The VLR (1 Viewer)

Frank Sidebottom

Well-Known Member

£12m to go a few hundred yards? What is the actual point in this?
It's a test/trial piece at the minute. It should eventually be extended to connect the train station to the university.

Eventually (probably 20 years time the way things are going) it should cover the below
unnamed (1).jpg

Also the council owns the patent on it i think, So they can flog it to other towns/city's.
 

Nick

Administrator
That all seems great but is it going to go on the road, same as the buses and cars or will it be like the trams in Nottingham where they have bits where it's dedicated for them?

Why is it better to get that as opposed to the number 20 bus to the Arena if it's still going the same route or is it to replace buses?
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
That all seems great but is it going to go on the road, same as the buses and cars or will it be like the trams in Nottingham where they have bits where it's dedicated for them?

Why is it better to get that as opposed to the number 20 bus to the Arena if it's still going the same route or is it to replace buses?
It'll all be on road
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
The theory is that in cities the size of Coventry there isn't the room for full sized trams and this is an alternative. The other big selling point is that because of the weight you can basically install the tracks into existing roads without having to re-route utilities thus saving a huge amount of money, time and avoiding having roads closed for months or years, plus you can easily lay track off road to cover routes buses can't take.

If it is successful the city owns the IP and can make money selling it to other cities, most likely via a private sector partner.

In terms of capacity it is claimed they will run so frequently that the total capacity will be well above conventional buses and be in line with traditional tram systems elsewhere.

People that know far more about this stuff than I do seem to think that when longer distances are involved this type of thing is a better option than buses and leads to more modal shift. Of course that very much depends on what system we end up with and how reliable it is. There does seem to be a fairly decent chance we've just reinvented the wheel and spent a lot of money on something nobody else is interested in.

There is, or at least was, another system being looked at for different routes in the city which from memory involved driverless buses but not heard anything about that in a while so that might have been quietly dropped. Think it was tied to Andy Street's travel plans than only seem to get any traction in Birmingham and Wolverhampton.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
It's a test/trial piece at the minute. It should eventually be extended to connect the train station to the university.

Eventually (probably 20 years time the way things are going) it should cover the below
View attachment 43500

Also the council owns the patent on it i think, So they can flog it to other towns/city's.
So that entire blue line is there just to stop at the Arena? Which already has a fucking train station next to it!
 

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
Another grandiose scheme to spend public money (taxes) while the existing road network falls into disrepair. 🤭

What's the betting in 10 years they have completed only one of those loops.
 

Nick

Administrator
The theory is that in cities the size of Coventry there isn't the room for full sized trams and this is an alternative. The other big selling point is that because of the weight you can basically install the tracks into existing roads without having to re-route utilities thus saving a huge amount of money, time and avoiding having roads closed for months or years, plus you can easily lay track off road to cover routes buses can't take.

If it is successful the city owns the IP and can make money selling it to other cities, most likely via a private sector partner.

In terms of capacity it is claimed they will run so frequently that the total capacity will be well above conventional buses and be in line with traditional tram systems elsewhere.

People that know far more about this stuff than I do seem to think that when longer distances are involved this type of thing is a better option than buses and leads to more modal shift. Of course that very much depends on what system we end up with and how reliable it is. There does seem to be a fairly decent chance we've just reinvented the wheel and spent a lot of money on something nobody else is interested in.

There is, or at least was, another system being looked at for different routes in the city which from memory involved driverless buses but not heard anything about that in a while so that might have been quietly dropped. Think it was tied to Andy Street's travel plans than only seem to get any traction in Birmingham and Wolverhampton.

If it's going on the road, why not just use the bus? I get that these are driverless but the main thing about getting the tram in Nottingham for example is that it goes "off road" and cuts the travel time.

If you are putting this on Ansty Road to get out to Walsgrave Hospital then what's the actual benefit?

£12m that they have quoted to get from the Station to Puma Way (which is literally a stones throw) is madness, how much will it cost to get out to the hospital?
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
If it's going on the road, why not just use the bus? I get that these are driverless but the main thing about getting the tram in Nottingham for example is that it goes "off road" and cuts the travel time.

If you are putting this on Ansty Road to get out to Walsgrave Hospital then what's the actual benefit?

£12m that they have quoted to get from the Station to Puma Way (which is literally a stones throw) is madness, how much will it cost to get out to the hospital?
An arm and a leg
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
If it's going on the road, why not just use the bus? I get that these are driverless but the main thing about getting the tram in Nottingham for example is that it goes "off road" and cuts the travel time.

If you are putting this on Ansty Road to get out to Walsgrave Hospital then what's the actual benefit?

£12m that they have quoted to get from the Station to Puma Way (which is literally a stones throw) is madness, how much will it cost to get out to the hospital?
Guess you can use the why not a bus for any tram system. If we ever get the full thing assume they will be dedicated tram lanes. The argument is they will have much greater frequency than you will get with a bus. Its designed to be a 'turn up and go' service where you don't need to check a time table because you know there will be one within a couple of minutes of you turning up at a stop

The price may seem high but its a fraction of the price of a tram system. Although with the Midlands tram system planned to extend to extend to HS2 at Acorn Cross is does seem that we're being left out of a system that covers Birmingham, Solihull and Wolverhampton. Although I've got issues with how that is routed as well. Why the fuck does it terminate near Five Ways rather than going to Edgbaston Stadium?

Personally I'd see more benefit in extending from Acorn Cross, take that on a route that goes Warwick Uni, Hospital, CBS, City Centre. But for some reason it seems Birmingham and Wolverhampton are getting money thrown at them and we aren't
 

Nick

Administrator
Guess you can use the why not a bus for any tram system. If we ever get the full thing assume they will be dedicated tram lanes. The argument is they will have much greater frequency than you will get with a bus. Its designed to be a 'turn up and go' service where you don't need to check a time table because you know there will be one within a couple of minutes of you turning up at a stop

The price may seem high but its a fraction of the price of a tram system. Although with the Midlands tram system planned to extend to extend to HS2 at Acorn Cross is does seem that we're being left out of a system that covers Birmingham, Solihull and Wolverhampton. Although I've got issues with how that is routed as well. Why the fuck does it terminate near Five Ways rather than going to Edgbaston Stadium?

Personally I'd see more benefit in extending from Acorn Cross, take that on a route that goes Warwick Uni, Hospital, CBS, City Centre. But for some reason it seems Birmingham and Wolverhampton are getting money thrown at them and we aren't

The benefit of trams in Nottingham is that they don't just stick to the road and have dedicated tracks so they can blast down them.

Where exactly is there going to be a tram lane on some of the roads? Will they be replacing the dedicated cycle lanes with them?

The theory of it sounds good that something will turn up every 5 minutes and it will get you across the city, but when put into practice, it's not really going to work like that when it's stuck on the Ansty Road.
 

mmttww

Well-Known Member
The theory of it sounds good that something will turn up every 5 minutes and it will get you across the city, but when put into practice, it's not really going to work like that when it's stuck on the Ansty Road.

This is it. If you stick them down a buslane or on parts of a road with two lanes on at least one side, sorted. Hoping they can find land to keep some of it off roads. I want it to work, just need to see how they'll actually execute it before getting excited about it.
 

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
But the "intellectual property" is owned by CCC, so if we all just used the bus, how are our council members going to get their back handers?
How much has the council paid to buy this intellectual property and if it was a moneyspinner why would the company that developed it sell?

I am sensing that the council might just have made a bad deal here.🤔
 

fatso

Well-Known Member
How much has the council paid to buy this intellectual property and if it was a moneyspinner why would the company that developed it sell?

I am sensing that the council might just have made a bad deal here.🤔
Yeah seems strange, are they using council tax payers money on this, while cutting services at the same time? It would be interesting to know how this came about.
 

Nuskyblue

Well-Known Member
The theory is that in cities the size of Coventry there isn't the room for full sized trams and this is an alternative. The other big selling point is that because of the weight you can basically install the tracks into existing roads without having to re-route utilities thus saving a huge amount of money, time and avoiding having roads closed for months or years, plus you can easily lay track off road to cover routes buses can't take.

If it is successful the city owns the IP and can make money selling it to other cities, most likely via a private sector partner.

In terms of capacity it is claimed they will run so frequently that the total capacity will be well above conventional buses and be in line with traditional tram systems elsewhere.

People that know far more about this stuff than I do seem to think that when longer distances are involved this type of thing is a better option than buses and leads to more modal shift. Of course that very much depends on what system we end up with and how reliable it is. There does seem to be a fairly decent chance we've just reinvented the wheel and spent a lot of money on something nobody else is interested in.

There is, or at least was, another system being looked at for different routes in the city which from memory involved driverless buses but not heard anything about that in a while so that might have been quietly dropped. Think it was tied to Andy Street's travel plans than only seem to get any traction in Birmingham and Wolverhampton.
Do it and do it well and I think it'll work.

It'll inevitably be half arsed and shite like everything else in this country.

I really like the idea of being able to get to and from the game on one off these things.
 

Nick

Administrator
Do it and do it well and I think it'll work.

It'll inevitably be half arsed and shite like everything else in this country.

I really like the idea of being able to get to and from the game on one off these things.
Surely no different to just getting on a shuttle bus from the station?
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
The theory is that in cities the size of Coventry there isn't the room for full sized trams and this is an alternative. The other big selling point is that because of the weight you can basically install the tracks into existing roads without having to re-route utilities thus saving a huge amount of money, time and avoiding having roads closed for months or years, plus you can easily lay track off road to cover routes buses can't take.

If it is successful the city owns the IP and can make money selling it to other cities, most likely via a private sector partner.

In terms of capacity it is claimed they will run so frequently that the total capacity will be well above conventional buses and be in line with traditional tram systems elsewhere.

People that know far more about this stuff than I do seem to think that when longer distances are involved this type of thing is a better option than buses and leads to more modal shift. Of course that very much depends on what system we end up with and how reliable it is. There does seem to be a fairly decent chance we've just reinvented the wheel and spent a lot of money on something nobody else is interested in.

There is, or at least was, another system being looked at for different routes in the city which from memory involved driverless buses but not heard anything about that in a while so that might have been quietly dropped. Think it was tied to Andy Street's travel plans than only seem to get any traction in Birmingham and Wolverhampton.

Don’t think it’s about the room, more the cost. Harder to justify the cost for less dense areas like Cov. I mean it’s not, trams clearly pay for themselves wherever they’re built, but the treasury gonna treasury.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Dependant on where it's electricity comes from .
I just don't know what's wrong with hydrogen buses tbf which I think we may have a fleet of oh to be in a European City.

Hydrogen is a terrible fuel really. Loads of electricity to make, hard to store securely, needs a massive infrastructure about. The only upside is refuelling time and with recent battery tech that’s not even much of an advantage.

Impressive PR though that’s seemingly convinced a lot of people.
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
Hydrogen is a terrible fuel really. Loads of electricity to make, hard to store securely, needs a massive infrastructure about. The only upside is refuelling time and with recent battery tech that’s not even much of an advantage.

Impressive PR though that’s seemingly convinced a lot of people.
Goes anywhere.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Goes anywhere.

Hydrogen? Not for long. Can’t be stored in metal and needs to be kept at 10,000 PSI and it’s massively flammable. It’s a terrible fuel for general use. The only reason it’s talked about is people get deranged when you say electric car.
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
Well it seems to have uses, there on about domestic use aren't they, there's other ways of production as well aren't there?
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Well it seems to have uses, there on about domestic use aren't they, there's other ways of production as well aren't there?

Green hydrogen is supposed to be a thing. But it’s a solution looking for a problem. Within ten years battery tech will have charging at similar rates, at which point it’s a question of do we use the grid we have or build an entirely new hydrogen system out.
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
Well doesn't cost have any impact there?
What's going to happen to the price of electricity, it's not free and becoming less so in fact I think they're set up home charging to inflate the price which has already happened I think and into the future.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top