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Jon Sharp - BPA (2 Viewers)

  • Thread starter Deleted member 5849
  • Start date Oct 26, 2016
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skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #71
Nick said:
Yep.

Tottenham
Emirates
I think the new AFC Wimbledon one is close to houses, not as extreme as HR with them on the front door

Just a couple I can think of.
Click to expand...

Plough lane stadium is surrounded by industrial and retail land. The nearest houses are to the front right hand corner of the current car park as you look at the stadium site from plough lane. Next to that it's probably the flats built on the site of Wimbledon's old ground. There's only really access into the stadium from two sides, but then the capacity isn't anywhere near 25k either.
 
Reactions: Otis

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #72
on another thread there was a you tube interview with Jon Sharp, seemed to be looking at something more modest from what he was saying
 
Reactions: dongonzalos
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #73
skybluetony176 said:
Plough lane stadium is surrounded by industrial and retail land. The nearest houses are to the front right hand corner of the current car park as you look at the stadium site from plough lane. Next to that it's probably the flats built on the site of Wimbledon's old ground. There's only really access into the stadium from two sides, but then the capacity isn't anywhere near 25k either.
Click to expand...


Here's an image of the proposed finished development at the AFC Wimbledon ground...



The completed ground is to be pretty much surrounded by flats (602 of them according to the BBC).
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #74
Frankley said:
Here's an image of the proposed finished development at the AFC Wimbledon ground...



The completed ground is to be pretty much surrounded by flats (602 of them according to the BBC).
Click to expand...

The flats are pretty much the current car park plus some industrial land.
 
J

jas365

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #75
We really need to stop talking about whether or not a ground can be redeveloped at the BPA, it will never happen. Anyone who thinks SISU will throw money at such a project is living in cloud cuckoo land.
 
Reactions: georgehudson, Chipfat, Brylowes and 4 others

chickentikkamasala

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #76
Talking about the Telegraph... what the hell has happened to the website? it has turned into a huge picture book with tiny headlines under each photo :muted: Stopped reading the paper version cause it was :wtf:, now the website exceeds it!
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #77
jas365 said:
We really need to stop talking about whether or not a ground can be redeveloped at the BPA, it will never happen. Anyone who thinks SISU will throw money at such a project is living in cloud cuckoo land.
Click to expand...
I think the opposite, call them out on it.

Didn't the trust also say it was worth exploring?
 
Reactions: stupot07 and wingy
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #78
skybluetony176 said:
The flats are pretty much the current car park plus some industrial land.
Click to expand...

But the Wimbledon plans demonstrate that others believe football stadiums can co-exist with housing, don't they.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #79
Frankley said:
But the Wimbledon plans demonstrate that others believe football stadiums can co-exist with housing, don't they.
Click to expand...
Yes, in fact many coexist because of housing in that clubs have developed housing to help pay for the stadium. Sometimes in the vicinity sometimes not.
 
Reactions: Astute

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #80
Frankley said:
But the Wimbledon plans demonstrate that others believe football stadiums can co-exist with housing, don't they.
Click to expand...

It's one development. Totally different to building a new 25k stadium on the site of a 3k stadium in the middle of an existing residential area.
 
Reactions: martcov and Otis

Nick

Administrator
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #81
skybluetony176 said:
Plough lane stadium is surrounded by industrial and retail land. The nearest houses are to the front right hand corner of the current car park as you look at the stadium site from plough lane. Next to that it's probably the flats built on the site of Wimbledon's old ground. There's only really access into the stadium from two sides, but then the capacity isn't anywhere near 25k either.
Click to expand...
Aren't the others close?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #82
Nick said:


Click to expand...
Frankley said:
But the Wimbledon plans demonstrate that others believe football stadiums can co-exist with housing, don't they.
Click to expand...
People in London will pay £250,000 to live in a broom cupboard. So reasonable priced properties will always sell. And is it them trying to build a stadium around flats that have been there many years?
 
W

wingy

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #83
Is my phone playing up or has Frankleys content dissappeared?
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #84
Nick said:
Aren't the others close?
Click to expand...

Not from memory. I used to go to plough lane stadium regularly to watch motorsport, although it's been 3 or 4 years since the last time due to it being practically shut down.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #85
fernandopartridge said:
Yes, in fact many coexist because of housing in that clubs have developed housing to help pay for the stadium. Sometimes in the vicinity sometimes not.
Click to expand...

That's a different proposal though. You can't have neighbour complaints if the houses haven't been built.

Still don't see how you can get a ground on there. All the more reason I want to see the planning docs, pure curiosity as to how they'd do it.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #86
shmmeee said:
That's a different proposal though. You can't have neighbour complaints if the houses haven't been built.

Still don't see how you can get a ground on there. All the more reason I want to see the planning docs, pure curiosity as to how they'd do it.
Click to expand...
Smoke and mirrors, Shmmeee, smoke and mirrors.
 
Reactions: Brylowes
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #87
skybluetony176 said:
It's one development. Totally different to building a new 25k stadium on the site of a 3k stadium in the middle of an existing residential area.
Click to expand...

It's not really that different, is it:

- Butts Park Arena is an existing stadium and the suggestion is a replacement stadium be built there - AFC Wimbledon's proposal is to take an existing stadium site and build a replacement stadium there.

- There's quite a lot of housing close to Butts Park and the area around Plough Lane is fairly densely populated too (there are rows of terraced houses close to both sites).

Interestingly, I would suggest the transport infrastructure around Butts Park is superior to that of Plough Lane.
 
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #88
Astute said:
People in London will pay £250,000 to live in a broom cupboard. So reasonable priced properties will always sell. And is it them trying to build a stadium around flats that have been there many years?
Click to expand...

The flats aren't there at the moment - I understand the idea is to build the stadium and the flats. Also, apparently the site is a difficult one - it's former marshland.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #89
Otis said:
Smoke and mirrors, Shmmeee, smoke and mirrors.
Click to expand...
You said they don't build near houses, you got some examples and it's smoke and mirrors?
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #90
Frankley said:
It's not really that different, is it:

- Butts Park Arena is an existing stadium and the suggestion is a replacement stadium be built there - AFC Wimbledon's proposal is to take an existing stadium site and build a replacement stadium there.

- There's quite a lot of housing close to Butts Park and the area around Plough Lane is fairly densely populated too (there are rows of terraced houses close to both sites).

Interestingly, I would suggest the transport infrastructure around Butts Park is superior to that of Plough Lane.
Click to expand...

Not followed this, are we talking about where they play now or the greyhound stadium site in Plough Lane?
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #91
Nick said:
You said they don't build near houses, you got some examples and it's smoke and mirrors?
Click to expand...

I think it's more the fact that we haven't seen anything concrete. Rather than us all sat around measuring Google Maps and assessing housing in London, it's be easier if we just had a planning doc.
 
Reactions: Otis
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #92
shmmeee said:
Not followed this, are we talking about where they play now or the greyhound stadium site in Plough Lane?
Click to expand...

I was writing about Wimbledon Stadium (the greyhound stadium site), not where AFC Wimbledon play at the moment. I believe 'SkyBlueTony' was also writing about the greyhound stadium site.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #93
shmmeee said:
I think it's more the fact that we haven't seen anything concrete. Rather than us all sat around measuring Google Maps and assessing housing in London, it's be easier if we just had a planning doc.
Click to expand...
That's why we would encourage it and call them out...
 
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #94
Nick said:
That's why we would encourage it and call them out...
Click to expand...

DISCLAIMER - I don't work for SISU, CCFC or anyone connected with them. I am not saying any detailed plans exist for BPA (because I have no idea if they do).

But... if it is accepted that the football club believes it is being frozen out of the city, can't people understand why they would want to keep any plans they have secret until the last possible minute?
 

Gint11

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #95
I tell you what though, if I was coming in as a new owner (assuming sisu agreed to sell) and was willing to plough money in I would find a location in cov and build a ground replicating a modern highfield rd. Get the fans on board straight away. Of course I know it's not that simple and would be lots of red tape and £££ but it's a nice idea!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #96
shmmeee said:
Not followed this, are we talking about where they play now or the greyhound stadium site in Plough Lane?
Click to expand...

It's the greyhound stadium in plough lane.
 

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #97
Frankley said:
But the Wimbledon plans demonstrate that others believe football stadiums can co-exist with housing, don't they.
Click to expand...

Don't you understand the residential development help pay for the stadium, there isn't much spare land at the Butts, it is either a smaller stadium and residential or a large one and no residential. I think it is obvious Cov will need to use much of the existing car park for residential. They'll need to incorporate c.100 residential units to raise £15M.
AFC Wimbledon's plans include the construction of 602 residential units
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/37486594
Click to expand...
 
Reactions: Otis and Astute

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #98
Frankley said:
The flats aren't there at the moment - I understand the idea is to build the stadium and the flats. Also, apparently the site is a difficult one - it's former marshland.
Click to expand...
Exactly. They are not having to try and get planning permission to build right next to people's homes. They want to build a stadium and homes around it. They are desperate for homes in that location. So that will help the local council decide to pass the plans.

Nothing like trying to get permission at the Butts and build right next to already existing old people's homes. And it also doesn't have access problems like the Butts.
 
Reactions: martcov and Otis

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #99
Frankley said:
DISCLAIMER - I don't work for SISU, CCFC or anyone connected with them. I am not saying any detailed plans exist for BPA (because I have no idea if they do).

But... if it is accepted that the football club believes it is being frozen out of the city, can't people understand why they would want to keep any plans they have secret until the last possible minute?
Click to expand...

Not really. CCC don't have the final say in planning. Any appeal goes to Westminster so the locked out, political embargo talk is bollocks really. If they are serious they need to get the ball rolling. These means that they need to be doing the things that they've already done regarding developing Ryton. I.e. talking to the local authority and local community.
 
Reactions: colin101
L

Limey

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #100
Frankley said:
DISCLAIMER - I don't work for SISU, CCFC or anyone connected with them. I am not saying any detailed plans exist for BPA (because I have no idea if they do).

But... if it is accepted that the football club believes it is being frozen out of the city, can't people understand why they would want to keep any plans they have secret until the last possible minute?
Click to expand...
No, show us how it would work. Get fans behind it and create pressure on those who apparently resist it.

At the moment the whole concept is simply regarded as pie in the sky, sisu stalling tactic nonsense whilst they play out the JR and hope wasps fail.
 
Reactions: colin101, martcov, skybluetony176 and 2 others
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #101
Astute said:
Exactly. They are not having to try and get planning permission to build right next to people's homes. They want to build a stadium and homes around it. They are desperate for homes in that location. So that will help the local council decide to pass the plans.

Nothing like trying to get permission at the Butts and build right next to already existing old people's homes. And it also doesn't have access problems like the Butts.
Click to expand...


But there has been a stadium (of sorts) on the site since the 1880s. Nobody still living was around when there wasn't a stadium at the Butts. What you are presenting is similar to the argument used by those who move next door to an airport and then complain that there is an airport next to their home.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #102
Frankley said:
But there has been a stadium (of sorts) on the site since the 1880s. Nobody still living was around when there wasn't a stadium at the Butts. What you are presenting is similar to the argument used by those who move next door to an airport and then complain that there is an airport next to their home.
Click to expand...
it's not really is it?
If you spend a chunk of your pension pot on a retirement flat next to a stadium that hosts events with crowds of a couple of thousand there's every chance you won't be happy if those crowds increases ten fold.

It's not going to happen anyway, sisu have done nothing in their time here to suggest they're prepared to stump up the investment needed for a project like this.
 
Reactions: Astute, The Reverend Skyblue, martcov and 2 others
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #103
skybluetony176 said:
Not really. CCC don't have the final say in planning. Any appeal goes to Westminster so the locked out, political embargo talk is bollocks really. If they are serious they need to get the ball rolling. These means that they need to be doing the things that they've already done regarding developing Ryton. I.e. talking to the local authority and local community.
Click to expand...

If you really don't recognise how a local authority can deliberately act with malice towards a particular business, or how it can manipulate the planning system, you're very naive.
 
F

Frankley

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #104
clint van damme said:
it's not really is it?
If you spend a chunk of your pension pot on a retirement flat next to a stadium that hosts events with crowds of a couple of thousand there's every chance you won't be happy if those crowds increases ten fold.

It's not going to happen anyway, sisu have done nothing in their time here to suggest they're prepared to stump up the investment needed for a project like this.
Click to expand...

Some of those living in the retirement village may not be happy, but it comes down to due diligence on their part doesn't it. As I said, there's been a sports stadium there since the 1880s.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 26, 2016
  • #105
Frankley said:
But there has been a stadium (of sorts) on the site since the 1880s. Nobody still living was around when there wasn't a stadium at the Butts. What you are presenting is similar to the argument used by those who move next door to an airport and then complain that there is an airport next to their home.
Click to expand...

Makes no odds. Look into the issues that Mildenhall stadium has had over the last decade with new residents moving into the area. It's not only cost the owners (ironically a family by the name of Coventry. I kid you not) a hell of a lot of money to defend (over a million I was told) they lost and have had to make all sorts of concessions just to continue operating. Don't underestimate the power of the local resident.
 
Reactions: Otis
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