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Wasps Value Ricoh Arena at £48.5 million (1 Viewer)

  • Thread starter lewys33
  • Start date Oct 30, 2015
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Covstu

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #36
So all the dick waving aside, are we expecting another legal challenge from our owners given the huge disparity on valuation?
 

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #37
Covstu said:
So all the dick waving aside, are we expecting another legal challenge from our owners given the huge disparity on valuation?
Click to expand...

Seems to be a favoured tactic of SISU and Ms Seppala

As to disparity........
there was/is no valuation of the ACL shares save for the deal that was done

The £48.5m values the long leasehold interest which (a) didn't exist when shares sold, (b) is not a valuation of the total worth of ACL/Ricoh even now let alone Oct 2014 (c) forms only part of the worth of ACL without any inclusion of liabilities which would decrease it <eg the bonds £35m for example>

In reality the 48.5m is totally unrelated to the value the shares when they were sold ......... comparing apples and pears really stu

as for the CT headline ....... value at £48.5m isn't really news is it we already knew the value of the long lease and therefore should have know the likely value in the accounts..... but they have to tag it with something that gets interest...... has the Ricoh been valued at £48.5m though? What do we mean by "the Ricoh"
 
Last edited: Oct 30, 2015
E

egastap

New Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #38
Lewys33......What's the 5 million you're talking about? Where did that come from? If you are talking about the extract from the article 'Wasps paid £5.54m for 100 per cent of Ricoh Arena operating firm ACL last year and took on the remainder of a £14.4m loan from Coventry City Council - which it since cleared using the income from the bond scheme'......I believe with my rudimentary knowledge of mathematics that is close to 20 million they paid for the Arena. Now compare that to what SISU valued it at.....that is more relevant.
 
Last edited: Oct 30, 2015

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #39
I know people/journalists/politicians/press releases by the parties etc etc keep adding in the loans they took over as part of the consideration for the shares but it is not the case. The consideration was £5,717,143 as detailed by Wasps Holdings June 2015 financial statements.

As per those financials Wasps paid £188,170 goodwill above the asset value in the accounts of the ACL group

The CCC loan already existed........ it has since been replaced by other loans from the bonds........ so wasps didn't actually pay the extra £14m at all

plus the monies received from the Bonds is not income at all....... its a form of loan or liability on the balance sheet
 
Last edited: Oct 30, 2015

Covstu

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #40
oldskyblue58 said:
Seems to be a favoured tactic of SISU and Ms Seppala

As to disparity........
there was/is no valuation of the ACL shares save for the deal that was done

The £48.5m values the long leasehold interest which (a) didn't exist when shares sold, (b) is not a valuation of the total worth of ACL/Ricoh even now let alone Oct 2014 (c) forms only part of the worth of ACL without any inclusion of liabilities which would decrease it <eg the bonds £35m for example>

In reality the 48.5m is totally unrelated to the value the shares when they were sold ......... comparing apples and pears really stu

as for the CT headline ....... value at £48.5m isn't really news is it we already knew the value of the long lease and therefore should have know the likely value in the accounts..... but they have to tag it with something that gets interest...... has the Ricoh been valued at £48.5m though? What do we mean by "the Ricoh"
Click to expand...

Fair comment, something isnt quite adding up though. Not an expert in this field but there is something FIFA about this arrangement......
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #41
oldskyblue58 said:
I know people/journalists/politicians/press releases by the parties etc etc keep adding in the loans they took over as part of the consideration for the shares but it is not the case. The consideration was £5,717,143 as detailed by Wasps Holdings June 2015 financial statements.

As per those financials Wasps paid £188,170 goodwill above the asset value in the accounts of the ACL group

The CCC loan already existed........ it has since been replaced by other loans from the bonds........ so wasps didn't actually pay the extra £14m at all

plus the monies received from the Bonds is not income at all....... its a form of loan or liability on the balance sheet
Click to expand...
I was a little confused by how the £35m contribution the bond made was reported. How much was the interest on the £14.4m loan they repaid?
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #42
fernandopartridge said:
I was a little confused by how the £35m contribution the bond made was reported. How much was the interest on the £14.4m loan they repaid?
Click to expand...

They didn't pay any interest IIRC.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #43
stupot07 said:
They didn't pay any interest IIRC.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
Click to expand...
It said in the report that they paid the interest on the loan in a lump.
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #44
fernandopartridge said:
It said in the report that they paid the interest on the loan in a lump.
Click to expand...

Fair do's, must have missed that. Do we know how much?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #45
stupot07 said:
Fair do's, must have missed that. Do we know how much?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
Click to expand...
Previous reports suggest initial rate was 5% which returned £750k p/a. They paid 2 years already so the remaining interest would be in the region of £13.5m on top of the £13.4m capital.
Not sure how clear this was made in the bond prospectus!
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #46
skybluetony176 said:
Never defended Wasps yet. It's just people like you are stupid enough to believe Grendull, Sickboy etc when they say I do. Funny that when i challange them they never come back with anything.
Click to expand...

I am actually ashamed to support the same football club as you. If I was you I'd concentrate on learning the difference between piece and peace before claiming to be a master of debate.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #47
When ACL repaid the loan they had paid 2 years of interest which was thought to be 1.5 million pounds. Since the initial plan was to pay it over 20 years CCC lost out on 20 years of interest payments.

But it also means a significant reduction in the return for the council with no interest to be paid over the next 20 years as expected.
However, the council has already received around two years of interest at the initial interest rate of five per cent – which will have provided an estimated return of around £1.5million.

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/wasps-rfc-pay-134million-ricoh-9248558
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #48
Sick Boy said:
I am actually ashamed to support the same football club as you. If I was you I'd concentrate on learning the difference between piece and peace before claiming to be a master of debate.
Click to expand...

You'll get a pat on the head of Grendull for that one. Good little monkey boy.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #49
chiefdave said:
Worse than that, CCC sold 50% of ACL for £2.77m, that 50% is now valued at £24.25m, that's a 775% increase in the space of 6 months!
Click to expand...

Personally I've never been convinced the ground *was* worth much - finished grounds tend not to be sold for much.

That is a *huge* markup though. What are the possible consequences of their new valuation being out?
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #50
Oh, and ill the value be amortised each year in the accounts?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #51
skybluetony176 said:
You'll get a pat on the head of Grendull for that one. Good little monkey boy.
Click to expand...

It seems the rumour I heard about you is true Tony.
 

higgs

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #52
Easy money for doing nothing should be the people of coventry reaping d rewards not a private company
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #53
Grendel said:
It seems the rumour I heard about you is true Tony.
Click to expand...

I doubt it.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #54
Grendel said:
It seems the rumour I heard about you is true Tony.
Click to expand...

I remember when he went on Gmk to drum up support for UKIP. Says it all about him.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #55
Sick Boy said:
I remember when he went on Gmk to drum up support for UKIP. Says it all about him.
Click to expand...

Never been a member on GMK. There was some moron on there pretending to be me though and spouting shit. I did hear who that was too. Seems they didn't appreciate what I had to say about SISU on here.

I saw the funny side though. It showed up the person pretending to be me as the petty small minded little child I always thought they were and at the same time they exposed themselves for the SISU apologist they always claimed not to be
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #56
skybluetony176 said:
I doubt it.
Click to expand...

Suggestion is that as you are a bit strapped for cash you have taken up Italias offer of being his car park attendant for Wasps games.

It's the only explanation I can come up with for your slavish defence of them - even on a par with your new boss.

Hope you got a nice yellow jacket as part of the deal
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #57
Grendel said:
Suggestion is that as you are a bit strapped for cash you have taken up Italias offer of being his car park attendant for Wasps games.

It's the only explanation I can come up with for your slavish defence of them - even on a par with your new boss.

Hope you got a nice yellow jacket as part of the deal
Click to expand...

To be fair that made me smile. See, you can do comedy.

Wipe the froth of your mouth, take some deep breaths and then actually try reading what I've posted dear as I never have and never will defend them.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #58
You won't defend them but you certainly don't like to hear a bad word said against them.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #59
skybluetony176 said:
Never been a member on GMK. There was some moron on there pretending to be me though and spouting shit. I did hear who that was too. Seems they didn't appreciate what I had to say about SISU on here.

I saw the funny side though. It showed up the person pretending to be me as the petty small minded little child I always thought they were and at the same time they exposed themselves for the SISU apologist they always claimed not to be
Click to expand...

Not sure how your support of UKIP has anything to do with Sisu.
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #60
Grendel said:
Suggestion is that as you are a bit strapped for cash you have taken up Italias offer of being his car park attendant for Wasps games.
It's the only explanation I can come up with for your slavish defence of them - even on a par with your new boss.
Hope you got a nice yellow jacket as part of the deal
Click to expand...

No ones defending them. All but the paranoid 6 are excepting reality.
Can you return the Wasps Onesie asap as we have now replaced you with a street sign ?
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #61
skybluetony176 said:
To be fair that made me smile. See, you can do comedy.

Wipe the froth of your mouth, take some deep breaths and then actually try reading what I've posted dear as I never have and never will defend them.
Click to expand...

italiahorse said:
No ones defending them. All but the paranoid 6 are excepting reality.
Can you return the Wasps Onesie asap as we have now replaced you with a street sign ?
Click to expand...

 

Nick

Administrator
  • Oct 30, 2015
  • #62
The comments on that article are quite funny too.

I wondered what Dongo was up to nowadays!
 
S

SimonGilbert

Telegraph Tea Boy
  • Oct 31, 2015
  • #63
Update today.

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/wasps-rfc-chief-confident-ricoh-10361207
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 31, 2015
  • #64
Their breakeven attendances is 10k, but they over achieved that and lost £2.4m?

You just can't beat a bit of spin on a Saturday morning. It just wouldn't feel like a a ccfc matchday without a bit of wasps PR.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
 
Last edited: Oct 31, 2015

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Oct 31, 2015
  • #65
No doubt it'll get lapped up by the franchise defenders.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Oct 31, 2015
  • #66
stupot07 said:
Their breakeven attendances is 10k, but they over achieved that and lost £2.4m?

You just can't beat a bit of spin on a Saturday morning. It just wouldn't feel like a a ccfc matchday without a bit of wasps PR.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
Click to expand...
I'm not going to the game now, I hope Simon is happy!
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 31, 2015
  • #67
stupot07 said:
Their breakeven attendances is 10k, but they over achieved that and lost £2.4m?

You just can't beat a bit of spin on a Saturday morning. It just wouldn't feel like a a ccfc matchday without a bit of wasps PR.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
Click to expand...

If you want to understand it you need to see the accounts.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Oct 31, 2015
  • #68
It would have been much better if the CET had taken the position of the local media in Northampton did with ccfc.
 

Covstu

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 31, 2015
  • #69
So wasps added over 20m in value, fuck me they are good
 

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 31, 2015
  • #70
Sick Boy said:
No doubt it'll get lapped up by the franchise defenders.
Click to expand...

Certainly being lapped up by the few.
CET drop a headline but no detail and keyboards are soaked in drool.
 
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