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Manchester City - 115 Charges (1 Viewer)

KenilworthSkyBlue said:
I think it's three times as Burnley finished on 35 points in 21/22.

However, it's comparing apples with toothpicks. I highly doubt they'd be able to hit 90+ points when contesting with the psychological battle of starting on -60 points and with the entire league despising them more than usual.
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It would certainly be interesting seeing how their players would react to a relegation battle, rather than going for trophies which is what they were expecting.
Personally I think quite a few of them would down tools and be eyeing up moves away.
 
KenilworthSkyBlue said:
You do realise this is Man United's revenue don't you? Once again parroting articles you don't understand. Man City's revenue was £694M in their latest set of accounts.
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You're just being a dick as usual.

I used their 2025 numbers as I hadn't seen their latest figures released.

So where's all your evidence on player expenditure covering more than wages and transfer fees? I knew I had you blocked for a reason. I found out immediately on unblocking you 😂
 
KenilworthSkyBlue said:
I mean he's been factually incorrect in quite literally every single post on this thread - all in the effort of pushing the irrelevant point that Man City will be compliant with SCR in the Championship.

Hence why I highlighted the turnover error as he's quite clearly copying Google AI / second rate journalists and trying to pass off whatever bile each spouts as his own opinion.

Putting to one side the hundreds of millions of £s wort of revenue they'll automatically lose overnight in the event that they are relegated, and the hundreds of millions of £s of transfer instalments they still owe, their squad value at a very rough estimate is probably in and around the £1BN mark and as such they'd be able to generate a mammouth amount in transfer fees if they were to find themselves in the Championship, while equally saving on wages.

I think what would also happen in that scenario is they’d look to loan players out until such time they find themselves back in the PL, which would help offset the wage bill further, while also appeasing those players that won't accept dropping down a level for a season but are equally happy to remain at the club long-term.

But it's an incredibly basic argument and doesn't account for any kind of variable.

It's also an argument that not only he's wasted hours compiling but is genuinely about as insightful as saying the sky is blue frankly.
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Another tital bullshit post. Have never used AI as it's just as inaccurate as what you are.

So you think I am wrong with me saying the worst I expect for them is playing in the Championship and with a transfer ban of 3 to 5 years?

You came out with what you think with rubbishing everything I think will happen. I asked you if you wanted to put your money where your mouth is in aid of the season ticket fund. Strangely enough you weren't interested.
 
oakey said:
Deduct
75 points this season
50 points next time in PL
25 points each PL season after that
Deductions expire after 10 years - 2037

Fine and transfer embargoes also for same 10 years
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Would be very good if they did, but they wouldn't have the bottle to do it. Litigation would be around the corner.

This is why I see their way out of the situation is punishment that puts them in the Championship with a longish transfer ban. Players would want to leave and they wouldn't be able to replace them. It's a way of trying to get them close to the situation they were in before the cheating started.
 
Lamps said:
Another tital bullshit post. Have never used AI as it's just as inaccurate as what you are.

So you think I am wrong with me saying the worst I expect for them is playing in the Championship and with a transfer ban of 3 to 5 years?

You came out with what you think with rubbishing everything I think will happen. I asked you if you wanted to put your money where your mouth is in aid of the season ticket fund. Strangely enough you weren't interested.
Click to expand...

I mean I've not said anything that's inaccurate....you on the other hand, well if it was listed on a page of A4 it'd be close to filling both sides.

No, I'm not saying you're wrong about potential punishments. How can I claim you're wrong about sanctions that haven't been decided yet? You yet again seem to find new and improved ways of making very little sense by inventing narratives I'm not come out with.

I'm rubbishing your inference that relegation is a minor punishment for Man City when it will quite obviously have seismic, long-term consequences for the club - as I've outlined in post after post.
 
Lamps said:
You're just being a dick as usual.

I used their 2025 numbers as I hadn't seen their latest figures released.

So where's all your evidence on player expenditure covering more than wages and transfer fees? I knew I had you blocked for a reason. I found out immediately on unblocking you 😂
Click to expand...

What do you mean 2025 numbers :ROFLMAO:

Football clubs report their accounts on a July to June financial year, not January to December you complete imbecile.

Man City's £694M revenue figure is from its latest published accounts, covering the year from July 2024 to June 2025. City's next set of accounts will cover July 2025 to June 2026 - which won't be released until March next year.
 
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Maybe posters can have a different opinion without it degrading into school playground insults 🤔 For what it's worth I think Man City will be ok whichever league they find themselves in as they have major assets they can sell, ie players, and still be competitive. I don't think that Etihad will stop sponsoring them unless the owners are also sanctioned. I would like to see them chucked in L2 but I don't think the other 19 PL teams want to be involved in the decision so they will end up with a points deduction this season that will relegate them & further sanctions, points deductions or transfer bans or both, over the next 4-5 seasons. The worst thing that could happen is they win something this season as they will have entry into the European competitions and there is nothing the PL/FA or UEFA can do about it. UEFA can't even reopen their case against them as they have a time limit on any cheating and these charges are from too long ago. I may of course be wrong but it doesn't make me a c**t & if anyone disagrees with me they aren't a c**t either.
 
Lamps said:
Another tital bullshit post. Have never used AI as it's just as inaccurate as what you are.

So you think I am wrong with me saying the worst I expect for them is playing in the Championship and with a transfer ban of 3 to 5 years?

You came out with what you think with rubbishing everything I think will happen. I asked you if you wanted to put your money where your mouth is in aid of the season ticket fund. Strangely enough you weren't interested.
Click to expand...

what you are wrong about is this £450m you keep saying against revenue and that you didn’t understand the total wage bill
 
ovduk78 said:
Maybe posters can have a different opinion without it degrading into school playground insults 🤔 For what it's worth I think Man City will be ok whichever league they find themselves in as they have major assets they can sell, ie players, and still be competitive. I don't think that Etihad will stop sponsoring them unless the owners are also sanctioned. I would like to see them chucked in L2 but I don't think the other 19 PL teams want to be involved in the decision so they will end up with a points deduction this season that will relegate them & further sanctions, points deductions or transfer bans or both, over the next 4-5 seasons. The worst thing that could happen is they win something this season as they will have entry into the European competitions and there is nothing the PL/FA or UEFA can do about it. UEFA can't even reopen their case against them as they have a time limit on any cheating and these charges are from too long ago. I may of course be wrong but it doesn't make me a c**t & if anyone disagrees with me they aren't a c**t either.
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When someone is repeatedly peddling misinformation it’s perfectly acceptable to say that
 
Grendel said:
When someone is repeatedly peddling misinformation it’s perfectly acceptable to say that
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It's ok to point out any inaccuracies but the name calling is unnecessary & some of that has been over a difference of opinion of what the PL will do to Man City.
 
If i was the PL, knowing who im dealing with id be seeking the harshest punishment possible. Because these owners will appeal and if successful bring that down. I hope the PL want these owners gone and are willing to sit tight knowing that multiple year sanction could force that to happen. The PL need to be as hostile to this club as the club has been to them.

These owners should be on hands and knees begging to negotiate and the PL should put a big sign up saying TOO LATE, and let the sanctiond flow on multiple years of fines, bans and points.
 
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ovduk78 said:
Maybe posters can have a different opinion without it degrading into school playground insults 🤔 For what it's worth I think Man City will be ok whichever league they find themselves in as they have major assets they can sell, ie players, and still be competitive. I don't think that Etihad will stop sponsoring them unless the owners are also sanctioned. I would like to see them chucked in L2 but I don't think the other 19 PL teams want to be involved in the decision so they will end up with a points deduction this season that will relegate them & further sanctions, points deductions or transfer bans or both, over the next 4-5 seasons. The worst thing that could happen is they win something this season as they will have entry into the European competitions and there is nothing the PL/FA or UEFA can do about it. UEFA can't even reopen their case against them as they have a time limit on any cheating and these charges are from too long ago. I may of course be wrong but it doesn't make me a c**t & if anyone disagrees with me they aren't a c**t either.
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The market for their players is tiny, who else would have been willing to pay £100m+ for Anderson
 
Can the admin please put this in the correct spot.
Other than that the effect on all clubs is going shake up everyone,all the managers appear non committal including our Frank.
Owners/Chairperson on the other hand.
 
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Grendel said:
what you are wrong about is this £450m you keep saying against revenue and that you didn’t understand the total wage bill
Click to expand...
Why don't you point out the rule where different additions are included to the cost of the squad.

The rules are the wages and transfer costs. Their wage bill was much lower. You're adding other things on.

If you told someone what you earn would you include pension payments in the number? Would you even know the pension contributions?
 
fernandopartridge said:
The market for their players is tiny, who else would have been willing to pay £100m+ for Anderson
Click to expand...
They have many players with a value much lower. Many aren't even in the squad. Their academy isn't even included in the financial rules so is pure profit.

How much for Mfuni? 🤔
 
ovduk78 said:
www.bbc.co.uk

Premier League: Swindon Town manager Ian Holloway says he would 'throw out' Manchester City

Swindon Town manager Ian Holloway says Manchester City should be relegated to non-league after the club were found guilty of Premier League financial rule breaches.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

Ian Holloway not sitting on the fence over this 😂
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And neither should he. Pep walked when he found out the truth.

There's one thing not understanding the rules. The majority just don't seem to understand them or have the chance to argue about what they mean. But those at the top of Manchester City knew what they were doing. The vast majority of the Manchester City supporters don't seem to think they've done anything wrong. The world is against them.

But those at the top knew what they were doing. They would have got away with it without a whistle-blower. Now they're using the threat of litigation to stop punishment and now to reduce the punishment.

9 years of cheating and 5 years of covering up the cheating will come down to the punishment they Premier dares to dish out without the fear of spending many years of getting tangled up in litigation. This means they won't get the punishment they deserve.
 
ovduk78 said:
Maybe posters can have a different opinion without it degrading into school playground insults 🤔 For what it's worth I think Man City will be ok whichever league they find themselves in as they have major assets they can sell, ie players, and still be competitive. I don't think that Etihad will stop sponsoring them unless the owners are also sanctioned. I would like to see them chucked in L2 but I don't think the other 19 PL teams want to be involved in the decision so they will end up with a points deduction this season that will relegate them & further sanctions, points deductions or transfer bans or both, over the next 4-5 seasons. The worst thing that could happen is they win something this season as they will have entry into the European competitions and there is nothing the PL/FA or UEFA can do about it. UEFA can't even reopen their case against them as they have a time limit on any cheating and these charges are from too long ago. I may of course be wrong but it doesn't make me a c**t & if anyone disagrees with me they aren't a c**t either.
Click to expand...
Yes less of the arguments would be nice, it does no good it just forces the 2 sides into constantly insulting each other rather than having an open and free discussion.
 
Lamps said:
And neither should he. Pep walked when he found out the truth.

There's one thing not understanding the rules. The majority just don't seem to understand them or have the chance to argue about what they mean. But those at the top of Manchester City knew what they were doing. The vast majority of the Manchester City supporters don't seem to think they've done anything wrong. The world is against them.

But those at the top knew what they were doing. They would have got away with it without a whistle-blower. Now they're using the threat of litigation to stop punishment and now to reduce the punishment.

9 years of cheating and 5 years of covering up the cheating will come down to the punishment they Premier dares to dish out without the fear of spending many years of getting tangled up in litigation. This means they won't get the punishment they deserve.
Click to expand...

Except, the PL won't be the ones issuing the punishments? That responsibility sits with the Independent Commission and them alone?
 
Lamps said:
Why don't you point out the rule where different additions are included to the cost of the squad.

The rules are the wages and transfer costs. Their wage bill was much lower. You're adding other things on.

If you told someone what you earn would you include pension payments in the number? Would you even know the pension contributions?
Click to expand...
When talking about cost of emplyees, it's standard to include employer's NI and employer's pension contributions.

I'd be very surprised if these weren't included in the definitions that the PL use.
 
KenilworthSkyBlue said:
Except, the PL won't be the ones issuing the punishments? That responsibility sits with the Independent Commission and them alone?
Click to expand...
The Prem suggests what the punishment should be. This is taken into account when the punishment is decided on.

My guess is it has already been spoken about, but because of the appeal it hasn't been released.
 
DazzleTommyDazzle said:
When talking about cost of emplyees, it's standard to include employer's NI and employer's pension contributions.

I'd be very surprised if these weren't included in the definitions that the PL use.
Click to expand...
When you see the figures they are all separate. The wage bill always comes first.

The rules state that the players costs that are counted are wages and transfer fees. This isn't allowed to go above 85% or it goes from the extra amount allowed that isn't time limited. Once used it is gome, but whenever the 85% isn't reached the club gets the percentage they didn't use back.
 
long way home said:
But do the PL recommend the sanctions they would want to see. Or you just saying the IC determine all...
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As post above. They suggest what they see as the punishment they see fit. Normally the punishment will be close to this, but there can be mitigating circumstances that change this.
 
long way home said:
But do the PL recommend the sanctions they would want to see. Or you just saying the IC determine all...
Click to expand...

Of course they can recommend sanctions. But the IC is entirely at liberty to ignore, lower, or increase the proposed penalties from the PL based on the evidence they have available.
 
Lamps said:
As post above. They suggest what they see as the punishment they see fit. Normally the punishment will be close to this, but there can be mitigating circumstances that change this.
Click to expand...

Lets be honest, you have no idea what the PL's stance on this is going to be as it's entirely unprecedented, not to mention that they're under significant pressure to throw the kitchen sink at Man City from the public and pretty much the entirety of the footballing community.

From what is appearing in the press, and the rhetoric of those which are relatively close, or close by association, to the case, the most probable outcome at this stage is they're going to at the very least recommend a massive points deduction which will almost certainly relegate City.

Also on your point that the PL will be concerned with legal retaliation. Possibly but most legal experts and sports lawyers actually come to the agreement that any legal action taken by Man City in the High Court is likely completely fruitless A) due to league's arbitration process and the limits on court intervention would make that route difficult, and B) the sheer weight of evidence against them.
 
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Lamps said:
When you see the figures they are all separate. The wage bill always comes first.

The rules state that the players costs that are counted are wages and transfer fees. This isn't allowed to go above 85% or it goes from the extra amount allowed that isn't time limited. Once used it is gome, but whenever the 85% isn't reached the club gets the percentage they didn't use back.
Click to expand...

Show us the evidence that SCR only accounts for base salaries rather than the total cost of employing a player, i.e. including bonuses, employer NI contributions and pension contributions.

It's genuinely laughable the nonsense you push when you're challenged for being wrong.
 
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Lamps said:
Why don't you point out the rule where different additions are included to the cost of the squad.

The rules are the wages and transfer costs. Their wage bill was much lower. You're adding other things on.

If you told someone what you earn would you include pension payments in the number? Would you even know the pension contributions?
Click to expand...

I can’t even deconstruct this drivel to still make any sense of it
 

UEFA Documents

documents.uefa.com documents.uefa.com

See K.1.2.C

  1. Employee benefit expenses of relevant persons include:
    1. gross wages/salaries, i.e. gross of any income tax and employee social security charges;
    2. non-monetary benefits for current employment e.g. benefits-in-kind, access to private medical care, housing, cars and free or subsidised goods and services;
    3. signing-on and loyalty payments;
    4. sporting performance bonus costs and other bonus costs;
    5. post-employment benefits, including pension contributions and any lump sum payments on retirement, and any other post-employment benefits, e.g. life insurance and access to medical care;
    6. other long-term employee benefits, e.g. long-term paid absences, jubilee or other long-service benefits, profit sharing and bonuses, and deferred remuneration;
    7. termination benefits/payments;
    8. fees, performance or other contractual bonuses;
    9. image rights payments directly or indirectly resulting from contractual agreements for the right to exploit the employees’ image or reputation for promotional, media or endorsement work in relation to football and/or non-football activities;
    10. any employer social security charges;
    11. if not otherwise included in items set out above, any other forms of consideration such as cryptocurrencies, crypto-assets, fan tokens and non-fungible tokens;
    12. all costs incurred in respect of a relevant person, by a third-party relating to appearances, sponsorship, endorsement or merchandising work, unless the licensee can prove to the satisfaction of the CFCB that the arrangement is genuine, is at fair value, and has been negotiated and entered into independent of any relationship between the sponsor/third-party and the licensee;
    13. in respect of a player whose registration is temporarily transferred out to another club, the relevant portion of the player’s employee benefit expenses that remains at the expense of the licensee; and
    14. if applicable, employee benefit expenses of relevant persons are net of credits recognised in respect of relevant persons from UEFA/FIFA club benefits and FIFA club protection programmes.
 
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