Tactics (Jones) (1 Viewer)

Rory83 · Nov 17, 2016

Think the general consensus is that Jones is too one footed to play on the wing and his end product is...lacking. I know there was a lot of hype around him from before he even broke into the daggers side, but I genuinely believe he can be a very good player for us for a long time but we'll need to adapt our tactics to incorporate him properly.

Surely he could offer more as a central attacking mid, especially as he is what you would class a luxury player. There he can pull the strings behind either a number nine or two forwards and just concentrate on creating space and running at the defence.

I'd hate to see him moved out of the club, a solid right sided midfielder who can get a cross in and a striker who can niggle defences and get his head on things.

ccfcway · Nov 17, 2016

crazy idea, I know, but go with this.......

play the left footed winger on the left wing ?

COVKIDSNEVERQUIT · Nov 17, 2016

Rory83 said:
Think the general consensus is that Jones is too one footed to play on the wing and his end product is...lacking. I know there was a lot of hype around him from before he even broke into the daggers side, but I genuinely believe he can be a very good player for us for a long time but we'll need to adapt our tactics to incorporate him properly.

Surely he could offer more as a central attacking mid, especially as he is what you would class a luxury player. There he can pull the strings behind either a number nine or two forwards and just concentrate on creating space and running at the defence.

I'd hate to see him moved out of the club, a solid right sided midfielder who can get a cross in and a striker who can niggle defences and get his head on things.

A central midfielder has to deliver the killer pass , I don't think Jones has it in him . well not yet . :wacky:

Astute · Nov 18, 2016

Rory83 said:
but I genuinely believe he can be a very good player for us for a long time

Trying to work out what has the better chance of happening. Him turning out to be a very good player or us keeping a very good player.

Rory83 · Nov 18, 2016

I'm not sure he is effective enough on either wing at the moment and needs to build his confidence and experience of regular competitive action. Playing just behind a striker might suit him, also the manager would have to commit to going with Sordell in the middle to stick Jones on the left. Sordell should definitely be playing central, will Venus do it? Depends on what occurs in January.

There is an argument to be had that Haynes could play the left wing, with Page behind him. It's the right side that we need to deal with, which is probably why Venus is sticking Jones out there. We haven't got enough options.

Hobo · Nov 18, 2016

ccfcway said:
crazy idea, I know, but go with this.......

play the left footed winger on the left wing ?

The other crazy idea is playing a left footer on the right wing as they can cut inside onto their stronger shooting foot, whilst attacking the defenders weaker side (in theory). Absolute bonkers I know.

mrtrench · Nov 18, 2016

I'd like to see him given a chance in goal.

ceetee · Nov 18, 2016

He did play a more central role for a time in one game, possibly Northampton in cup but can't remember. As I recall he did OK

ccfchoi87 · Nov 18, 2016

Hobo said:
The other crazy idea is playing a left footer on the right wing as they can cut inside onto their stronger shooting foot, whilst attacking the defenders weaker side (in theory). Absolute bonkers I know.

And then running into 3 other opposition players as after the first time they know exactly why he is going to do

skyblueeyesrevisited · Nov 18, 2016

He cannot or will not shoot so why do we deploy him to cut inside? Give him a go on the left with the brief to get in as many crosses as he can. Sordell will do the rest.

stupot07 · Nov 18, 2016

No, its far too congested in the centre and you have the same issue that he's always going to veer to the left. An attacking central midfielder more than any needs to be able to go either way.

It all depends on how the manager wants us to play, if the aim is to get crosses into the box, then early crosses are always best so he should play on the left -the problem here is the other 2 wingers (Reid and Lamieres) are also left footed.

I'm not against playing inverted wingers, but they have to play with variety to be effective otherwise they become predictable and easy to defend - Murphy is a prime example of this, liked to cut on on his right foot to get a shot in, but equally happy to use his pace to get around thr outside and try and cross with his left foot. Even Lamieres, will go either, ditto Reid.

So regardless of where he plays he need to develop his weaker foot (this is probably symptomatic of being spotted late by D&R and not having the benefit of going through a decent academy) and his decision making and final ball. Hr is still very young, and as fans we're being unfair to him by expecting him to be a world beater. He wasnt even a regular starter for D&R last season, often coming off thr bench. He needs time, it might take 2-3 seasons for him to develop.

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Malaka · Nov 18, 2016

He is far too raw, no end product, I would ship him out on loan in January

ccfcway · Nov 18, 2016

Hobo said:
The other crazy idea is playing a left footer on the right wing as they can cut inside onto their stronger shooting foot, whilst attacking the defenders weaker side (in theory). Absolute bonkers I know.

all that happens is defenders show him inside and he runs into the Central midfielders.

On the left,. he would either be in a one on one race with his marker, or teams would have to double up on him, freeing up space elsewhere. Personally I think he is wasted on the right wing.

covcity4life · Nov 18, 2016

ccfcway said:
crazy idea, I know, but go with this.......

play the left footed winger on the left wing ?

hes a player who likes to cut in like hazard,cuadrado and robben etc. his positioj isnt the problem, he just needs to improve on his game at realise when to pass and when to shoot etc

shelby76 · Nov 18, 2016

I would rather play dev kelly evans on the left and spence on right or vice versa even bilal sayoud and george thomas on wing they have more technical ability than jones even long john silver can use both feet better than him. Thats why when the 30 scouts watched him they all walked away.

covcity4life · Nov 18, 2016

shelby76 said:
I would rather play dev kelly evans on the left and spence on right or vice versa even bilal sayoud and george thomas on wing they have more technical ability than jones even long john silver can use both feet better than him. Thats why when the 30 scouts watched him they all walked away.

hmmmmmm

Greggs · Nov 18, 2016

Jones is useless, my dog would do a better job, he's faster and never gives the ball away, and being a Pug he is obviously stronger!

NortonSkyBlue · Nov 18, 2016

Someone once said management is easy, pick your best eleven available and play to their strengths. It seems to me that too often we are ruining, yes ruining players in the UK by asking players to go against their strengths and do a job for the team.
IMO that is poor management as it it weakens the player, the team and the management in the long run. There are players who are versatile like James Milner but at our level they are few and far between.
Let Jones and all the players fit their talents in to the team, not the other way round. If he is good enough he will flourish but play him out of his position and he offers little and becomes very ineffective as we have seen. That goes for other players too, why waste our best striker as a winger?
Square pegs round holes.

Irish Sky Blue · Nov 18, 2016

Hobo said:
The other crazy idea is playing a left footer on the right wing as they can cut inside onto their stronger shooting foot, whilst attacking the defenders weaker side (in theory). Absolute bonkers I know.

David Thompson?

Grendel · Nov 18, 2016

Hobo said:
The other crazy idea is playing a left footer on the right wing as they can cut inside onto their stronger shooting foot, whilst attacking the defenders weaker side (in theory). Absolute bonkers I know.

Wasn't Tommy Hurchison naturally right footed but always insisted on playing on the left wing? I may be wrong - it's a long time ago.

Irish Sky Blue · Nov 18, 2016

Grendel said:
Wasn't Tommy Hurchison naturally right footed but always insisted on playing on the left wing? I may be wrong - it's a long time ago.

I thought he played with both feet, certainly seemed comfortable on both wings although played more on the left.

Rory83 · Nov 18, 2016

riyadhskyblue said:
Someone once said management is easy, pick your best eleven available and play to their strengths. It seems to me that too often we are ruining, yes ruining players in the UK by asking players to go against their strengths and do a job for the team.
IMO that is poor management as it it weakens the player, the team and the management in the long run. There are players who are versatile like James Milner but at our level they are few and far between.
Let Jones and all the players fit their talents in to the team, not the other way round. If he is good enough he will flourish but play him out of his position and he offers little and becomes very ineffective as we have seen. That goes for other players too, why waste our best striker as a winger?
Square pegs round holes.

I make you right. I think that happened to Joe Cole at Chelsea, I mean he still went on to have a good career but he never reached the heights his talent promised at West Ham. I think it's midfielders who suffer the most for this and it's been said that we have a habit of coaching the skills and natural flair out of our prospects.

He might make a good winger one day, I'd just prefer to give him licence to operate behind a striker and create. Maybe a loan wouldn't be a terrible idea and see how he develops.

letsallsingtogether · Nov 18, 2016

I think he is overrated.
Be better at leftback.

Left back in the changing room.

Johnnythespider · Nov 18, 2016

I think we should wire him up to a big battery and every time he cuts inside give him a shock. That should sort him out.

harvey098 · Nov 19, 2016

ccfcway said:
crazy idea, I know, but go with this.......

play the left footed winger on the left wing ?

Have you watched Mahrez play, ever?

Skybluefaz · Nov 19, 2016

harvey098 said:
Have you watched Mahrez play, ever?

Yeah, but Jones is not an elite player like Mahrez. He's a kid in league one, we need to keep things simple.

theferret · Nov 19, 2016

I said after the Pompey game, when he tore them to pieces second half, that within 10 games people would turn on him. It took a bit longer than that, but it is starting to happen.

He is the sort of player City fans don't take to. We had the same sort of conversations last season about Murphy and Kent. People trotting out the 'no end product' bollocks.

He has only just turned 19. He is clearly raw, but has also shown on a few occasions that he has the ability to turn a game on its head. Wycombe the other week being an example.

He'll has a big future in the game, but sadly it probably won't be here.

I'd also try him on the left.

ccfcway · Nov 19, 2016

He's a young lad and deserve some time. hes a ccfc player and we have invested in him. I'd rather have him on the left than wright who can jog off back to WBA

Hobo · Nov 19, 2016

Grendel said:
Wasn't Tommy Hurchison naturally right footed but always insisted on playing on the left wing? I may be wrong - it's a long time ago.

Not sure on that, you could be right. But it is not uncommon.

harvey098 · Nov 20, 2016

Skybluefaz said:
Yeah, but Jones is not an elite player like Mahrez. He's a kid in league one, we need to keep things simple.

The theory is the same though, why do you think left footed players should play on the left hand side? What is the benefit? A left footed cross from the right hand side is far more dangerous because it is in-swinging and already heading in the direction of the goal.

Do you think all corners from the left should be taken by left footed players too?

westofrayne · Nov 20, 2016

ccfcway said:
crazy idea, I know, but go with this.......

play the left footed winger on the left wing ?

My god mate, I think you might be onto something here

stupot07 · Nov 20, 2016

harvey098 said:
The theory is the same though, why do you think left footed players should play on the left hand side? What is the benefit? A left footed cross from the right hand side is far more dangerous because it is in-swinging and already heading in the direction of the goal.

Do you think all corners from the left should be taken by left footed players too?

You're comparing 2 completely different things. No ones saying you shouldn't play wingers on the opposite wings, but if they do they have to be able to go either way, if they cut in 100% of their time because they cant use their other foot means they become far too easy to defend against. Jones with his pace would be far more effective playing on the left where he can use his pace to get round the outside and get a decent early cross in. In open play these are usually more effective as they are early, meaning strikers are usually still on the move and defenders haven't managed go get back and are often still facing their own goal. If you're always cutting back to curl cross in, often strikers will have already made the run and are then left static and defenders have gotten back in position and facing away from goal. This is competely different from a corner in which everyone is pretty much static and its a planned routine.

A lot depends on how you want to play football and score goals, sir Alex Ferguson best sides always had a right footer on the right and a left footer on the left. Get the crosses in early or hit the byline the strikers and midfield runners knew the ball would be delivered.

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Skybluefaz · Nov 20, 2016

harvey098 said:
The theory is the same though, why do you think left footed players should play on the left hand side? What is the benefit? A left footed cross from the right hand side is far more dangerous because it is in-swinging and already heading in the direction of the goal.

Do you think all corners from the left should be taken by left footed players too?

Basically everything that Stupot said echoed my thoughts. You are right that the theory is the same. However the players aren't good enough to carry out the theory. Same as TM's 3 at the back at the start of the season. It's like telling our front 3 to go out and play like MSN. Simply not going to happen.

harvey098 · Nov 20, 2016

I hear you but we don't have the players in the box to warrent putting the crosses into. Which is why Jones always cuts inside and tries to play more intricately. Reid when playing down the left will often whip an early cross in and on the small occasion he actually delivers a decent cross, we don't compete, it's pointless for our personnel upfront.

Nick · Nov 24, 2016

4waspsting said:
they dont become better as time goes by

Seriously?

Tactics (Jones) (1 Viewer)

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