Grendel
Well-Known Member
All businesses will want the deal and it will be a choice of take it leave without it or stay against the referendum result
Doesn't it seem quite obvious that May is just trying to delay and delay the vote in the knowledge that she knows so many MP's are against the no deal option and therefore more likely to have to choose her deal?
Surely MP's are not so daft as to let her do that are they?
Seemingly a lot of her own party are calling for a vote this week
Is that you saying it’s good tactics?All businesses will want the deal and it will be a choice of take it leave without it or stay against the referendum result
The other angle could be that if Corbyn and labour do decide to support a second referendum then surely all these conservatives who have just demonstrated the right to change their mind must back a second referendum or will twice look like hypocrites having juxtaposed their position twice if they don’t back one.
Love my Guinness as long as it is kept properly. And I have the added bonus of never getting hangovers. My sister is the same. I put it down to only having one braincell. Nothing to collide in my head.I can go weeks without drinking these days but can still drink Guinness like it’s water, I just pay for it the next day.
If it is a vote on May being fit for purpose she will win. If it is a vote on the Tory government I think the DUP will want to cling onto power. What is the chance of them having any say if there is another GE whatever the result?With their 10 MPs?
It’s not too far fetched for Labour to get a few Tory MPs on side, especially with Theresa May seemingly refusing to even consider a second referendum. But, any vote of no confidence should be held off until after the vote on May’s deal. The threat of a Labour government may just rally Tory MPs behind their leader and potentially increase support for her deal to.
That is what it is. A dream. But it is becoming a nightmare all over the EU. They are now dictating finances to countries. And it isn't going down well. Italy has been the first large economy to get it. And now it looks like France could get it next year after giving in to the people of France. There is a good chance they will miss their targets. If the EU comes down hard on Italy they will have to do the same with France. But if they don't they will lose the power over the countries in the EU.This was what I meant
I think she is stalling for as long as she can until the leave date. Then it will be take her deal or leave without a deal.Yep it’s outrageous to delay the vote when nothing will change. They are just waiting a month for no reason. Justine Greening saying just that on tv
there are so many ways this can go it's incredible.
I still wouldn't rule out May adding staying in the customs union to her deal to get support in the Labour ranks.
That is what it is. A dream. But it is becoming a nightmare all over the EU. They are now dictating finances to countries. And it isn't going down well. Italy has been the first large economy to get it. And now it looks like France could get it next year after giving in to the people of France. There is a good chance they will miss their targets. If the EU comes down hard on Italy they will have to do the same with France. But if they don't they will lose the power over the countries in the EU.
This could go either way.
That is what it is. A dream. But it is becoming a nightmare all over the EU. They are now dictating finances to countries. And it isn't going down well. Italy has been the first large economy to get it. And now it looks like France could get it next year after giving in to the people of France. There is a good chance they will miss their targets. If the EU comes down hard on Italy they will have to do the same with France. But if they don't they will lose the power over the countries in the EU.
This could go either way.
The EU doesn’t have power over countries, the countries are the EU. The Union is a group of countries sharing power. As parties do in our parliament. It is a rule based agreement to share powers. Some sovereignty is given up in order to be part of a rule based group. Not all sovereignty is given up, and in the worst case countries can jettison themselves into the unknown. They are sovereign states. The majority see sharing sovereignty as the sensible option.
So Italy can set its own budget then?
Finally a BIG admission in Mart's comment!!!So Italy can set its own budget then?
I think that’s fairThat is what it is. A dream. But it is becoming a nightmare all over the EU. They are now dictating finances to countries. And it isn't going down well. Italy has been the first large economy to get it. And now it looks like France could get it next year after giving in to the people of France. There is a good chance they will miss their targets. If the EU comes down hard on Italy they will have to do the same with France. But if they don't they will lose the power over the countries in the EU.
This could go either way.
Finally a BIG admission in Mart's comment!!!
"Not all sovereignty is given up"...some has been. The future EU "dream" is to gradually erode all sovereign power...but somebody somewhere will call the shots. Wonder if he will go on to admit who that will be???
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
I think that’s fair
All of us is the dream but I take the cynicism and distrust of someone not British doing it. All power corrupts someone once saidFinally a BIG admission in Mart's comment!!!
"Not all sovereignty is given up"...some has been. The future EU "dream" is to gradually erode all sovereign power...but somebody somewhere will call the shots. Wonder if he will go on to admit who that will be???
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Sorry the comments were fair on my principled stand as to why I’m for remaining. It’s a dream a desire a human journey towards a better future for all and astute put the alternativeHardly. To agree to a set of rules, say you are going to break them unilaterally and when the other partners says you cannot unilaterally break the rules of the agreement, then say that the people unpholding the rules you signed up to are dictating to you, is madness. Try that form of negotiating when the bank manager complains that you have exceeded your overdraft limit. How dare he complain the little dictator, I will overdraw the limit if I want to, I am a free man!
No thenIf it keeps to the rules it agreed, of course it can.
If it is a vote on May being fit for purpose she will win. If it is a vote on the Tory government I think the DUP will want to cling onto power. What is the chance of them having any say if there is another GE whatever the result?
Couldn't resist. Had to look at what story you were coming out with this time.If it keeps to the rules it agreed, of course it can.
Let it go for now.It isn't about them clinging to power, it is about ensuring an IRA supporter does not become PM.
Corbyn will be 73 near as damn it by the time of the next scheduled election, I can't see him remaining Labour leader that long.
I completely agree that we need to follow the rules and agree how to leave to get the maximum benefit for our country and I don’t expect the Eu to do anything differentHardly. To agree to a set of rules, say you are going to break them unilaterally and when the other partners says you cannot unilaterally break the rules of the agreement, then say that the people unpholding the rules you signed up to are dictating to you, is madness. Try that form of negotiating when the bank manager complains that you have exceeded your overdraft limit. How dare he complain the little dictator, I will overdraw the limit if I want to, I am a free man!
It isn't about them clinging to power, it is about ensuring an IRA supporter does not become PM.
I would love the EU project to work.All of us is the dream but I take the cynicism and distrust of someone not British doing it. All power corrupts someone once said
But we are not allowed to leave in any way that will benefit us.I completely agree that we need to follow the rules and agree how to leave to get the maximum benefit for our country and I don’t expect the Eu to do anything different
Apart from ours...It is unlikely that all vetoes will be given up in the foreseeable future.
But we are not allowed to leave in any way that will benefit us.
We didn't vote to join the EU. It became the EU. We had no choice. Now we have taken the choice to leave they are putting things in place to stop us from leaving. That is what the backstop looks all about. If we accept the backstop we agree to staying in the EU until they say we can leave. If they never give us permission to leave we have no choice but to stay in the EU.
...apart from the hardcore Brexiteer MPs, who will not support their own government's deal to leave...no one is stopping us.
...apart from the hardcore Brexiteer MPs, who will not support their own government's deal to leave...
I would love it to work tooI would love the EU project to work.
The problem is that the leaders of the countries of the EU don't have enough of a say in matters. These decisions are made by a bunch of mainly nobodies that earn much more money than the leaders of such said countries. They are on a gravy train and want to keep their seat. They don't care about the citizens of the EU. They care about themselves. They don't seem to want harmony. They want what is best for them.
Just like when we wanted to talk about what our membership entails. We got a straight no. How about it going to the leaders of the countries in the EU? We put all the money in but can only discuss what we are told we can.
We can but we are hugely naive to think that 27 other countries are not going to do the sameBut we are not allowed to leave in any way that will benefit us.
We didn't vote to join the EU. It became the EU. We had no choice. Now we have taken the choice to leave they are putting things in place to stop us from leaving. That is what the backstop looks all about. If we accept the backstop we agree to staying in the EU until they say we can leave. If they never give us permission to leave we have no choice but to stay in the EU.
I would love the EU project to work.
The problem is that the leaders of the countries of the EU don't have enough of a say in matters. These decisions are made by a bunch of mainly nobodies that earn much more money than the leaders of such said countries. They are on a gravy train and want to keep their seat. They don't care about the citizens of the EU. They care about themselves. They don't seem to want harmony. They want what is best for them.
Just like when we wanted to talk about what our membership entails. We got a straight no. How about it going to the leaders of the countries in the EU? We put all the money in but can only discuss what we are told we can.
It’s a remain deal that’s why
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?