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The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (9 Viewers)

  • Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
  • Start date Jun 8, 2016
Forums New posts

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%
  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed Jun 15, 2016.
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Evo1883

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,741
Irrespective of the paper and its background... This is what will happen

'Never vote Corbyn!' Even mining town Castleford switching Tory in fury at Brexit betrayal
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,742
Astute said:
Most constituencies in England voted leave. Remain was mainly London and the south. Mainly Tory areas. The polls have all shown more willing to vote Tory since BJ took over and Corbyn went against everything. This doesn't look good for Labour. If it wasn't true Bliar wouldn't have been advising against going for a GE and Corbyn would have taken the chance.
Click to expand...
How confident can we be on the reliability of polling given the mess they've made of predicting recent votes?

There's a strong sense of deja vu here. May called an election as Corbyn was going to cause a collapse in the Labour vote and look at the mess that caused.

I know its only one person but my Mum, now in her 70s, is the archetypal believes everything she reads in the Daily Mail Conservative voter. She always votes and has always voted Conservative. She intends to vote Labour this time as, in her words, the Conservatives can't be trusted.
 
G

Grappa

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,743

Interesting...
 
Reactions: Ian1779 and Sick Boy

RegTheDonk

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,744
Ian1779 said:
A harder proposition, but I think the Lib Dem’s have lost a bit of momentum with Swinson taking too long to ‘join’ the rebel alliance. Plus there is a very real prospect she will lose her seat.

Commitment to a PV may bring some back because of the domestic policy offer.
Click to expand...
I hope she has a mauling and loses her seat Ian - this woman and her party are the most undemocratic Lib Democrats I can remember. Despite saying they would honor the ref, they now tout "bollocks to brexit" and openly say they want to reverse the deomcratic vote. At least they are up front about putting two fingers up to the elecorate.

She was on 5Live this morning going on about there's no mandate for a no deal. Agreed - but there's certainly no mandate for a complete 180 Jo.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,745
I thought John Redwood was dead until I saw him the other night on TV
 
Reactions: Sick Boy

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,746
skybluetony176 said:
Just had a thought. Us remoamers can no longer claim that the leave campaign was all bullshit. We have took back control and Parliaments sovereignty has been protected. Just like they promised. I mean it was against their will but fairs fair, it’s no longer all bullshit.
Click to expand...

They haven’t took control as they are refusing to allow the Brexit government to leave office.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,747
RegTheDonk said:
but there's certainly no mandate for a complete 180 Jo.
Click to expand...

I think you’re confusing manifesto for mandate. She’s seeking a mandate through her manifesto. Not nearly the same thing.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,748
Grendel said:
They haven’t took control as they are refusing to allow the Brexit government to leave office.
Click to expand...

That’s the very definition of Parliament taking back control. As per the wishes of leavers apparently. Today should be a celebration for you, two of Boris’ promises have been delivered. Not by him but still. Stop acting like you’re at a funeral.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,749
Evo1883 said:
Mind you I suppose remainers treat for acting in total distain for their fellow countrymen and women for 3 years will be they get to have a majority parliament made up of centre to far right politicians for the next few years.... Enjoy

You've worked hard for it
Click to expand...
It already is
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,750
Evo1883 said:
Guy fawkes had the right idea
Click to expand...
This is sovereignty friend
 
Reactions: skybluetony176, Deleted member 5849, Sick Boy and 2 others

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,751
chiefdave said:
How confident can we be on the reliability of polling given the mess they've made of predicting recent votes?

There's a strong sense of deja vu here. May called an election as Corbyn was going to cause a collapse in the Labour vote and look at the mess that caused.

I know its only one person but my Mum, now in her 70s, is the archetypal believes everything she reads in the Daily Mail Conservative voter. She always votes and has always voted Conservative. She intends to vote Labour this time as, in her words, the Conservatives can't be trusted.
Click to expand...
It is more than just the polls though. Labour strongholds voted for Brexit. The Labour party is trying to stop Brexit happening.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,752
Oh brother where art thou

PM's brother quits as Tory MP and minister
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,753
Astute said:
It is more than just the polls though. Labour strongholds voted for Brexit. The Labour party is trying to stop Brexit happening.
Click to expand...

The Labour Party is trying to stop a no deal brexit happening. Stick to the facts please like you claim you always do.
 
Reactions: Sick Boy, stupot07, djr8369 and 1 other person

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,754
skybluetony176 said:
The Labour Party is trying to stop a no deal brexit happening. Stick to the facts please like you claim you always do.
Click to expand...

No it isn’t it’s trying to stop it altogether
 
Reactions: RegTheDonk

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,755
Astute said:
So if I liked a post which included saying that BJ is doing an amazing job what would you say?

And if you know that May didn't do an amazing job why didn't you comment about it?
Click to expand...

In that case you’ve full on endorsed the very pro leave posts that I quoted the other day.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,756
skybluetony176 said:
The Labour Party is trying to stop a no deal brexit happening. Stick to the facts please like you claim you always do.
Click to expand...
Most MP's are trying to stop Brexit from happening. But most don't have the bottle to come out with it outright. All they do is vote everything down unless it delays Brexit. And this is MP's from all sides other than the so called Brexit party.

The difference between Labour and the Tories is one has a leader saying he wants to take us out.

Then you have this from the other one. And yes it contradicts what you say. But who has said it?

Europe needs to change... but I am voting to stay: Corbyn's full speech on the EU - LabourList
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,757
Sick Boy said:
In that case you’ve full on endorsed the very pro leave posts that I quoted the other day.
Click to expand...
In what way is that?

You liked a post saying May did an amazing job. But you always wait looking for a post from me where you can twist my words.

So as I asked you what would you say if I liked a post saying BJ is doing an amazing job?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,758
The Labour Party stance is ridiculous. It’s to negotiate a better deal then have a referendum and recommend remain in that referendum

There’s clearly a lot of effort going to be made in that negotiation
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,759
Grendel said:
The Labour Party stance is ridiculous. It’s to negotiate a better deal then have a referendum and recommend remain in that referendum

There’s clearly a lot of effort going to be made in that negotiation
Click to expand...
It's called planning for eventualities, if the subsequent referendum result is leave then there is a deal in place.
 
Reactions: Sick Boy

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,760
fernandopartridge said:
It's called planning for eventualities, if the subsequent referendum result is leave then there is a deal in place.
Click to expand...

On the Andrew Neil show last night the labour guy was saying they’d recommend staying so in other words the deal they will negotiate will be one to get a remain vote

In the end at least the election now will be a straight choice between the two camps
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,761
Grendel said:
No it isn’t it’s trying to stop it altogether
Click to expand...

Wipe your tears. The people that fronted the Trojan horse Brexit campaigns that promised an orderly withdrawal from the EU while clearly secretly wanted a no deal disorderly withdrawal have exposed themselves for the charlatans they are. Labour’s policy is to deliver what was campaigned for. Grow up and deal with it.
 
Reactions: djr8369

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,762
Grendel said:
The Labour Party stance is ridiculous. It’s to negotiate a better deal then have a referendum and recommend remain in that referendum

There’s clearly a lot of effort going to be made in that negotiation
Click to expand...

How do you think Boris’ negotiations are going? They’re working very hard on it apparently and the could show (former) Party members and standing MP’s the details but they won’t.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,763
skybluetony176 said:
Wipe your tears. The people that fronted the Trojan horse Brexit campaigns that promised an orderly withdrawal from the EU while clearly secretly wanted a no deal disorderly withdrawal have exposed themselves for the charlatans they are. Labour’s policy is to deliver what was campaigned for. Grow up and deal with it.
Click to expand...

Er I want a general election Tony so the people can make a choice. Labours policy is to betray the voters in the northern cities and remain
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,764
skybluetony176 said:
How do you think Boris’ negotiations are going? They’re working very hard on it apparently and the could show (former) Party members and standing MP’s the details but they won’t.
Click to expand...

Again Tony let’s see what the people think in a general election
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,765
Grendel said:
Er I want a general election Tony so the people can make a choice. Labours policy is to betray the voters in the northern cities and remain
Click to expand...

These northern cities all voted remain: Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, York
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,766
fernandopartridge said:
These northern cities all voted remain: Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, York
Click to expand...

The majority of northern labour held constituencies did not
 
Reactions: RegTheDonk

RegTheDonk

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,767
skybluetony176 said:
I think you’re confusing manifesto for mandate. She’s seeking a mandate through her manifesto. Not nearly the same thing.
Click to expand...
lol...fair enough, I know the difference but perhaps haven't worded my thoughts correctly. I'm saying "mandate" because they are using it so much to justify their actions. If the terminology is incorrect, I'll appreciate your putting me right while I try to get across these couple of points:

They have "bollocks to brexit" as their slogan. Luciana Berger has jumped ship to her party today, saying they are "the strongest party to stop brexit". So clearly they have nailed their colours to the mast.

They will vote against no deal (or any deal) because they want to stop Brexit, and use "no mandate" as a reason.

However...

IF there was a vote to scrap Brexit tomorrow - would they vote against it, as clearly there is "no mandate" to stop Brexit.

That's why this is so frustrating - they bang on about "no madate" because it suits them - but ignore the actual result.
 
Reactions: skybluetony176

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,768
Grendel said:
The majority of northern labour held constituencies did not
Click to expand...

Make your mind up
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,769
I think leavers need to consider their original motives for voting leave when voting in a snap general election. Should it happen.

If you voted leave hoping for the so so called clean break, WTO, hard brexit or whatever you want to call it then fair enough you have a straight choice between the Brexit Party and Boris’ New Conservative party.

If you voted leave expecting the campaigned for orderly withdrawal promised but have since changed your mind and would now prefer a clean break etc. Brexit, it’s your right to change your mind as much as the next leaver or remainer and again you have a straight choice between the Brexit Party and New Conservatives.

If you voted leave expecting the campaigned for orderly withdrawal promised and still expect the orderly withdrawal promised then you have some soul searching to do. If you haven’t changed your mind I can’t see how you can vote anyone but labour as they’re clearly the only party still offering what both the official and unofficial leave campaigns campaigned for.
 
Reactions: stupot07

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,770
Grendel said:
Again Tony let’s see what the people think in a general election
Click to expand...

If Boris truly wants to put it to the people then he needs to either get serious about his negotiations and show his hand to the negotiators and put forward this fabled proposal that he could show them but won’t and agree a deal with them, or come clean, say it’s a hard brexit or remain and then put either to a non advisory legally binding referendum. It’s so easy he won’t do it. He’s trying to con a hard brexit and shame on you for supporting him in that con.
 

SIR ERNIE

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,771
skybluetony176 said:
Wipe your tears.
Click to expand...

hahahaha I just love your gloating triumphalism of the last couple of days.

Let's see who's crying in a few months time.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,772
SIR ERNIE said:
hahahaha I just love your gloating triumphalism of the last couple of days.

Let's see who's crying in a few months time.
Click to expand...

This week has been a magnificent week for democracy and it’s also happened on the terms of the leave campaign. The reality is we should all be winners this week regardless of what you voted in the referendum, there shouldn’t be an opportunity for gloating from either remainers or leavers but when some leavers start using words like betrayal and acting like they’re at a funeral then they invite gloating in my opinion.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,773
fernandopartridge said:
These northern cities all voted remain: Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, York
Click to expand...

Many constituencies exist in each city

How did different constituencies vote in the 2016 EU referendum?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,774
skybluetony176 said:
I think leavers need to consider their original motives for voting leave when voting in a snap general election. Should it happen.

If you voted leave hoping for the so so called clean break, WTO, hard brexit or whatever you want to call it then fair enough you have a straight choice between the Brexit Party and Boris’ New Conservative party.

If you voted leave expecting the campaigned for orderly withdrawal promised but have since changed your mind and would now prefer a clean break etc. Brexit, it’s your right to change your mind as much as the next leaver or remainer and again you have a straight choice between the Brexit Party and New Conservatives.

If you voted leave expecting the campaigned for orderly withdrawal promised and still expect the orderly withdrawal promised then you have some soul searching to do. If you haven’t changed your mind I can’t see how you can vote anyone but labour as they’re clearly the only party still offering what both the official and unofficial leave campaigns campaigned for.
Click to expand...

Labour want to remain Tony that is their policy
 
D

djr8369

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 5, 2019
  • #40,775
SIR ERNIE said:
hahahaha I just love your gloating triumphalism of the last couple of days.

Let's see who's crying in a few months time.
Click to expand...

To be fair remainers have faced language like this constantly for three years. You can hardly now criticise it when it’s semi-ironically thrown back.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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