he's said the current deal is great for a L1/L2 club, which is what we are at the moment. But surely if we have aspirations to be back in the championship in the near future then surely we are all now in agreement that a new stadium is the way forward?

No. We would only be renting it from SISU anyway and we dont even know where to build it. It may be too small to sustain us if we ever got to the Pl. There could be a case if the site was right, the Size was right and it had facilities to bring in outside revenue and belonged to a company set up to Finance the Club - not just to Regain SISU's lost Investments.

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

So you are in agreement a new stadium is the way forward(if it was doable with location and stuff), but just not under SISU?

That's fair enough I guess, at least some are beginning to realise the current arrangement at the Ricoh isn't viable long term if we want to get to the championship/ premier league.

 

[Grendel]

What does the expert think of other clubs building stadiums on the lower leagues - Scunthorpe, Bristol Rovers and York?

What exactly is his expertise Simon?