Wasps CCFC Relationship (1 Viewer)

[Hobo]

I'm not saying it's necessarily right. I'm suggesting that it is what Wasps could do to protect themselves. They must know that Sisu are hardly known for being ethical about the way they do business. Whatever the outcome, it damages the relationship so it would not be surprising if Wasps wanted nothing further to do with them. They are taking a risk by upsetting their landlord.

they are good at working with people and building relationships Tim Fisher said so.

 

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[torchomatic]

I'm also interested in the Wasps/CT relationship. Seems very strong.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Considering Wasps have got a significant interest bill to pay on their bond every year, do you really foresee them evicting their main tenant? Especially a tenant which has already shown it isn't afraid of moving elsewhere.

 

[Nick]

I'm not saying it's necessarily right. I'm suggesting that it is what Wasps could do to protect themselves. They must know that Sisu are hardly known for being ethical about the way they do business. Whatever the outcome, it damages the relationship so it would not be surprising if Wasps wanted nothing further to do with them. They are taking a risk by upsetting their landlord.

Is that the Wasps full of ethics you mean?

 

[torchomatic]

Prime example there, eh? SISU are unethical, but Wasps who move their team 70 odd miles are seen as shining lights in business. Weird.

Is that the Wasps full of ethics you mean?

 

[slowdave]

Surely when Wasps acquired ACL they would have done so with warranties from the seller, especially covering any potential legal action. I can't see that any appeal outcome would cost Wasps a penny.

And sorry for calling you Shirley.

 

[Specs WT-R75]

Surely when Wasps acquired ACL they would have done so with warranties from the seller, especially covering any potential legal action. I can't see that any appeal outcome would cost Wasps a penny.

And sorry for calling you Shirley.

Good point Dave. This might cover them against legal action, but I suspect if the loan is not deemed as being at commercial terms might not be covered? Otherwise the end result is the same and then the loan still wouldn't be at commercial rates.... head is spinning

 

[dongonzalos]

Why would they rush if there was no worry? Genuine question for the business people who know how it being paid off makes a difference.

I assume it completely eliminates as an option to the judge as a remedy if the judge found in SISU's favour

 

[dongonzalos]

If Wasps are ordered to pay more money to the council it will mean that there is an issue with the way the deal between ACL, CCC and Wasps was done. Now we don't know what evidence SISU will present so in the event they are successful that could relate to ether the sale to Wasps or more likely the council bailout of ACL. A ruling that the deal was done incorrectly and ACL being required to pay more to CCC will open the door for the SISU compensation claim.

So you think SISU can't claim compensation from the council. If a judge rules in their favour. Unles they also ask for Wasps to pay more money to the council?

 

[Grendel]

So you think SISU can't claim compensation from the council. If a judge rules in their favour. Unles they also ask for Wasps to pay more money to the council?

Surely you'd be thrilled if wasps had to pay more to the council?

 

[chiefdave]

So you think SISU can't claim compensation from the council. If a judge rules in their favour. Unles they also ask for Wasps to pay more money to the council?

No and that's not what I've said. For SISU to be able to claim compensation they have to be able to illustrate that something in the deal isn't as it should be. If they can successfully show that the loan from CCC to ACL was not at the appropriate rate then that clears the way for them to claim compensation.

 

[dongonzalos]

Surely you'd be thrilled if wasps had to pay more to the council?

Do you have any idea why SISU are in addition to requesting compensationthey are also asking for Wasps to pay the council more?
One part of me would be pleased, I would be even more pleased if it was to pay the Higgs charity more. Shame that is not possible.
However the other part of me thinks it's a waste of time asking for it as SISU won't win.
Will it then screw up our relationship with our landlord (to no end).
We have all seen how it pans out when you fall out with your landlord.
So it still begs the unanswered question. Why risk pissing off your landlord to help out your sworn enemy?

 

[Grendel]

Do you have any idea why SISU are in addition to requesting compensationthey are also asking for Wasps to pay the council more?
One part of me would be pleased, I would be even more pleased if it was to pay the Higgs charity more. Shame that is not possible.
However the other part of me thinks it's a waste of time asking for it as SISU won't win.
Will it then screw up our relationship with our landlord (to no end).
We have all seen how it pans out when you fall out with your landlord.
So it still begs the unanswered question. Why risk pissing off your landlord to help out your sworn enemy?

Given the landlord is an odious piece of filth that will only tolerate the tenant if there isn't any alternative and would never be interested in aing term arrangement who cares?

 

[dongonzalos]

No and that's not what I've said. For SISU to be able to claim compensation they have to be able to illustrate that something in the deal isn't as it should be. If they can successfully show that the loan from CCC to ACL was not at the appropriate rate then that clears the way for them to claim compensation.

Yes I understand that. If they prove it was state aid and incorrect terms. They can request compensation. What they don't have to do is additionally ask for their landlord to pay the difference. To what end?

 

[dongonzalos]

Given the landlord is an odious piece of filth that will only tolerate the tenant if there isn't any alternative and would never be interested in aing term arrangement who cares?

I take that as you don't know then?

 

[italiahorse]

What ever the best guesses above are, the relationship between Wasps and CCFC will not be great in respect of Sisu actions. The deal with ACL was before Wasps arrived and any future deals will be at Wasps mercy. If they get pissed off they might just give us a 'take it or leave it' rent offer. After all, what we gonna do about it ? New stadium ?
Many years of Sisu nonsense to come I'm afraid.

 

[Grendel]

I take that as you don't know then?

Don't know what? Pretty much every rational poster on here knows we have zero long term future of we stay at the Ricoh.

 

[dongonzalos]

Don't know what? Pretty much every rational poster on here knows we have zero long term future of we stay at the Ricoh.

In addition to asking for compensation. What do SISU gain from asking for Wasps to be made to pay the council.

 

[stupot07]

What ever the best guesses above are, the relationship between Wasps and CCFC will not be great in respect of Sisu actions. The deal with ACL was before Wasps arrived and any future deals will be at Wasps mercy. If they get pissed off they might just give us a 'take it or leave it' rent offer. After all, what we gonna do about it ? New stadium ?
Many years of Sisu nonsense to come I'm afraid.

Given they have shown themselves to be ruthless on business, that's exactly what they're gonna do regardless of whether we piss them off or not. They have the interest to pay, so they will try to screw us for every penny when it comes to renegotiate the deal.

I didn't go to Northampton, but if wasps kick us out or force us out with a take it or leave it, I would travel to Northampton to support us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

 

[Grendel]

In addition to asking for compensation. What do SISU gain from asking for Wasps to be made to pay the council.

I would guess it's part of an argument that the rental arrangement was at too low an interest rate and that as there were no penalties for eay surrender this made the loan commercially uncompetitive so cost taxpayers potential earnings.

 

[SkyBlueSid]

Is that the Wasps full of ethics you mean?

Again, not what I said. I am suggesting that Wasps may feel the need to fight back and play as dirty as Sisu do. They may well be as unethical as each other. This will make no difference if Wasps were to decide they've had enough of dealing with a bunch of litigious shysters and turf the club out on their ear. Liquidating ACL and letting a phoenix company run the Ricoh must also cross their minds, especially if they saw Watchdog the other week.

The point is that it won't make any difference who has acted the worse of the two if City are back at Sixfields this time next year. It's all about being careful what you wish for.

 

[italiahorse]

Given they have shown themselves to be ruthless on business, that's exactly what they're gonna do regardless of whether we piss them off or not. They have the interest to pay, so they will try to screw us for every penny when it comes to renegotiate the deal.

I didn't go to Northampton, but if wasps kick us out or force us out with a take it or leave it, I would travel to Northampton to support us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

I wilting on this.
I know I won't travel so I would join the majority of fans and find something else to do.

 

[dongonzalos]

I would guess it's part of an argument that the rental arrangement was at too low an interest rate and that as there were no penalties for eay surrender this made the loan commercially uncompetitive so cost taxpayers potential earnings.

I get the argument. However SISU requested two remedies.
1) compensation
2) Wasos pay a commercial rate

SISU did not need to request the second remedy. They only needed to request the 1st remedy.
The second remedy benefits the council. We all know SISU's opinion of the council.

The remedy only comes in afterwards if the judge finds in SISU's favour. The remedy does not add to the arguement. So there must be an angle for SISU to justify pissing off Wasps.

My only two guesses are
1) They think Wasps are skint
2) They hope Wasps make an out of court offer. Rather than go the distance

 

[Grendel]

I wilting on this.
I know I won't travel so I would join the majority of fans and find something else to do.

Being so against franchising I assume your association with Wasps would terminate as well?

 

[chiefdave]

If they get pissed off they might just give us a 'take it or leave it' rent offer. After all, what we gonna do about it ? New stadium ?

They could move us 85 miles away so long as it was financially advantageous. Can't imagine anyone would complain about that, would just show what shrewd businesspeople SISU are.

 

[Sick Boy]

Given they have shown themselves to be ruthless on business, that's exactly what they're gonna do regardless of whether we piss them off or not. They have the interest to pay, so they will try to screw us for every penny when it comes to renegotiate the deal.

I didn't go to Northampton, but if wasps kick us out or force us out with a take it or leave it, I would travel to Northampton to support us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

In this situation i expect there would probably be some kind of nopm campaign that encourages ccfc supporters to pack out the Ricoh and support Wasps.

 

[Specs WT-R75]

Again, not what I said. I am suggesting that Wasps may feel the need to fight back and play as dirty as Sisu do. They may well be as unethical as each other. This will make no difference if Wasps were to decide they've had enough of dealing with a bunch of litigious shysters and turf the club out on their ear. Liquidating ACL and letting a phoenix company run the Ricoh must also cross their minds, especially if they saw Watchdog the other week.

The point is that it won't make any difference who has acted the worse of the two if City are back at Sixfields this time next year. It's all about being careful what you wish for.

My goodness. They certainly cannot liquidate ACL. The lease is with ACL, the bonds are attached to ACL. A default on ACL for Wasps would be extremely messy indeed.

Also if ACL fails the lease reverts back to the original term rather than the 250yrs the council increased it to.

 

[Grendel]

My goodness. They certainly cannot liquidate ACL. The lease is with ACL, the bonds are attached to ACL. A default on ACL for Wasps would be extremely messy indeed.

Also if ACL fails the lease reverts back to the original term rather than the 250yrs the council increased it to.

Well they can...if they can't pay the bond interest.

 

[skybluetony176]

Well they can...if they can't pay the bond interest.

Or they could just raise another bond.

 

[Grendel]

Or they could just raise another bond.

Brilliant whose paying the Interest on that?

 

[Specs WT-R75]

Brilliant whose paying the Interest on that?

#NotWasps!

A legal ponzi scheme in all but name

 

[Terry Gibson's perm]

#NotWasps!

A legal ponzi scheme in all but name

They should take advice on that from Michael McIndoe:claping hands:

 

[Moff]

Or they could just raise another bond.

They could, but to be honest I think they would struggle for as many investors seeing as most people would know they were raising it to pay off the debt they couldnt already pay. A few would still be hoodwinked though, mainly the insane.

 

[italiahorse]

Franchising for the survival of a club I'm all for.

 

[italiahorse]

They could move us 85 miles away so long as it was financially advantageous. Can't imagine anyone would complain about that, would just show what shrewd businesspeople SISU are.

They couldn't move us 3 miles without being financially disadvantageous.
Sisu are idiots and always will be