Do you want to discuss boring politics? (20 Viewers)

chiefdave · Wednesday at 9:08 PM

fernandopartridge said:
You'll be paying benefits and paying for the programme at the same time. What are you doing if the person completes the course but no employer wants them?

what was that scheme called a few year back where people had to work or else have their benefits taken away. the jobs were sub-minimum wage and the promised jobs at the end of the scheme, to the shock of nobody, didn't materialise.

employers signing up to the scheme were supposed to agree that none of the tasks being done were normally carried out by paid employees but it turned out that wasn't being enforced in the slightest.

upshot being the government was paying employee wages for companies making huge profits.

mmttww · Wednesday at 9:10 PM

Illegal immigration and asylum: are government pledges on track?

BBC Verify examines key areas which the government has promised to make improvements

www.bbc.co.uk

well, that's going really well. It's early, I get it, but if anyone ever wants to do anything to reverse this trend, it's gonna take some new thinking. Otherwise, might as well not bother and just make the best of it somehow.

The Philosopher · 2025-05-22T07:59:37+0100

The economic intelligence of many on here.

Ccfcisparks · 2025-05-22T08:17:04+0100

The Philosopher said:
The economic intelligence of many on here.

View attachment 43314

This is why I’m grateful we have a Westminster quality economist on here, willing to explain it to us plebs!

shmmeee · 2025-05-22T08:23:31+0100

Ccfcisparks said:
This is why I’m grateful we have a Westminster quality economist on here, willing to explain it to us plebs!

Westminster quality is probably about right sadly.

shmmeee · 2025-05-22T08:25:29+0100

The Philosopher said:
The economic intelligence of many on here.

View attachment 43314

I assume that’s you at the bottom asking because you don’t understand what’s actually driving inflation cos it sure isnt tax or minimum wage. It’s mostly energy prices because your economic guru sold off all the gas reserves.

shmmeee · 2025-05-22T10:38:01+0100

While we’re talking economics.

https://ifs.org.uk/be-chancellor#top

fernandopartridge · 2025-05-22T13:36:08+0100

The Philosopher said:
The economic intelligence of many on here.

View attachment 43314

Can you show me how wholesale energy prices are affected by taxes and minimum wage increases please?

wingy · 2025-05-22T17:17:39+0100

There's some proff I think who is making a speech on Monday who will address the issue of 'foriegn' actor's who are subversive in their aims, think he's been asked by home office,broad ranging,and quite Draconian measures to combat such actions will be suggested.
I think they will need to look closely at what they deem our friends, could be some interesting legislation down the road.

MalcSB · 2025-05-22T17:44:11+0100

shmmeee said:
While we’re talking economics.

https://ifs.org.uk/be-chancellor#top

Didn’t we do this some time ago?

MalcSB · 2025-05-22T17:48:26+0100

wingy said:
There's some proff I think who is making a speech on Monday who will address the issue of 'foriegn' actor's who are subversive in their aims, think he's been asked by home office,broad ranging,and quite Draconian measures to combat such actions will be suggested.
I think they will need to look closely at what they deem our friends, could be some interesting legislation down the road.

Will be interesting to see who is included. Putin? Trump? Macron? Von der Leyen? Meloni? Friedrich Merz?

MalcSB · 2025-05-22T17:52:35+0100

Are living standards improving in every part of the UK? – Full Fact

Full Fact looks at whether the government’s new ‘Plan for Change’ pledge to raise living standards in every part of the UK is on track.

fullfact.org

No, it isn’t. Like every other pledge they have made.

shmmeee · 2025-05-22T17:59:20+0100

MalcSB said:
Didn’t we do this some time ago?

Yeah was a different one on the FT I think.

PVA · 2025-05-22T18:01:05+0100

MalcSB said:
Are living standards improving in every part of the UK? – Full Fact

Full Fact looks at whether the government’s new ‘Plan for Change’ pledge to raise living standards in every part of the UK is on track.

fullfact.org

No, it isn’t. Like every other pledge they have made.

Yesterday you were complaining that something wasn't in their manifesto when it was. Now you seem to be upset that something they pledged for 4 or 5 years time hasn't been done inside a year.

You might find this useful:

Pledge Progress - Keeping politics honest

Helping you to track the current UK government's progress toward meeting their election pledges.

pledgeprogress.co.uk

shmmeee · 2025-05-22T18:06:29+0100

MalcSB said:
Are living standards improving in every part of the UK? – Full Fact

Full Fact looks at whether the government’s new ‘Plan for Change’ pledge to raise living standards in every part of the UK is on track.

fullfact.org

No, it isn’t. Like every other pledge they have made.

Sky Blue Pete · 2025-05-22T19:59:33+0100

shmmeee said:
View attachment 43319

It’s a labour site I’ve been told

MalcSB · 2025-05-22T22:30:03+0100

PVA said:
Yesterday you were complaining that something wasn't in their manifesto when it was. Now you seem to be upset that something they pledged for 4 or 5 years time hasn't been done inside a year.

You might find this useful:

Pledge Progress - Keeping politics honest

Helping you to track the current UK government's progress toward meeting their election pledges.

pledgeprogress.co.uk

Not on track, not expected to be done/ completed.

shmmeee · 2025-05-22T23:13:44+0100

Sky Blue Pete said:
It’s a labour site I’ve been told

All information I don’t like is.

I came across this comic years ago and think about it at least once a week since.

wingy · 2025-05-23T08:07:15+0100

mmttww · 2025-05-23T11:04:22+0100

wingy said:

Who's the bloke doing the talking? His voice sounds so much like Christopher Hitchens it's mad.

MalcSB · 2025-05-23T12:45:29+0100

PVA said:
Yesterday you were complaining that something wasn't in their manifesto when it was. Now you seem to be upset that something they pledged for 4 or 5 years time hasn't been done inside a year.

You might find this useful:

Pledge Progress - Keeping politics honest

Helping you to track the current UK government's progress toward meeting their election pledges.

pledgeprogress.co.uk

They pledged stuff over 10 years when they have a 5 year term. Disingenuous or dishonest?

MalcSB · 2025-05-23T12:49:21+0100

Number of young people not in work or education hits 11-year high

The latest figure of 987,000 16-24-year-olds not in work, education or training has risen by 110,000 in a year.

www.bbc.co.uk

And young people moan they don't have the living standards of their parents?

About the same number unemployed as immigrants to fill vacant jobs.

PVA · 2025-05-23T13:42:45+0100

MalcSB said:
They pledged stuff over 10 years when they have a 5 year term. Disingenuous or dishonest?

It's only either of those things if you are incapable of the most basic critical thinking.

fernandopartridge · 2025-05-23T13:45:35+0100

MalcSB said:
Number of young people not in work or education hits 11-year high

The latest figure of 987,000 16-24-year-olds not in work, education or training has risen by 110,000 in a year.

www.bbc.co.uk

And young people moan they don't have the living standards of their parents?

About the same number unemployed as immigrants to fill vacant jobs.

It's their grandparents, a lot of 16-24 year olds parents too don't have the same living standards as their parents.

chiefdave · 2025-05-23T13:48:46+0100

wingy said:

No idea who this chap is but he's got a point. Last time I looked to have any chance of being able to get a mortgage to buy the house my parents have I would need to earn at least £145K. My Dad wasn't particularly senior or doing anything well paid. He got a job at Courtaulds out of school and stayed in the same job until they closed.

The thing about one person always being at home is often overlooked. My Dad would walk through the door to a home cooked meal every night and by 6pm he'd be sat in front of the TV or off out with his evening to himself. And he certainly wasn't spending his weekends doing batch cooking, cleaning, washing etc.

Has to be a factor in the rise in mental health issues, there's no downtime for people. No time to enjoy yourself, relax & recharge.

A while back I listened to a podcast that expanded on this. They suggested that we're creating 'non-jobs' for the sake of people being employed. Just pushing money round in a circle. People paying out for childcare, petcare, cleaners, gardeners etc because they're at work and don't have the time for those things but barely making enough to cover the cost.

mmttww · 2025-05-23T14:19:33+0100

chiefdave said:
Has to be a factor in the rise in mental health issues, there's no downtime for people. No time to enjoy yourself, relax & recharge.

This is it. Add in that more jobs are knowledge work now than they were in the past and it's just a recipe for burnout.

shmmeee · 2025-05-23T14:26:19+0100

The not being able to afford your parents home when you outearn what they ever did really is the kicker. Housing is tied so much to how well off you feel and the pulling up of the ladder seems especially unfair. I think most people would accept a lot if housing had kept up the last fifty years.

PVA · 2025-05-23T14:41:36+0100

Just had a look and my parents bought a 4 bed house with an acre of land in 1999 for £175k.

That's 330k in today's money.

They don't live there anymore but that house would probably cost minimum 800k if it was on the market today, while 330k gets you a 3 bed semi.

But but Netflix and avocados and iphones.

MalcSB · 2025-05-23T15:34:22+0100

PVA said:
Just had a look and my parents bought a 4 bed house with an acre of land in 1999 for £175k.

That's 330k in today's money.

They don't live there anymore but that house would probably cost minimum 800k if it was on the market today, while 330k gets you a 3 bed semi.

But but Netflix and avocados and iphones.

Self awareness.

CovValleyBoy · 2025-05-23T16:07:53+0100

Oh dear.

PVA · 2025-05-23T16:23:30+0100

MalcSB said:
Self awareness.

I think you've missed the point.

The Philosopher · 2025-05-23T16:52:01+0100

chiefdave said:
No idea who this chap is but he's got a point. Last time I looked to have any chance of being able to get a mortgage to buy the house my parents have I would need to earn at least £145K. My Dad wasn't particularly senior or doing anything well paid. He got a job at Courtaulds out of school and stayed in the same job until they closed.

The thing about one person always being at home is often overlooked. My Dad would walk through the door to a home cooked meal every night and by 6pm he'd be sat in front of the TV or off out with his evening to himself. And he certainly wasn't spending his weekends doing batch cooking, cleaning, washing etc.

Has to be a factor in the rise in mental health issues, there's no downtime for people. No time to enjoy yourself, relax & recharge.

A while back I listened to a podcast that expanded on this. They suggested that we're creating 'non-jobs' for the sake of people being employed. Just pushing money round in a circle. People paying out for childcare, petcare, cleaners, gardeners etc because they're at work and don't have the time for those things but barely making enough to cover the cost.

It’s the basis of Mosleyite / Keynesian economics, the principles of which came from Italy and Germany in the 1930’s and to a degree the USA during the Great Depression. Namely, the cure to unemployment is public works (rail, the Hoover Dam) which sets to work the unemployed at the government expense.

However, the difference with these made up jobs provided nowadays is that there is no national asset at the end of it. Keeping childminders and gardeners busy by extension is fine, but to what eventual benefit?

I’ve been astonished to see the lack of brains in Westminster in my recent (at times more close up) times. No clue. Invest in infrastructure such as tidal power and put people to work for an eventual upside

Mental health is a tricky one. Much mental health historically was undiagnosed, take veterans from WW2 for example. This doesn’t necessarily mean that issues are on the rise, just that it is identified more. There are, undoubtedly, some now who use “mental health” as a reason to not work.

No doubt many here don’t agree, no problem, it just provides evidence of mental health issues.

The Philosopher · 2025-05-23T17:06:45+0100

The background and perspective aside, being in the EU, is it a good thing?

SBT · 2025-05-23T17:41:24+0100

The Philosopher said:
The background and perspective aside, being in the EU, is it a good thing?

I would have thought the background and perspective would be quite important in answering that question

The Philosopher · 2025-05-23T17:48:07+0100

SBT said:
I would have thought the background and perspective would be quite important in answering that question

Really?

Is it better to have a potential 50% tariff or a 10% one.

Take your time….

Do you want to discuss boring politics? (20 Viewers)

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Users who are viewing this thread

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency