The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (7 Viewers)

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
No many votes remain due to fear not support of the Eu. Martcov is like a religious extremist and the Eu is the Koran. His tub thumping evangelical nonsense would be despised by the vast majority of uk citizens.

Bollocks. I have said all the time that we should stay in the largest trading block in the world as opposed to following the advice of dodgy politicians and millionaires. What is there to despise about that? The EU has more benefits than disadvantages... as we are about to find out. The leavers are the ones wanting us to leave a trading bloc and go it alone in the belief good things will happen. That is faith based like a religion.

And Reich means Empire as in the Roman Empire and the Holy Roman Empire or Kaiserreich, the Empire created by Bismarck for Kaiser Wilhem. But, you know that.... even if you get the empires mixed up.

Sick Boy · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
No many votes remain due to fear not support of the Eu. Martcov is like a religious extremist and the Eu is the Koran. His tub thumping evangelical nonsense would be despised by the vast majority of uk citizens.

If anything the referendum has turned largely apathetic remain voters into some of the most pro-EU citizens in the union. Likewise the Leave campaign has done the opposite on the other side. Pre 2016 for the majority the EU would have been low down their list of priorities for the country.

To claim people voted remain due to fear is absurd.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

Z

martcov said:
Bollocks. I have said all the time that we should stay in the largest trading block in the world as opposed to following the advice of dodgy politicians and millionaires. What is there to despise about that? The EU has more benefits than disadvantages... as we are about to find out. The leavers are the ones wanting us to leave a trading bloc and go it alone in the belief good things will happen. That is faith based like a religion.

And Reich means Empire as in the Roman Empire and the Holy Roman Empire or Kaiserreich, the Empire created by Bismarck for Kaiser Wilhem. But, you know that.... even if you get the empires mixed up.

Well you haven’t. For a start you’ve supported an extremely dubious and dodgy billionaire who has trampled over countries by currency speculation to increase wealth. You support the ideology of this very unsavoury individual purely as he bangs the Eu Koran like you.

You have not just banged on about a trading block but also held the Brussels parliament as a democratic institution that is in fact more democratic than sovereign states. You’ve also spread ludicrous EU diatribe about peace preservation.

An empire is a Dominian power that exerts authority over others not directly in its control by the way.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
If anything the referendum has turned largely apathetic remain voters into some of the most pro-EU citizens in the union. Likewise the Leave campaign has done the opposite on the other side. Pre 2016 for the majority the EU would have been low down their list of priorities for the country.

To claim people voted remain due to fear is absurd.

So no remain voter was not influenced by the £9 million government leaflet of fear? Really?

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
Z

Well you haven’t. For a start you’ve supported an extremely dubious and dodgy billionaire who has trampled over countries by currency speculation to increase wealth. You support the ideology of this very unsavoury individual purely as he bangs the Eu Koran like you.

You have not just banged on about a trading block but also held the Brussels parliament as a democratic institution that is in fact more democratic than sovereign states. You’ve also spread ludicrous EU diatribe about peace preservation.

An empire is a Dominian power that exerts authority over others not directly in its control by the way.

Soros only came into it as a conspiracy theory figure brought in by someone else.

Some aspects of Brussels are more democratic than FPTP, the House of Lords and the monarchy. Again brought into the discussion by other people.

An Empire has an emporer, and governors for it‘s provinces. It doesn’t have article 50. no wonder you get confused.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

martcov said:
Soros only came into it as a conspiracy theory figure brought in by someone else.

Some aspects of Brussels are more democratic than FPTP, the House of Lords and the monarchy. Again brought into the discussion by other people.

An Empire has an emporer, and governors for it‘s provinces. It doesn’t have article 50. no wonder you get confused.

What do you think of the German publication Der Spiegel?

Sick Boy · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
So no remain voter was not influenced by the £9 million government leaflet of fear? Really?

What do you think about the Leave Leaflet of Fear? Claiming Turkey was on the verge of joining and millions of Turks would be heading for the UK? Oh, and of course Syria lightly shaded just to increase fears that little bit more.

I noticed you went from people voted to remain due to fear to speculating that some voters voted due to fear, BTW.

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
So no remain voter was not influenced by the £9 million government leaflet of fear? Really?

Let’s say the leaflet backfired - which has been concluded - and get on to the benefits of Brexit which we will get on day 1.

What are the tangible benefits ( no pie in the sky please)?

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
What do you think of the German publication Der Spiegel?

Respectable.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
What do you think about the Leave Leaflet of Fear? Claiming Turkey was on the verge of joining and millions of Turks would be heading for the UK? Oh, and of course Syria lightly shaded just to increase fears that little bit more.

I noticed you went from people voted to remain due to fear to speculating that some voters voted due to fear, BTW.

The leave leaflet didn’t cost £9 million. Do you think the leave leaflet influenced any voters - yes or no?

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

martcov said:
Respectable.

Did it in 2015 present an argument that the EU is an economic fourth Reich?

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
Did it in 2015 present an argument that the EU is an economic fourth Reich?

I have no idea. It says many things and puts across points of view. At the moment it is discussing the options of Steve Bannon and his aim to unite far right parties with contradictory programs.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
What do you think about the Leave Leaflet of Fear? Claiming Turkey was on the verge of joining and millions of Turks would be heading for the UK? Oh, and of course Syria lightly shaded just to increase fears that little bit more.

I noticed you went from people voted to remain due to fear to speculating that some voters voted due to fear, BTW.

With respect you are answering a question with a question. Do you think a leaflet going to every home in the country would have influenced some voters - answer then I will respond to your point.

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
The leave leaflet didn’t cost £9 million. Do you think the leave leaflet influenced any voters - yes or no?

It was an information leaflet outlining government policy and published before the campaign „purdah“.

Anyway.... where are the benefits we can expect on day 1? Convince me how good Brexit is.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

martcov said:
I have no idea. It says many things and puts across points of view. At the moment it is discussing the options of Steve Bannon and his aim to unite far right parties with contradictory programs.

Yes Steve Bannon. How many people do you think in the uk would even know who he is? Are there a lot of German media articles that talk about Steve Bannon and his Brexit influences? Do you read these articles?

Sick Boy · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
The leave leaflet didn’t cost £9 million. Do you think the leave leaflet influenced any voters - yes or no?

Yes I'm sure both influenced votes. That's a long way from your original claim though.

However, as I said, there's always been those in the UK who are pro-EU. Your original claim about people wanting to remain because of fear was wide of the mark, which I'm sure you know.

Sick Boy · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
Yes Steve Bannon. How many people do you think in the uk would even know who he is? Are there a lot of German media articles that talk about Steve Bannon and his Brexit influences? Do you read these articles?

Most people in the UK interested in the current affairs will know who he is.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

martcov said:
It was an information leaflet outlining government policy and published before the campaign „purdah“.

Anyway.... where are the benefits we can expect on day 1? Convince me how good Brexit is.

See you are st it again. We would respect you more if you acknowledge it was a pack of lies and misinformation but again you reek out a politicians line

Lies and misleading information in HM Government leaflet on the EU referendum | Spirit Body Soul

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
Yes I'm sure both influenced votes. That's a long way from your original claim though.

However, as I said, there's always been those in the UK who are pro-EU. Your original claim about people wanting to remain because of fear was wide of the mark, which I'm sure you know.

I’m convinced if the uncertainty did not exist 70% would have wanted out.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
Most people in the UK interested in the current affairs will know who he is.

Have you done some research on him and Brexit and see where most of the hits occur - is it the uk or German media do you think?

Do you think Steve Bannon has more influence than £9 million of taxpayers money in a pro remain leaflet sent to every home?

Did Steve access every home? He never knocked on my door - you?

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
See you are st it again. We would respect you more if you acknowledge it was a pack of lies and misinformation but again you reek out a politicians line

Lies and misleading information in HM Government leaflet on the EU referendum | Spirit Body Soul

No. That article is a vote leave crib sheet and not a neutral appraisal. It doesn’t interest me as much as the benefits of leaving which become apparent on Brexit Day 1. please go ahead...

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

martcov said:
No. That article is a vote leave crib sheet and not a neutral appraisal. It doesn’t interest me as much as the benefits of leaving which become apparent on Brexit Day 1. please go ahead...

Are you saying the £9 million was a neutral appraisal. Good. Can we start a separate thread and go through every point? Can we do that and I’ll argue non neutrality and let’s see who comes out in top?

So 1 day is more important than the next three of four generations. Why are you diverting?

Shall I share done German media articles regarding Steve Bannon that sound word for word what you - someone not influenced by the media - says?

You are struggling.

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
Yes Steve Bannon. How many people do you think in the uk would even know who he is? Are there a lot of German media articles that talk about Steve Bannon and his Brexit influences? Do you read these articles?

He has been on Channel 4, LBC and I think BBC. He was here with his organisation trying to Organise pro Trump activities. He is traveling all around Europe drumming up support for his far right organisation which he is starting with funds from his US backers. He is Farage‘s big buddy and they support each other. According to the SPIEGEL he and Soros have been described as the most influential figures in the EU future. You will here more about Steve Bannon, but his target is Europe and the reforming of the EU into a 4. Reich of right wing states all following Trumpist policies. You’ll like him.

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
Are you saying the £9 million was a neutral appraisal. Good. Can we start a separate thread and go through every point? Can we do that and I’ll argue non neutrality and let’s see who comes out in top?

So 1 day is more important than the next three of four generations. Why are you diverting?

Shall I share done German media articles regarding Steve Bannon that sound word for word what you - someone not influenced by the media - says?

You are struggling.

No, I am not struggling, I want you to list the benefits... and if you cannot, admit that we are in for at least a short term hit. You appear to be struggling... again

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

martcov said:
He has been on Channel 4, LBC and I think BBC. He was here with his organisation trying to Organise pro Trump activities. He is traveling all around Europe drumming up support for his far right organisation which he is starting with funds from his US backers. He is Farage‘s big buddy and they support each other. According to the SPIEGEL he and Soros have been described as the most influential figures in the EU future. You will here more about Steve Bannon, but his target is Europe and the reforming of the EU into a 4. Reich of right wing states all following Trumpist policies. You’ll like him.

So your views are heavily influenced by the media - yes?

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
Are you saying the £9 million was a neutral appraisal. Good. Can we start a separate thread and go through every point? Can we do that and I’ll argue non neutrality and let’s see who comes out in top?

So 1 day is more important than the next three of four generations. Why are you diverting?

Shall I share done German media articles regarding Steve Bannon that sound word for word what you - someone not influenced by the media - says?

You are struggling.

I said the bollocks you posted was not a neutral appraisal. Nor was the government’s statement of their justification for wanting people to vote remain. It was legat and it is generally thought to have backfired anyway. The difference is that leave broke the law significantly. The government didn’t- apart from in your article which doesn’t explain why they didn’t get prosecuted.

Sick Boy · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
Have you done some research on him and Brexit and see where most of the hits occur - is it the uk or German media do you think?

Do you think Steve Bannon has more influence than £9 million of taxpayers money in a pro remain leaflet sent to every home?

Did Steve access every home? He never knocked on my door - you?

It's 2018 - social media advertising is going to have much greater effect upon those who are undecided. I'm sure he has had connections to those funding some of those campaigns

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

martcov said:
No, I am not struggling, I want you to list the benefits... and if you cannot, admit that we are in for at least a short term hit. You appear to be struggling... again

On day 1 there will be no difference. What’s going to change on March 20?

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
So your views are heavily influenced by the media - yes?

No, or at least it is impossible to gauge as I read various sources and don’t sit and watch conspiracy theories in a dark corner of my house.

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
On day 1 there will be no difference. What’s going to change on March 20?

Probably chaos, but if no great benefits are in sight, what is the point of the debacle? Rees Mogg thinks we will be enjoying the benefits in 50 years. I am 63 and my daughter is 18. How do you sell Brexit to people like us?

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
It's 2018 - social media advertising is going to have much greater effect upon those who are undecided. I'm sure he has had connections to those funding some of those campaigns

Can you provide evidence?

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
It's 2018 - social media advertising is going to have much greater effect upon those who are undecided. I'm sure he has had connections to those funding some of those campaigns

He is backed by wealthy hedge funds and highly regarded for his use of social media - he grounded the firms Trump used.

Sick Boy · Jul 25, 2018

Grendel said:
Can you provide evidence?

I'm basing it on a feeling like your 70%.

I do produce FB Ads myself for clients and can tell you it's very very effective.

martcov · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
I'm basing it on a feeling like your 70%.

I do produce FB Ads myself for clients and can tell you it's very very effective.

You can bet your bottom dollar that Bannon knows the value of information from social media that you have given these companies. He says that is the price for using the free services. I watched him say that.

Grendel · Jul 25, 2018

Sick Boy said:
I'm basing it on a feeling like your 70%.

I do produce FB Ads myself for clients and can tell you it's very very effective.

I agree - what age group is influenced the most?

The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (7 Viewers)

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