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Are we seeing a legacy of poor management at local level by Labour finally being challenged, that is being exacerbated by perceived Tory success of Brexit and vaccine program.... as in they trust the Tories now to have a go and do better?

2 votes for Labour and one for Green as they only put forward 2.

The second part may well be true right now. So in that case, just concentrate on what you can do where you have control and show people that you can get things done. And maybe don’t make stupid decisions like the Lab candidate choice for a Hartlepool along the way.

Mandelson as usual is talking shite. This is on Starmer plain and simple. He’s had a year to get his vision across and he’s only come up with ‘not Corbyn’ which according to Mandelson should have been more than enough. The reality is he does not give people any reason to vote for him or his...

It’s not the fault of Momentum, they often represent younger people trying to engage in politics. You need to look at the middle class London centrist politicians that think they know what is best for Northern working class people.

The Labour voters that defected never went back though.... possibly because the candidate shoehorned in was an ardent Remainer? Or was the lack of any kind of messaging other than ‘I’m not Corbyn by the way’

There is a huge demographic of people that are not home owners and stuck renting with no prospect of escaping. When Labour came out with a policy of a huge affordable housing program in 2017 it will have resonated massively. That’s how I interpret Liquids point anyway.

My advice on reflection is that we’ve got to get out and do stuff at council level while we have the opportunity. When you look at what Burnham is doing in Manchester, or some of the Labour councils in places like Hull or Preston they are doing tangible stuff. Whether it’s a regional bus scheme...

You only have to look at where the remain and leave vote was over the country. Remain vote largely contained to big cities and metropolitan areas and the South. And when it came down to it Labour’s former red wall does not fit in with this breakdown. And that’s why it fell so spectacularly.

The guy that is PM said he would let bodies pile high and still comes up smelling of roses. This is going to take a while to unpick.

We’re not talking about the same election here. Tories won in 2019 the minute they decided to honour the Brexit vote and Lab/LD didn’t. It wasn’t even a contest.

I agree - and I think having ideas that are popular across political divides are the way forward. But Labour currently are not offering that. They stuck an ardent remainer in as the candidate for Hartlepool and then made little or no effort to convince voters that they had an idea for the...

We had 3 votes where I was yesterday. I voted for 2 Lab councillors and 1 Green. Not one single party sent any literature about the local elections, which is surprising considering Northamptonshire were voting for a completely new set of councillors since the old one was shut down. I don’t know...

Rubbish - 2017 happened because spent its entire time just saying what it’s vision was, and little to no time badmouthing the opposition. Which conversely is why the Tory campaign was so shit. All they did was badmouth the competition and offered none of their own ideas.

Why do you? Are you telling me that Starmer can’t deliver something similar to 2017 and attain a 40% vote share at the very least.

That’s not what I mean and you know it. Of course take note of a party machine that always manages to coalesce at the right time, but in terms of general strategy are we going to abandon green policies and new ideas for a post-Covid world for more flag waving and banishing more foreigners?

They may be insignificant in some areas yes - but in others it will be difference between a Labour hold and someone else’s gain.

so trying to out-Tory the Tories is the master plan?

This ‘hard left’ bollocks is tiring. Either they are mass voting block that will shape Labour vote share, or they are a insignificant echo chamber of fantasy ideas. People can’t keep switching between the two to suit this weeks argument.

Well he’s got two choices IMO. He either starts to accept that there is a ‘left’ that he should embrace and bring into the Labour fold properly - there are Green councillors taking Labour seats. Or he ignores what’s staring him in the face and entrenches further right.