James Smith
Well-Known Member
I've got a list somewhere at home, I'll dig it out and tell you if you're that interested.
Time to put ACL anger to one side (12 Viewers)
- Thread starter skybluetony176
- Start date
I've got a list somewhere at home, I'll dig it out and tell you if you're that interested.
lewys33
Well-Known Member
Don't bother. He is a cnut
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
I really wish this was literally true.
Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu Shitsu.
James Smith
Well-Known Member
People/fund managers might take their money away from SISU investment funds, sounds like there already have been people doing just that according to this although we don't know the reasons for those withdrawals.
http://www.footballeconomy.com/content/sisu-owners-prosper
James Smith
Well-Known Member
No he's a fan with different views to yours.
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
And a lot of other things besides. He doesn't deserve any respect just because he's a CCFC fan the way he acts towards people.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
i dont know? i'm a good looking fella, if he didn't appreciate my humour he'd probably still like me.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
I'll dumb it down for you Rob
ACL gone Bye Bye, can no longer Hurt Hurt
Shitsu not gone Bye Bye, Still Hurt Hurt
lewys33
Well-Known Member
That I can live with. Constant bullshit and narrow-minded selective view points I can't.
RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
ACL gone bye, bye? Being quiet doesn't mean they have gone.
SISU own the club, they're not going anywhere, why's that so hard to understand? You also say SISU still hurting the club, however I can't see that there was a viable and realistic alternative to what we have?
lewys33
Well-Known Member
There was definitely a viable and realistic alternative. But we are where we are. Both are at fault bla bla. It is in the past now.
RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
Which was?
lewys33
Well-Known Member
Agreeing to the original 400k rent a year deal at the Ricoh.
RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
Okay and how does that help to a long term aim of owning our ground?
lewys33
Well-Known Member
1. Why do we need to own it?
2. Relationships with CCC and SISU would have been a lot better, so probably easier to negotiate a deal to buy the Ricoh.
3. Because Revenue would be a lot higher if we were still at the Ricoh. Do some simple maths yourself and you will soon realise paying £400k a year at the ricoh is better than paying (rumour) £150-£170k a year at Sixfields.
I told myself I wouldn't go back over this but here I am ............
RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
lewys33
Well-Known Member
I am not bothering with you on this anymore.
1. I said why do we NEED to own it. We do not. It helps. However we do not (and again I am putting emphasis on this) need to.
2. If what I said is a guess what is your answer?
3. What can I say? I think you have made yourself look silly on that one.
You have completely ignored your original statement and followed it up with bollocks relating to a situation we are in now, rather than what situation we were in a year ago. If you can't see what I am trying to say then fair enough. Let's leave it at that.
1. I said why do we NEED to own it. We do not. It helps. However we do not (and again I am putting emphasis on this) need to.
2. If what I said is a guess what is your answer?
3. What can I say? I think you have made yourself look silly on that one.
You have completely ignored your original statement and followed it up with bollocks relating to a situation we are in now, rather than what situation we were in a year ago. If you can't see what I am trying to say then fair enough. Let's leave it at that.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Sadly it seems you have a NEED to be as pedantic and annoying as possible
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Says the worlds most polite poster
covhead1
Well-Known Member
Says the forums biggest twat
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Do you think any of that has anything to do with CCFC?
RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
Relating to your first question I think the answer I have given is acceptable, if the revenue is greater into the club, then this can improve the team we put out on the pitch and help the club move forward, why do we need to own the stadium? If it's not obvious then you're looking in the wrong places.
Regarding to your opinion on my answer for your third question I have posed a very good reason as to why the deal at the Ricoh will not be accepted despite the figures you inserted into your arguement which from what I see are accurate. Yet my answer is deemed to make me look silly? It is obvious that you are not looking at all the facts when basing your thesis.
The only bollocks is the whole quote I have just quoted and the constant name calling of another poster, maybe it's not my place to say, but because you do not agree with another posters view you rever to name calling, it's a bit petty really I must say. Not everyone will agree with this poster but I think Grendel does bring up a lot of good points in his arguements as do others who constantly get tagged with silly names or downgraded.
If you don't agree with someone show a reasoned arguement, not belittle it does nothing to prove the thesis of your arguement.
Rant finished.
RoboCCFC90
Well-Known Member
Very mature.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
What a clever reposte. How long did it take you to think of that one - 24 hours. Pat yourself on the back and have a lie down.
lewys33
Well-Known Member
please tell me how that is being pedantic?
Well firstly, I am not arguing that if we own the stadium the revenue is greater. However the question I asked was WHY DO WE *NEED* TO OWN THE STADIUM? The answer is we don't. It helps. However we don't need to own it. If we got back to the Ricoh under a rent deal why would that be such a bad thing?
The answer to the 3rd question was, I regard, Silly - because you said there was no viable alternative to sixfields. I gave you a viable alternative, and the reply was based on our current situation. Not what we were originally talking about (which is what our situation was a year ago). Like I said my calculations were "simple" and did not take everything in to consideration. However, I still 100% believe with all facts sixfields makes no sense but to attempt to distress ACL. Even if you do use our current situation, and your argument:
"CCFC would be tied to a ten year rental agreement which would be damaging to break"
Again if you use simple maths and work it out, If ACL/CCC charged £1mill or even £2mill per season they broke the lease and didn't use the Ricoh, it will still come out at a higher revenue than that of sixfields. This to me is worst case scenario. I don't even think this would happen. But that is my opinion.
And name calling of Grendel?? HAHA. Please ........ You are correct in saying it is not your place to say. I tried to have reasonable debates with Grendel. However he seems unable to include himself in that. However he does like to do a bit of "name calling" himself. Grendel is a cnut. I am allowed my opinion. If he is free to name call and belittle people then so am I. Please feel free to look through his posts if you feel he is hard done by on here. I would quote a few but I don't give that much of a fcuk about Grendel to feel the need to prove anything when it comes to him.
torchomatic
Well-Known Member
I think renting is a bad thing as we will always be beholden to ACL. They will have a say in who owns us, etc. BTW, I think we need to be free of SISU and ACL.
As you said yourself, if we owned the stadium then we would have greater revenues. That's what we want for our club, isn't?
As you said yourself, if we owned the stadium then we would have greater revenues. That's what we want for our club, isn't?
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covhead1
Well-Known Member
like i said......
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Peppercorn rent to CCC, cut out ACL as they go out of business/are bought out, 150 year lease direct to club.
What's not to like about that?
lewys33
Well-Known Member
Of course I would love CCFC to own the stadium. But there is also no proof CCFC will own the Ricoh if we buy it, or this new stadium. When Fisher was asked that question at the fans forum he quickly diverted elsewhere. So for arguments sake if we do not own it, how are we better off? I still stand by my point that we do not need to own the stadium. Especially in the situation we are in, I would prefer to be renting at the ricoh than be at sixfields. Saying things like "there is no other viable solution" is just falling for the SISU propoganda bullshit. I also want rid of ACL and SISU. ACL's business structure with regards to the Ricoh is nearly as confusing as a certain mayfair hedge fund.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Given that you don't give a fcuk about me you seem to mention me an awful lot. I'm clearly superior so this subliminal adulation is understandable.
Out of interest do you have a curious form of dyslexia which only applies to swear words?
lewys33
Well-Known Member
Clearly you deserve an apology. I didn't realise you were superior. I am truly sorry.
With regards to dyslexia which only applies to swear words - (was your mistake above a typo? Or an attempt to mock me?) I am used to writing on other forums where swear words are blocked out.
So just to clarify - c**t would be **** . So to make you aware of what I am saying, it is easier to swap 2 letters around.
Now ....... I have been childish, so have you. Care to actually at least pretend to be superior and act like an adult? Perhaps offer an alternative to my opinion?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Very well.
Do the club need to own the bricks and mortar. Possibly not but they certainly need to own the management company. This is the key to access revenues which gives the club a competitive advantage. Given that the club has rarely exceeded 20,000 gates (other than early Ricoh years and ill come to that later) there is every argument that building a new ground holding 16 - 18,000 would be more beneficial as they will have access to all revenues. 3 years of losses over a lifetime would be a very small price to pay.
Relationships are subjective. The club pre sisu tried to change the rent structure. The fact the original structure was put in place tells as all we need to know about ACL and the councils relationship with the club. You give and we take.
Is paying £40ok better than £150k? Well I'm not sure. How much will the club lose this season? I suspect less than the years we were attracting record crowds at the Ricoh. Do the maths and calculate the debt we incurred with a squad that was very average by championship standard. Ask yourself this. Would we have lost such a collosal amount if those crowds were attending a ground owned by the parent company of the club who gained all revenues?
Truth is all the fault ultimately lied with the council. They created a mobster and we are all paying their price.
Dyslexia, illiteracy or is the Ricoh named after a Mafia hitman?
lewys33
Well-Known Member
I agree with some things. However, I don't think they do need to own the management company. Again, yes of course it helps, and the more the club owns the more revenue it will create for us. With regards to the gates, the Ricoh was built for a premiership team. Obviously that fell on its arse. So yes with regards to our league 1 level (even low end of championship) 16-18,000 would be more beneficial. IF WE OWN IT. 3 years of losses over a lifetime would be a small price to pay, however surely even you realise it is going to be more than 3 years now? Then you have to take in to account the fact you have lost fans over a 3-5 year period due to playing in Northampton, and also due to the fact that the new stadium will technically be outside of coventry. So really a stadium with 10,000 would suffice. Is that where we really want to be though?
There is no point arguing about the rent structure. We do not know the full ins and outs of the full rent structure over the years. Simply to me, ACL offered £400,000 and it was not accepted.
Paying £150,000 is obviously better than paying £400,000. However if you look at potential revenues from ticket sales at the Ricoh compared to sixfields then it is a different story. With regards to the debts incurred. Well SISU took over in 2007. So for arguments sake, lets include the rent paid for 2006/7 onwards. Excluding last year because they didn't pay. Which makes 6 years rent of £1.2 million. That makes £7.2 million. Now lost revenue will include everything else so F&B, concerts, hotel etc. No idea how I would go about working all that out but I would estimate what £10 million? Random figure I know but for argument sake that is £10 million revenue lost and £7.2 million paid in rent. £17.2 million they could have had themselves if they had owned the Ricoh. Hardly covers this £53 million or so debt JS has been talking about does it.
Truth is you are wrong. The fault lies with all parties involved. I do appreciate however that for once you have put something forward that I can actually debate against