SISU court papers analysis tomorrows Cov Telegraph (1 Viewer)

Jack Griffin · Apr 30, 2013

As seen on twitter..

Les Reid ‏@Lesreidpolitics 37m

The #CCFC High Court papers against Coventry council & what they reveal - More from me in a feature in 2m's @covtelegraph

skybluericoh · Apr 30, 2013

It will say 'SISU take CCC to the courts over illegal use of public funds'. Then someone can come on here and say 'Lazy journalism'.

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

They may well show much more than that. I'm hearing Council have questions to answer.

rupert_bear · Apr 30, 2013

inside track said:
They may well show much more than that. I'm hearing Council have questions to answer.

From where ? Be specific

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

Can't say too much. Could land the person who told me in big trouble, but papers apparently show Council could lose court case. Don't expect new owners.

Bluegloucester · Apr 30, 2013

inside track said:
Can't say too much. Could land the person who told me in big trouble, but papers apparently show Council could lose court case. Don't expect new owners.

Bullshit!.........

bigfatronssba · Apr 30, 2013

inside track said:
Can't say too much. Could land the person who told me in big trouble, but papers apparently show Council could lose court case. Don't expect new owners.

I fail to see how this court case affects whether we get new owners or not. The two things are unrelated.

Bluegloucester · Apr 30, 2013

bigfatronssba said:
I fail to see how this court case affects whether we get new owners or not. The two things are unrelated.

So totally right.

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

Totally related if court case puts Sisu and Council back in talks to seek settlement, as I'm led to believe it does.

Bluegloucester · Apr 30, 2013

inside track said:
Totally related if court case puts Sisu and Council back in talks to seek settlement, as I'm led to believe it does.

You are being misled. The 2 matters are unrelated.

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

You may be right, but I'm pretty sure you're not.

bigfatronssba · Apr 30, 2013

inside track said:
Totally related if court case puts Sisu and Council back in talks to seek settlement, as I'm led to believe it does.

How exactly? The court ruling against the council would not change the fact that CCFC Ltd are in administration, that a rental agreement exists between ACL and CCFC Ltd, and that Sisu are no longer in control of CCFC Ltd.

ACL cannot negotiate with CCFC Holdings while it has an agreement with CCFC Ltd.

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

Forget ACL. This is now about Sisu and the Council reaching a deal. If they do, exit from admin would follow, CCFC continues to play at Ricoh and all other issues wrapped up.

Bluegloucester · Apr 30, 2013

inside track said:
You may be right, but I'm pretty sure you're not.

I know I'm right, have seen the submission and it does not rely on many, if any facts. Also the applicant cannot show any link to the agreement apart from trying to distress ACL.

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

Precisely.

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

We will see.

Chipfat · Apr 30, 2013

Sisu were trying to take the loan to force ACL to pay higher rates of interest and take them out of business,, while they scrambled to secure the money council stepped in and took the loan over..That is what will come out tomorrow, so Sisu got beat to the punch and are now crying. The council will prove that helping ACL was not unlawful it was protecting the cities income by saving a business that has brought more outside investment and interest than any other facility the city has..

So if Sisu are stating its wrong to use taxpayers money im sure the council will prove they are safeguarding the cities future and is was more about the city than football club...

dongonzalos · Apr 30, 2013

We tried to destroy ACL by not paying them a legal debt. Hoping to break them. We strung them along by entering into lots of detailed prolonged negotiations. In the pretence that we might buy half of ACL or that we might accept a lower rent. By having the negotiations it continuously side tracked ACL from taking legal action. Whilst we waited for them to fall into administration then we were going to buy them on the cheap.
Coventry City Council have ruined it all by buying the loan and allowing ACL to pay it back at a cheaper rate so they could offer us even cheaper rent.
We think this is disgraceful behaviour and ask you to consider if we can moan about it at a higher level please?

(Just my opinion of course)

bigfatronssba · Apr 30, 2013

inside track said:
Forget ACL. This is now about Sisu and the Council reaching a deal. If they do, exit from admin would follow, CCFC continues to play at Ricoh and all other issues wrapped up.

If we're talking about rent deals then we can't forget about ACL, the Council has no legal authority to negotiate rent.

If your saying that the Council are looking at selling their share of ACL then that is feesable. However, Sisu have shown that they are strongly opposed to Councils using public funds to support local businesses, therefore Sisu would be looking at paying full market value for the stadium?

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

More to it than that. Council involvement from an early stage open to question.

wingy · Apr 30, 2013

bigfatronssba said:
If we're talking about rent deals then we can't forget about ACL, the Council has no legal authority to negotiate rent.

If your saying that the Council are looking at selling their share of ACL then that is feesable. However, Sisu have shown that they are strongly opposed to Councils using public funds to support local businesses, therefore Sisu would be looking at paying full market value for the stadium?

Almost as clever as what they are trying.

torchomatic · Apr 30, 2013

Don't forget the spat Les Reid had with Kevin Maton on Twitter. Maton was cagey about where the £14M came from and whether other Councillors were aware of the deal. More to this than meets the eye.

Bluegloucester · Apr 30, 2013

torchomatic said:
Don't forget the spat Les Reid had with Kevin Maton on Twitter. Maton was cagey about where the £14M came from and whether other Councillors were aware of the deal. More to this than meets the eye.

The whole council voted in favour of the deal!

SkyblueBazza · Apr 30, 2013

Plus...if the loan is illegal, it might be feasible that CCFC Ltd could sue CCC/ACL for unfair practices...which led to them being put into administration - that could run to something like £40m perhaps...oh & then there are the damages for soiled reputation...& losing out in the hunt for promotion...could run to £100m by the time they have finished.
You couldn't make it up...
PUSB

duffer · Apr 30, 2013

Erm... just to be clear, the Council haven't actually got to court yet. These papers (which are public record, so no great secrets to get sacked over) relate to an application for judicial review - only if that application is successful will there be a case to answer. Even then, what if it goes all of the way through, and SISU win the case - what then?

The remedy to resolve this 'injustice' would most likely to be that ACL have to obtain finance from elsewhere - that doesn't mean that SISU necessarily get to buy the debt. It also doesn't mean that the Council lose any money (other than in legal fees to defend the case).

And this doesn't directly influence the Administration issue either, other than perhaps muddying the water for prospective purchasers. There's nothing in this to stop the Higgs company from selling their 50% share to a new owner, at least as far as I can see. Happy to be corrected though...

torchomatic · Apr 30, 2013

Like I said. Go and read the exchanges. Very interesting. Maton was squirming like a fish on a hook.

Bluegloucester said:
The whole council voted in favour of the deal!

rupert_bear · Apr 30, 2013

Is the judicial review tomorrow ?

wingy · Apr 30, 2013

SkyblueBazza said:
Plus...if the loan is illegal, it might be feasible that CCFC Ltd could sue CCC/ACL for unfair practices...which led to them being put into administration - that could run to something like £40m perhaps...oh & then there are the damages for soiled reputation...& losing out in the hunt for promotion...could run to £100m by the time they have finished.
You couldn't make it up...
PUSB

NO Win No Fee I say

Chipfat · Apr 30, 2013

I think the most important case is the one in may, where is the GS?. This other case that may not even need answering its Sisu again trying to confuse and distract most away from the more important case, its called misdirection.. .

rupert_bear · Apr 30, 2013

wingy said:
NO Win No Fee I say

ccfcltd don't exist anymore do they ? They are in the hands of the administrator or so i thought. I get confused, i thought ccfc ltd and ccfc holdings were seperate, ltd having no assets or employees.

duffer · Apr 30, 2013

rupert_bear said:
Is the judicial review tomorrow ?

Hasn't got that far yet - first step is that a judge decides whether there's even a case to answer:

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2013/04/23/exclusive-sky-blues-take-council-to-high-court-92746-33218950/

I'm not sure when that first stage happens, but I think it's usually within weeks of the application. If it isn't chucked out at that stage by the judge, and does then proceed to a full case, it could take a good while longer - months, iirc.

rupert_bear · Apr 30, 2013

Chipfat said:
I think the most important case is the one in may, where is the GS?. This other case that may not even need answering its Sisu again trying to confuse and distract most away from the more important case, its called misdirection.. .

I think the next fortnight is critical to our football club. There will be rumours and counter rumours but i do believe there are things going on behind the scenes, there has to be, i just can't see either side just sitting back waiting for a judgement too much of a gamble.

cloughie · Apr 30, 2013

SkyblueBazza said:
Plus...if the loan is illegal, it might be feasible that CCFC Ltd could sue CCC/ACL for unfair practices...which led to them being put into administration - that could run to something like £40m perhaps...oh & then there are the damages for soiled reputation...& losing out in the hunt for promotion...could run to £100m by the time they have finished.
You couldn't make it up...
PUSB

What utter rubbish

cloughie · Apr 30, 2013

I am amazed at how many new posters on here on the 'inside track'

been quite alot recentlly

Co incindence or what?

dongonzalos · Apr 30, 2013

duffer said:
Erm... just to be clear, the Council haven't actually got to court yet. These papers (which are public record, so no great secrets to get sacked over) relate to an application for judicial review - only if that application is successful will there be a case to answer. Even then, what if it goes all of the way through, and SISU win the case - what then?

The remedy to resolve this 'injustice' would most likely to be that ACL have to obtain finance from elsewhere - that doesn't mean that SISU necessarily get to buy the debt. It also doesn't mean that the Council lose any money (other than in legal fees to defend the case).

And this doesn't directly influence the Administration issue either, other than perhaps muddying the water for prospective purchasers. There's nothing in this to stop the Higgs company from selling their 50% share to a new owner, at least as far as I can see. Happy to be corrected though...

Exactly.....

Hopefully if it comes to that ACL get their money from a loan from Haskell

SISU court papers analysis tomorrows Cov Telegraph (1 Viewer)

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