Wasps downward spiral... (4 Viewers)

duffer · Nov 6, 2021

It still looks to me like a slow motion train wreck. Covid has obviously hammered them, like a lot of other businesses, but the bond means that they are hugely over-leveraged imho.

The point of the bond, as I recall, was to make Wasps the richest club in Europe. It was a gamble on making them the Man Utd of rugby, or perhaps Man City/Chelsea these days. Star players from world rugby, top of the league, massive brand, huge following, big profits.

It's clearly not worked, and that plan has already been ditched from what I can see.

The bond then, to mix a metaphor, is the looming iceberg. Money is getting tighter, and hence more expensive. I'm not sure that they will be able to refinance the bond. Even if they can it will be a bigger risk to investors and far more expensive to do so; thus an even bigger drain on annual finances.

I can't see how they square this circle, in truth.

duffer · Nov 6, 2021

A word on OSB. I don't know if he's been to Wasps or not, but who here hasn't done something they're embarrassed about at some point in in their life.

Even if he had, or does, it doesn't diminish him or his opinions in my book. We don't always agree but he makes his points from a position of knowledge and we can differ without falling out, which seems rare sometimes hereabouts.

Gynnsthetonic · Nov 6, 2021

When are the bond repayments due, I know its 2022 just not sure about the month!

Liquid Gold · Nov 6, 2021

Gynnsthetonic said:
When are the bond repayments due, I know its 2022 just not sure about the month!

May is in my head for some reason.

chiefdave · Nov 6, 2021

Gynnsthetonic said:
When are the bond repayments due, I know its 2022 just not sure about the month!

13th May so you'd think it can't be too long before they reveal how they're going to make the payment.

I've said for a long time they'd be foolish to assume the countries, and worlds for that matter, financial situation would be the same when they came to refinance. Admittedly I was thinking more along the lines of a potential impact of Brexit but throw covid into the mix and surely they're going to struggle to refinance on similar terms to those they have now.

When the bond was issued there was virtually no trading history for Wasps in Coventry. It was all talk of how they would be the biggest and best club in the world and the Ricoh would be packed every week. The reality has been very different. Huge losses every year, multiple breaches of the bond terms, a sport that has sold off a portion of its future revenues and seems to be struggling to monetise its rights in countries where it has an existing fan base, let along become some sort of rival to the Premier League worldwide as they seemingly believed could happen. How attractive is that to investors? Will supporters who put some money in want their money back or will they keep it in the club?

As ever don't think its imminent collapse but not sure how constant large losses and regular refinancing gives them stability going forward.

Grendel · Nov 6, 2021

duffer said:
A word on OSB. I don't know if he's been to Wasps or not, but who here hasn't done something they're embarrassed about at some point in in their life.

Even if he had, or does, it doesn't diminish him or his opinions in my book. We don't always agree but he makes his points from a position of knowledge and we can differ without falling out, which seems rare sometimes hereabouts.

the point i was making is the comment wasn’t true - pretty odd really

CCFC54321 · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Old sky blue will be along in a minute to tell us all is fine.*

*The guy that pretended to go to a ccfc protest at the ricoh, but actually went to a wasps game where said protest was occurring at the same time.

A few people have raised eyebrows that some on here have suggested there business model is ‘working’.

Grendel · Nov 6, 2021

CCFC54321 said:
A few people have raised eyebrows that some on here have suggested there business model is ‘working’.

I don’t think anyone has said that it’s clearly not worked as they wanted it to

oldskyblue58 · Nov 6, 2021

This will be my only comment on the matter

I went to the protest. That is a fact. There are people on this forum who I talked to including Grendel who can vouch for that. I then went home.

The post in question is inaccurate in every aspect and untrue. I do not however have to justify myself to anyone other than my wife, family and those that matter to me. So I will not get in to a conversation about it

Will comment on the wasps financials when I have time to.

JAM See · Nov 6, 2021

Flying Fokker said:
View attachment 22574

Interesting set of tabs open there.

I hope the NHS one is not too serious.

chiefdave · Nov 6, 2021

JAM See said:
Interesting set of tabs open there.

I hope the NHS one is not too serious.

If he's been putting the door handles up there no wonder there's problems!

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

oldskyblue58 said:
This will be my only comment on the matter

I went to the protest. That is a fact. There are people on this forum who I talked to including Grendel who can vouch for that. I then went home.

The post in question is inaccurate in every aspect and untrue. I do not however have to justify myself to anyone other than my wife, family and those that matter to me. So I will not get in to a conversation about it

Will comment on the wasps financials when I have time to.

No one is debating that you went to the protest.

I know for a fact you have been to watch Wasps, and on this particular day was no exception. Your word might mean more than mine on this forum when it comes to financial stuff, but please don´t try and act as if you don´t have an interest with Wasps, particularly when things were going to shit on the football side of things and you were going to watch them instead of CCFC.

SlowerThanPlatt · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
No one is debating that you went to the protest.

I know for a fact you have been to watch Wasps, and on this particular day was no exception. Your word might mean more than mine on this forum when it comes to financial stuff, but please don´t try and act as if you don´t have an interest with Wasps, particularly when things were going to shit on the football side of things and you were going to watch them instead of CCFC.

Were you at the protest then?

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

SlowerThanPlatt said:
Were you at the protest then?

No.

What has that got to do with my point? Were you there? Did you follow him to his car? Did you also sneak into the stadium to watch Wasps?

Skybluefaz · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
No one is debating that you went to the protest.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
*The guy that pretended to go to a ccfc protest

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

I'll rephrase, although you know exactly what I'm saying.

The guy that went to the ricoh to watch wasps only to go to the protest and pretend that's the main reason why he went to the stadium.

SlowerThanPlatt · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
No.

What has that got to do with my point? Were you there? Did you follow him to his car? Did you also sneak into the stadium to watch Wasps?

How could you possibly know he attended the Wasps game that day then? Others who were there support his side of events

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

SlowerThanPlatt said:
How could you possibly he attended the Wasps game that day then? Others who were there support his side of events

No, people are trying so hard to defend him they are literally making stuff up.

He went to the protest. We all know that to be true. That isn't up for debate.

One of my relatives knows him personally and he also went to watch wasps that day which was why he was at the stadium in the first place. It was not the first or last time he has been to watch them either.

Considering that fans who reject CCFC to watch wasps are talked about like enemies on this thread, the fact one person gets a pass to the point people are making stuff up is really strange.

Grendel · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
No.

What has that got to do with my point? Were you there? Did you follow him to his car? Did you also sneak into the stadium to watch Wasps?

I was there and so was he you weirdo

Skybluefaz · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
No, people are trying so hard to defend him they are literally making stuff up.

What stuff has been literally made up? This beef has come out of the blue, why do you have it in for OSB all of a sudden?

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

Grendel said:
I was there and so was he you weirdo

I've always been respectful to you up until now, so I'm really not sure why the name calling has started.

I know he went to the protest, that is not being contested. For some reason a number of people on this thread apparently went home with him, which begs the question, did they watch wasps too?

Grendel · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
I've always been respectful to you up until now, so I'm really not sure why the name calling has started.

I know he went to the protest, that is not being contested. For some reason a number of people on this thread apparently went home with him, which begs the question, did they watch wasps too?

you said he didn’t go in your opening post. He did and he then went home - why not have a lie down

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

Skybluefaz said:
What stuff has been literally made up? This beef has come out of the blue, why do you have it in for OSB all of a sudden?

Read this thread. People are just writing garbage without actually reading what I am saying.

My beef is that someone who frequently comments on financial stuff, which leans quite apologetically towards wasps in many circumstances, abandoned CCFC for a significant amount of time. Not that this on its own is particularly shocking, but he was going to watch wasps instead. He also went to a wasps game when there was a ccfc protest at the same time and tried to make himself look like a superfan by attending it.

No one on here is denying that he went to the wasps game, they just keep repeating that he was at the protest, which I have been agreeing with the whole time.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

Grendel said:
you said he didn’t go in your opening post. He did and he then went home - why not have a lie down

I rephrased my statement and you know exactly what I meant as did Faz.

He didn't go home afterwards and if you are going to try and tell me that isn't the case then I know for a fact you are lying.

You are the one that needs a lie down, and you also need to stop calling people names who have generally always been respectful towards you.

SlowerThanPlatt · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Read this thread. People are just writing garbage without actually reading what I am saying.

My beef is that someone who frequently comments on financial stuff, which leans quite apologetically towards wasps in many circumstances, abandoned CCFC for a significant amount of time. Not that this on its own is particularly shocking, but he was going to watch wasps instead. He also went to a wasps game when there was a ccfc protest at the same time and tried to make himself look like a superfan by attending it.

No one on here is denying that he went to the wasps game, they just keep repeating that he was at the protest, which I have been agreeing with the whole time.

Did you only find this out today? As can’t see you’ve posted about it before?

Grendel · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
*The guy that pretended to go to a ccfc protest at the ricoh

Skybluefaz · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Read this thread. People are just writing garbage without actually reading what I am saying.

My beef is that someone who frequently comments on financial stuff, which leans quite apologetically towards wasps in many circumstances, abandoned CCFC for a significant amount of time. Not that this on its own is particularly shocking, but he was going to watch wasps instead. He also went to a wasps game when there was a ccfc protest at the same time and tried to make himself look like a superfan by attending it.

No one on here is denying that he went to the wasps game, they just keep repeating that he was at the protest, which I have been agreeing with the whole time.

Loads of fans must have jumped ship to Wasps when we were in league two. There was only me and 7000 other regular superfans turning up then while Wasps were getting decent crowds (I think). Now look at it, we're back in the Championship and pulling in 20k at home and Wasps are getting 5 to 7k. There must be a huge crossover in people that have fucked the Wasps off and come back to the City. It is what it is though.

Skybluefaz · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
I rephrased my statement and you know exactly what I meant as did Faz.

I didn't, you tied yourself up in knots which I admit I found pretty funny.

Grendel · Nov 6, 2021

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
I rephrased my statement and you know exactly what I meant as did Faz.

He didn't go home afterwards and if you are going to try and tell me that isn't the case then I know for a fact you are lying.

You are the one that needs a lie down, and you also need to stop calling people names who have generally always been respectful towards you.

Stop being respectful to me if you like

Evo1883 · Nov 6, 2021

He's saying after the protest he went to watch wasps .. we can stop the silly talk and just find out if this is actually true instead maybe

I don't know why we are picking apart his post , did he watch wasps or not after the protest , let's save 100 posts of nonsense

Evo1883 · Nov 6, 2021

Skybluefaz said:
Loads of fans must have jumped ship to Wasps when we were in league two. There was only me and 7000 other regular superfans turning up then while Wasps were getting decent crowds (I think). Now look at it, we're back in the Championship and pulling in 20k at home and Wasps are getting 5 to 7k. There must be a huge crossover in people that have fucked the Wasps off and come back to the City. It is what it is though.

I don't agree , I think it's appalling that any coventry fan would watch wasps while we were doing shite .... couldn't be me

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

Evo1883 said:
He's saying after the protest he went to watch wasps .. we can stop the silly talk and just find out if this is actually true instead maybe

I don't know why we are picking apart his post , did he watch wasps or not after the protest , let's save 100 posts of nonsense

Well, you are right of course, but facts don't matter to some people as we know.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Nov 6, 2021

Grendel said:
Stop being respectful to me if you like

Well you are definitely losing my respect considering how you've spoken to me in the last 24 hours.

Skybluefaz · Nov 6, 2021

Evo1883 said:
I don't agree , I think it's appalling that any coventry fan would watch wasps while we were doing shite .... couldn't be me

You can think it as much as you want and I'd never do it (watch Wasps) but a certain section of our crowd are fickle.

Liquid Gold · Nov 6, 2021

Soooooo

who does everybody fancy?

Wasps downward spiral... (4 Viewers)

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