Spot on. Nothing to hide so nothing to worry about.It is being reported that the Home Secretary has given increased Section 60 powers to a number of police forces (including West Mids) where knife crime is seemingly spiralling out of control.
Is it because i am a white, middle-aged, middle-class male who has never been in trouble with the law that i have the view that an officer of constabulary should be able to require someone to turn out their pockets without getting a court order?
OK, "reasonable cause" i accept, but isn't it now "reasonable" (by the legal definition) to believe that at least some members of groups of teenagers (no matter what their racial mix) will be carrying some sort of weapon? If you're a teenager on the street, late at night, you are quite likely to be involved in some form of criminality.
It's not just in the USA where zero tolerance approaches such as that in New York have been successful - it has worked in Scotland (particularly Glasgow) too.
Am i just naive?
Spot on. Nothing to hide so nothing to worry about.
Pete, I could understand the issues the black community had with it in the 80s, when the police, and particularly the Met were well-documented as being institutionally racist, but that is SURELY not the case in this day and age? I accept the unconscious bias argument to some extent, but this can't be allowed to undermine the whole of society.
It is being reported that the Home Secretary has given increased Section 60 powers to a number of police forces (including West Mids) where knife crime is seemingly spiralling out of control.
Is it because i am a white, middle-aged, middle-class male who has never been in trouble with the law that i have the view that an officer of constabulary should be able to require someone to turn out their pockets without getting a court order?
OK, "reasonable cause" i accept, but isn't it now "reasonable" (by the legal definition) to believe that at least some members of groups of teenagers (no matter what their racial mix) will be carrying some sort of weapon? If you're a teenager on the street, late at night, you are quite likely to be involved in some form of criminality.
It's not just in the USA where zero tolerance approaches such as that in New York have been successful - it has worked in Scotland (particularly Glasgow) too.
Am i just naive?
Throwing money at something won’t sort it. Look at the NHS. It has to be put in the right place. As for targeting people. Again look where the biggest problem is and target it. If it’s black on black knife attacks in London then target it. If it’s white lads in Coventry then target them. No point in trying to appease different think tanks and the like while kids are dying every week.No let’s just fund more police officers to physically be present
Yep I think I’d prefer that. I don’t have a problem with selective stop and searchNo let’s just fund more police officers to physically be present
Throwing money at something won’t sort it. Look at the NHS. It has to be put in the right place. As for targeting people. Again look where the biggest problem is and target it. If it’s black on black knife attacks in London then target it. If it’s white lads in Coventry then target them. No point in trying to appease different think tanks and the like while kids are dying every week.
Stop and frisk as it was known in New York is no longer legal.<snip<
It's not just in the USA where zero tolerance approaches such as that in New York have been successful - it has worked in Scotland (particularly Glasgow) too.
<snip>
Until of course it is disproportionately one ethnicity getting searched. We know in the USA that’s what happens and that the same ethnic group is prosecuted disproportionately for the same offence despite carrying out the crime at similar rates.
What are the crime rates there?
I'm sure I heard something like 44% of murders are carried out by black Americans, which make up 18% of the population.
As for stop and search, crack on. If you're innocent you'll be on your way.
You will also know that drug use rates are similar but black Americans are prosecuted much more often. Wonder why.
You will also know that drug use rates are similar but black Americans are prosecuted much more often. Wonder why.
Throwing money at something won’t sort it. Look at the NHS. It has to be put in the right place. As for targeting people. Again look where the biggest problem is and target it. If it’s black on black knife attacks in London then target it. If it’s white lads in Coventry then target them. No point in trying to appease different think tanks and the like while kids are dying every week.
Murder is a bit worse isn't it?
Surely if a specific demographic was factually proven to be overrepresentitive in the figures, it would only be common sense that these stop and searches would be more valid, wouldn't it?
If someone hasn't done anything wrong, being stopped and then proving that shouldn't be a problem. If it makes society safer then they can crack on and search me whenever.
If someone has something to hide however...
If I was I'd be happier about it happening knowing that my son was out and about. I'm sure a lot of Black kids parents are happy enough with it too knowing the current scale of knife crime amongst young black lads especially in London.I don’t think you would be saying this if your skin colour was the determining factor in being searched. I would have less of a problem with targeting problematic areas more often
I agree to an extent about funding, money is spent badly in all public services, and throwing money at it doesn't necessarily help, but there is a need for more investment. The fact that police can now not proactively prevent crime is due to budget cuts, and we only just have enough officers to respond to 999 calls.
The whole public sector needs a complete overhaul.
Teachers are asking for exercise books not Ferraris. Go into any Coventry state school and it will be crying out for proper investment. Ran out of exercise books in mine around January last year
No issue with it at all. Crack on.
Where did i mention schools?
In any case go back and read the post and i said investment is needed, but eastwoods is right, throwing money at it isn't the solution. Look at the headteacher of Ashlawn school, was being paid in excess of 200,000... how stupid is that when as you say kids can't even get textbooks.
NHS, pay £10 for a ruler that is only £1 in £land but because of regulations can only get them off designated suppliers.
Police, instead of opening up recruitment (until recently tbf) they have been paying some officers 61k in overtime, that's 3 new police officers wages.
Yes investment is needed but smarter spending is also needed.
Where did i mention schools?
In any case go back and read the post and i said investment is needed, but eastwoods is right, throwing money at it isn't the solution. Look at the headteacher of Ashlawn school, was being paid in excess of 200,000... how stupid is that when as you say kids can't even get textbooks.
NHS, pay £10 for a ruler that is only £1 in £land but because of regulations can only get them off designated suppliers.
Police, instead of opening up recruitment (until recently tbf) they have been paying some officers 61k in overtime, that's 3 new police officers wages.
Yes investment is needed but smarter spending is also needed.
"The whole public sector needs an overhaul", you said.
But all of the points you make here are spot on.
You said the whole public sector. Yes there is some wasted spending on salaries of those at the top but it isn’t enough to fill the hole. I was at one Coventry school that stood to lose nearly £1 million off its budget because of changes to the funding formula. This is also a school where classroom ceilings fell in.
Class sizes are getting higher and teachers are getting fewer. Would like to see them start by giving teachers a fair pay rise then taking action to keep us in the profession.
Again see above. The whole public sector needs a complete overhaul
That doesn't just mean money. That is everything.
I have never said there is a lack of funding, in fact go back to the first post i said investment was needed, but the idea of throwing more money at it isn't the solution.
We have seen money thrown at public services and it is often wasted. Why would they be trusted with more money before they can sort out the current wastage? It needs to be a balance of checking the books to see where there is wastage and diverting funds to areas that are needed.
Just saying I need the resources to do my job.
My mums been a headteacher for a decade. And a teacher however many years before that. Im well aware of the issues around funding. However, headteachers with a bit of creativity can make it work.
Further to this, there are much greater concerns to teaching/education than funding.
I think one of the key factors on education failing is down to the fact that the head of education in the government has no background in education and so has no way of understanding teaching.
Another factor in a failing education system (high turnover of teachers) is teachers aren't teachers for the want of being a teacher most teachers in my experience have fallen into it as a second option.
Many other factors as I'm sure you are aware
Further to this, there are much greater concerns to teaching/education than funding.
I think one of the key factors on education failing is down to the fact that the head of education in the government has no background in education and so has no way of understanding teaching.
Another factor in a failing education system (high turnover of teachers) is teachers aren't teachers for the want of being a teacher most teachers in my experience have fallen into it as a second option.
Many other factors as I'm sure you are aware
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?