van driven at pedestrians in London (1 Viewer)

martcov · Jun 5, 2017

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
On about borders because we have a big enough problem here. The last thing we want to do is import more of it, and we already are. How is that helping? It is making it 1000% worse.

Religion should be put in its place. However, if you stop the UK being a Christian country, which religion will then step forward and try and claim it for their own? Like it or not, historically this has always been a Christian country and I don't see the harm in it still being that way. In fact, it should be. If 6% of the population were Christians and they were responsible for 99% of terrorism offences you might have more of a point I think, although I can see where you are coming from overall.

We are not importing more though. We are growing our own.

My problem is that Christianity is also an Abrahamic religion and by accepting such a religion, and even having our head of state as head of a church, we are in fact similar to 'them'. They want a religious leader as head of their state.

I would not allow any religion to come forward. Tax them all. Close all single faith schools. Prosecute their 'faithful' who try and spread their hatred and bigotry. All haters and bigots - the "Christian Right" up there with radical Islam. No space for any hate preachers.

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

SkyblueBazza said:
And they say..."no weapons...no oil"...then what?

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We rely on Canadian oil while we undertake a massive building program of renewable energy. Create jobs, reach all our climate commitments and stop funding wankers. What's not to like.

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Many points that I agree on there LG.

As we have said many times, we often have different views on this kind of thing. Personally looking at that I can't argue with anything, but I think the focus is too much on the other side. No, we should not tolerate hate speech and the like, but a lot of these things would die down themselves if Islamic extremism was tackled. The only reason right wing 'behaviour' is growing, is because these issues which draw them out have not been tackled. That is often on the left if I'm honest.

Ripping off someone's Niqab should be punishable, but shooting children at a concert is worse. I really think if the latter is stamped out, the former will also die off. Sense of perspective really. I can understand why people are worried about right wing extremism, but I am certain that Islamic extremism is far more serious and damaging to our way of life right now.

We should form our own government off SBT. I'm sure the world would largely be a better place.

Maybe...

I'm up for a SBT government as long as Grendel (because he'd just shout until everyone had left the cabinet room) and Italia (because you'd come in to work one day and find out London is part of Qatar now) are nowhere near.

In all serious though when people with different ideologies work together thats when the best outcomes are usually achieved. Why we should be looking at proportional representation and decent coalition governments, hasn't worked too badly for Germany.

Ian1779 · Jun 5, 2017

Liquid Gold said:
Italia (because you'd come in to work one day and find out London is part of Qatar now)

Just covered my keyboard in tea when I read this

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 5, 2017

Liquid Gold said:
Why we should be looking at proportional representation and decent coalition governments, hasn't worked too badly for Germany.

Not so well for Italy, of course

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

Ian1779 said:
Just covered my keyboard in tea when I read this

It was a sensible logical decision. They are investing in the infrastructure and building links to the community. The fact they use his airport has nothing to do with it.

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

Deleted member 5849 said:
Not so well for Italy, of course

Has anything?

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Jun 5, 2017

Sky Blue Pete said:
How could you justify locking someone up for opinions? Totally unworkable

Easily justifiable to protect innocent civilians.

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Jun 5, 2017

Out of interest wonder if reactions would be different if it was someone trying to justify and lending their support to paedophilia

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Jun 5, 2017

Obviously if they have these opinions and don't express them, then no one will ever know and no one can do anything. If they are putting these opinions out on social media or speaking openly about it to others, then action should be taken against them.

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Out of interest wonder if reactions would be different if it was someone trying to justify and lending their support to paedophilia

We have a woman who is going to be elected Prime Minister on Thursday who 'lost' files that were crucial to an investigation on paedophiles in parliament and nobody seems too bothered about that.

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Jun 5, 2017

Sick Boy said:
And also guaranteed to create more extremists.

Then we will lock them up as well

Captain Dart · Jun 5, 2017

Liquid Gold said:
I'm up for a SBT government as long as Grendel (because he'd just shout until everyone had left the cabinet room) and Italia (because you'd come in to work one day and find out London is part of Qatar now) are nowhere near.

In all serious though when people with different ideologies work together thats when the best outcomes are usually achieved. Why we should be looking at proportional representation and decent coalition governments, hasn't worked too badly for Germany.

BREAKING..

A number of Arab countries including Saudi Arabia and Egypt have cut diplomatic ties with Qatar, accusing it of destabilising the region.

They say Qatar backs militant groups including so-called Islamic State (IS) and al-Qaeda, which Qatar denies.

TAKE THE WORLD CUP OFF THEM TOO..

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Then we will lock them up as well

The whack a mole style of policing doesn't work. You have to cut issues off at the source.

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

Captain Dart said:
BREAKING..

A number of Arab countries including Saudi Arabia and Egypt have cut diplomatic ties with Qatar, accusing it of destabilising the region.

They say Qatar backs militant groups including so-called Islamic State (IS) and al-Qaeda, which Qatar denies.

TAKE THE WORLD CUP OFF THEM TOO..

FIFA would be up for a tournament shared between ISIS and North Korea if the money was right.

fernandopartridge · Jun 5, 2017

Captain Dart said:
BREAKING..

A number of Arab countries including Saudi Arabia and Egypt have cut diplomatic ties with Qatar, accusing it of destabilising the region.

They say Qatar backs militant groups including so-called Islamic State (IS) and al-Qaeda, which Qatar denies.

TAKE THE WORLD CUP OFF THEM TOO..

Look over there, it isn't us honest.

shmmeee · Jun 5, 2017

SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Then we will lock them up as well

I wonder why no one has ever thought of this before. Give Israel a shout you can probably solve their terrorist problem as well.

Just out of interest, what do you think about that girl who called LBC the other week? Muslim girl talking about how she nearly self radicalised through watching Anjem Choudrey on YouTube. What started it all off was her getting angry about a Muslim guy being falsely imprisoned and she came across a Choudrey video that was talking about it. From there she got more exteme until she had a moment of clarity and stopped herself.

Firstly: when should she have been locked up?

Secondly: how many more terrorists do you think a wide scale Muslim internment program will create? Because that's what you are essentially suggesting, there's 3,000 people on the watch list that you want to lock up without trial (against British values and quite an extreme view, do you need to be on a list too? After all far right terror is also a threat)

shmmeee · Jun 5, 2017

fernandopartridge said:
Look over there, it isn't us honest.

Spot on.

SkyblueBazza · Jun 5, 2017

Liquid Gold said:
We rely on Canadian oil while we undertake a massive building program of renewable energy. Create jobs, reach all our climate commitments and stop funding wankers. What's not to like.

Can/will they be able to accommodate the demand? Oil isn't just oil either...like North Sea oil isn't particularly the right stuff to burn in cars apparently - something I heard years ago, not sure how accurate it is.

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SkyblueBazza · Jun 5, 2017

SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
One of the attackers was reported by someone who knew him and no action was taken.
He was worried he had been radicalised after a conversation where he justified the actions of another terrorist attack which had taken place.

So at least one of the attackers could have been stopped

That is just SO easy to say
A. with hindsight
B. when it's not your call

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SkyBlue_Bear83 · Jun 5, 2017

SkyblueBazza said:
That is just SO easy to say
A. with hindsight
B. when it's not your call

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To add to that

The attacker was filmed on a channel 4 documentary where he captured on camera unfurling an Isis flag in the middle of the park

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

SkyblueBazza said:
Can/will they be able to accommodate the demand? Oil isn't just oil either...like North Sea oil isn't particularly the right stuff to burn in cars apparently - something I heard years ago, not sure how accurate it is.

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List of countries by oil production - Wikipedia

SkyblueBazza · Jun 5, 2017

SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
To add to that

The attacker was filmed on a channel 4 documentary where he captured on camera unfurling an Isis flag in the middle of the park

But someone has to make a decision based on probably years of exerience as to whether they believe at the moment they are flagged up - "Does this person pose an immediate risk" because it could otherwise result in spending an awful lot of time tracking someone that it turns out was just playing to the gallery, being a bit of a lad, trying to be hard & all that. It isn't EVER a clear cut easy decision I would imagine in our society where human rights are so highly regarded & adhered to

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SkyBlue_Bear83 · Jun 5, 2017

SkyblueBazza said:
But someone has to make a decision based on probably years of exerience as to whether they believe at the moment they are flagged up - "Does this person pose an immediate risk" because it could otherwise result in spending an awful lot of time tracking someone that it turns out was just playing to the gallery, being a bit of a lad, trying to be hard & all that. It isn't EVER a clear cut easy decision I would imagine in our society where human rights are so highly regarded & adhered to

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Damn I thought being a lad/acting hard was buying a six pack of larger when you are 15 and drinking them down the park, or sitting at the back of the bus smoking a fag. Maybe smash the occasional bus shelter if you are feeling really edgy and had a few drinks.

Things must have changed, now if you want to be one of the lads you get an Isis flag and go down the local park, but don't worry it's all just harmless banter. Boys will be boys and all that

Macca · Jun 5, 2017

I can't help feeling that the future just involves regular attacks, a bit of a concert, a healthy dose of we deserve it really then rinse and repeat. Wish I could afford to decamp to a remote Scottish island for whatever time I have left

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

Macca said:
I can't help feeling that the future just involves regular attacks, a bit of a concert, a healthy dose of we deserve it really then rinse and repeat. Wish I could afford to decamp to a remote Scottish island for whatever time I have left

Preferably one with no internet.

Captain Dart · Jun 5, 2017

SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
To add to that

The attacker was filmed on a channel 4 documentary where he captured on camera unfurling an Isis flag in the middle of the park

Documentary in full, it is chilling.

Macca · Jun 5, 2017

Liquid Gold said:
Preferably one with no internet.

Yep happy with that, no social media no news just nature. Bliss

Captain Dart · Jun 5, 2017

More poor judgement by Jezza

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Jun 5, 2017

shmmeee said:
I wonder why no one has ever thought of this before. Give Israel a shout you can probably solve their terrorist problem as well.

Just out of interest, what do you think about that girl who called LBC the other week? Muslim girl talking about how she nearly self radicalised through watching Anjem Choudrey on YouTube. What started it all off was her getting angry about a Muslim guy being falsely imprisoned and she came across a Choudrey video that was talking about it. From there she got more exteme until she had a moment of clarity and stopped herself.

Firstly: when should she have been locked up?

Secondly: how many more terrorists do you think a wide scale Muslim internment program will create? Because that's what you are essentially suggesting, there's 3,000 people on the watch list that you want to lock up without trial (against British values and quite an extreme view, do you need to be on a list too? After all far right terror is also a threat)

Do you have the full interview so I can read/hear it? Without context if it became known she was supporting/justifying terrorist acts then would have been the time to act.

Secondly, you can't create killers if they don't want to kill. Perhaps it would be better for there true nature to be shown now and we can act rather than have closet murderers living among us in secret ready to snap at any moment.

It doesn't have to be no trial, we can have a trial if you want a trial. Is this person guilty of supporting and justifying terrorist acts. If yes, then they are guilty and should be locked up.

If I ever support and justify the mass murder of innocents you can put me on a list and I will turn myself in.

Liquid Gold · Jun 5, 2017

Captain Dart said:
More poor judgement by Jezza

Guido Fawkes! Ha!

chiefdave · Jun 5, 2017

Captain Dart said:
"Jihadi bastards living next door to you rent free in a council flat"

Is that the title of the documentary?

Macca · Jun 5, 2017

chiefdave said:
Is that the title of the documentary?

"And next on channel 4 the first of a 3 part series.......

Macca · Jun 5, 2017

Captain Dart said:
Documentary in full, it is chilling.

Pure observation here, but generally over history strength and aggression usually wins the day. As these guys numbers increase and ideology spreads you would have to say it is a huge threat. Violent, single minded, care not what people think of them, prepared to die for the cause. As proven with Islamic State, smaller numbers can make great gains with extreme militancy and shock violence. 20 years another generation of foot soldiers, who knows

Sky Blue Pete · Jun 5, 2017

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
No, I can think from the otherside. My point is that there are people that like to twist the knife in and infer that we deserve it, although never directly admit to it.

I have said countless times we need to withdraw from the middle east and cut ties with Saudi immediatey. I also think however, installing people into power who want to do away with our defences, MI5, and open the borders up even more need to check their own policies along with the criticism of others.

Not one person has suggested the innocent people murdered by these individuals deserves it

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