Serious question (1 Viewer)

[afan4life]

Does buying a new season ticket and handing over more money for Sisu to pocket (along with the money from the kids they keep selling) make you a true fan or complicit in the demise of this club?

It's a serious question so do not get out of shape and reply with abuse

 

[Nick]

No, it means you are coming on here to WUM quite clearly.

If it was a serious question you would be pointing out in the accounts where the money is being pocketed. If you wanted an actual debate and were being serious, you would have asked if any money is being "pocketed" surely? But you speak of it like it is fact.

Stick to the Telegraph Comments where you get more green thumbs the more outrageous and misinformed you are.

 

[afan4life]

No, it means you are coming on here to WUM quite clearly.

If it was a serious question you would be pointing out in the accounts where the money is being pocketed.

Stick to the Telegraph Comments where you get more green thumbs the more outrageous and misinformed you are.

You are clearly are very much in the sisu camp then? ....me,I'm just a fan who wants to watch my team

 

[Nick]

You are clearly are very much in the sisu camp then? ....me,I'm just a fan who wants to watch my team

How does that make me in the SISU camp? Because I questioned you on something that is made up?

Serious question..Have you seen where money is being pocketed from the fans and if so can you share it?

 

[afan4life]

No, it means you are coming on here to WUM quite clearly.

If it was a serious question you would be pointing out in the accounts where the money is being pocketed. If you wanted an actual debate and were being serious, you would have asked if any money is being "pocketed" surely? But you speak of it like it is fact.

Stick to the Telegraph Comments where you get more green thumbs the more outrageous and misinformed you are.

ps whats WUM ?

 

[Ashdown]

Why have they added huge management charges to the clubs accounts ???? Why ??

 

[armybike]

ps whats WUM ?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Whats+WUM

 

[afan4life]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Whats+WUM

thanks for that
no I'm not
why didn't he just use words...its not a text he's writing FFS

 

[Nick]

Why have they added huge management charges to the clubs accounts ???? Why ??

http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/losses-and-management-fees.28128/
http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/few-thoughts-and-other-stuff.44857/

There are no details in the published accounts of Otium paying management charges to anyone.

What did used to happen was that CCFC Ltd paid CCFC H management charges of around 2.6m. That was disclosed as income in CCFC H Ltd and formed part of administrative expenses in CCFC Ltd. When the Group accounts were put together the two amounts contra out to nil. The purpose of these management charges was to transfer costs from CCFC H and to attribute them to CCFC Ltd (eg the rent was shown in CCFC H but clearly the lease was held by CCFC Ltd)

No other disclosures have been made concerning management charges. If they had been paid to SISU then this should have been disclosed in the notes to accounts under related parties.

I like the one where PWKH was coming on to try and push the Management Charge stuff as well...

Going back through old threads Ashdown, it is mostly you banging on about Management Charges at every opportunity.

But yes, I am a SISU lover just for searching through to find the links explaining them for you.

 

[Nick]

thanks for that
no I'm not
why didn't he just use words...its not a text he's writing FFS

OK so if you are being genuine about things.

What have you seen to make you think money from season tickets is being pocketed? I guess you have seen all the player contracts where they don't get paid or something?

This is why stuff like that Juggy article is so dangerous, angry people get armed with mistruths.

 

[Otis]

You are clearly are very much in the sisu camp then? ....me,I'm just a fan who wants to watch my team

Well that's me too.

I don't want Sisu here, but I am a City supporter, so therefore go to watch my team.

I still can't see the knight in shining white armour over the hill, so it's either Sisu or nowt at all at the moment.

 

[armybike]

thanks for that
no I'm not
why didn't he just use words...its not a text he's writing FFS

Whats FFS ?

 

[stupot07]

Whats FFS ?

For f#@k sake

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[Nick]

For f#@k sake

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I think he was taking the piss....

 

[stupot07]

Well that's me too.

I don't want Sisu here, but I am a City supporter, so therefore go to watch my team.

I still can't see the knight in shining white armour over the hill, so it's either Sisu or nowt at all at the moment.

Ditto

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[stupot07]

I think he was taking the piss....

Ha ha

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[SkyBlueCRJ]

Does buying a new season ticket and handing over more money for Sisu to pocket (along with the money from the kids they keep selling) make you a true fan or complicit in the demise of this club?

It's a serious question so do not get out of shape and reply with abuse

It's actually difficult to reply with abuse because its a stupid comment but i'll bite the bullet and explain to you why it makes you a fan. Firstly, Season tickets contribute to the turnover that CCFC make each annum. Which accumulates to around £4 million a year. Lets say for sake of argument that with the early bird prices that we sell 7,000 season tickets this year. That generation of income of about will add up to about £2 million, which is half of our overall turnover. With a boycott of season ticket purchases, the club would suffer massively. We have a playing budget of around £2.5 million a season. This does not include things such as staff costs, running Ryton, rent payments or medical costs for the players - costs such as these cannot be ignored as they are sizeable when added up. Therefore to refer back to your comment, it makes you a true fan because you are the life and blood of keeping this football club through continuing to purchase a season ticket . Secondly, you are a fan of this football club, the club is going to be long here after SISU departs, that's all that should matter to a "true fan" as you were to put it. Thirdly, the club is apparently self sufficient, or close to being so. Do you honestly think there is that much profit to be put into "Sisu's pocket". The transfer fees of the mentioned players in the CET would have gone to running the club - note back to the costs that I previously mentioned. Not just being put on the pitch which clearly you think is the only cost of this football club. We are a player selling club, get over it. Everyone in League One is in the same boat. Football Clubs that are able to pay lucrative fees for young prospects are always going to get what they want, this is the age of modern football where money talks. Peterborough United stay in business through "selling kids", its an efficient way of sustaining a healthy football club unfortunately. It might scream 'no ambition' but its the way of the world, the gulf between the Premier League and the Football League is getting wider and wider. So accept it or constantly be bitter up to you but it seems that every single football club in this league accepts that talented players will move on if promotion isn't achieved apart from Coventry. Stop being so naive

 

[Ashdown]

http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/losses-and-management-fees.28128/
http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/few-thoughts-and-other-stuff.44857/



I like the one where PWKH was coming on to try and push the Management Charge stuff as well...

Going back through old threads Ashdown, it is mostly you banging on about Management Charges at every opportunity.

But yes, I am a SISU lover just for searching through to find the links explaining them for you.

The reason I bang on about it is because, people keep asking why SISU are still here ? My opinion is that:
1, If they sell or bail out they have admitted losses officially and alert so called investors.
2, They are launching court case after court case under pretence that it is 'the club' that is doing it, or at least that is how it appears in the media.
3, The accounts are grouped at some level and losses offset profit, hence using the losses created by the 'Admin charges' as a tax avoidance method. I haven't said they are either taking fees or interest in direct payments out of the club.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Well that's me too.

I don't want Sisu here, but I am a City supporter, so therefore go to watch my team.

I still can't see the knight in shining white armour over the hill, so it's either Sisu or nowt at all at the moment.

What I never get with these threads...

There's a perfecly reasonable argument to say the owners have made the whole experience so godawful, you don't want to hand over your cash.

There's a perfectly reasonable argument that giving money to people who wish (not do ) to make a profit out of a sporting club is a reason not to hand over cash blindly.

Fine. And tbh I guess I might well fit in those camps, as I find it hard to hand over cash to someone who's sole motive is profit.

If all football fans did similar, and cut their Sky packages first btw, as that'd stop much of the shark infested investments at a stroke, then we might revert to clubs rather than financial speculations.

However... it's beyond me to organise such a thing, it's not worth my energy to try and explain to people what long-term gaisn could possibly be had with the short-term pain so... all that happens is we split into camps. If it gives people pleasure to watch the club week-on-week then why the hell should I try and dissuade them?

I'm quite happy to accept that, at the moment, yourself, Nick... italia(!) are far more dedicated fans than me. Never really understood why that has to be a dick waving contest, who's the best fan. At the end of the day we're *all* fans after all, we just choose to show it in different ways.

 

[Nick]

The reason I bang on about it is because, people keep asking why SISU are still here ? My opinion is that:
1, If they sell or bail out they have admitted losses officially and alert so called investors.
2, They are launching court case after court case under pretence that it is 'the club' that is doing it, or at least that is how it appears in the media.
3, The accounts are grouped at some level and losses offset profit, hence using the losses created by the 'Admin charges' as a tax avoidance method. I haven't said they are either taking fees or interest in direct payments out of the club.

So you bang on about management charges but they have been explained a few times. It's explained in the links I just gave.

Nobody asked why they are still here, he said about pocketing the money, you jumped in with management fees.

When have they said in the media it's the club? If anything they have tried to make statements to separate it?

 

[Otis]

What I never get with these threads...

There's a perfecly reasonable argument to say the owners have made the whole experience so godawful, you don't want to hand over your cash.

There's a perfectly reasonable argument that giving money to people who wish (not do ) to make a profit out of a sporting club is a reason not to hand over cash blindly.

Fine. And tbh I guess I might well fit in those camps, as I find it hard to hand over cash to someone who's sole motive is profit.

If all football fans did similar, and cut their Sky packages first btw, as that'd stop much of the shark infested investments at a stroke, then we might revert to clubs rather than financial speculations.

However... it's beyond me to organise such a thing, it's not worth my energy to try and explain to people what long-term gaisn could possibly be had with the short-term pain so... all that happens is we split into camps. If it gives people pleasure to watch the club week-on-week then why the hell should I try and dissuade them?

I'm quite happy to accept that, at the moment, yourself, Nick... italia(!) are far more dedicated fans than me. Never really understood why that has to be a dick waving contest, who's the best fan.

Yeah, but are you just saying that because you have a small penis?

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Yeah, but are you just saying that because you have a small penis?

I can wave my dick without having to compare the size of my ground

 

[Otis]

Glad you said that because mine is the size of the Butts (without expansion)

 

[Super Graham Withey]

The reason I bang on about it is because, people keep asking why SISU are still here ? My opinion is that:
1, If they sell or bail out they have admitted losses officially and alert so called investors.
2, They are launching court case after court case under pretence that it is 'the club' that is doing it, or at least that is how it appears in the media.
3, The accounts are grouped at some level and losses offset profit, hence using the losses created by the 'Admin charges' as a tax avoidance method. I haven't said they are either taking fees or interest in direct payments out of the club.

Agree with much of this. Selling or bailing out crystallises SISU's loss on CCFC. While SISU can kept their investment in CCFC surrounded by legal actions it avoids the need for a write down. And chuck out a few stories such as the Butts from time to time to pass off as strategy/help get the rent down at The Ricoh.

 

[torchomatic]

Agree with much of this. Selling or bailing out crystallises SISU's loss on CCFC. While SISU can kept their investment in CCFC surrounded by legal actions it avoids the need for a write down. And chuck out a few stories such as the Butts from time to time to pass off as strategy/help get the rent down at The Ricoh.

But they didn't chuck the Butts story out. CRFC did.

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[Nick]

Agree with much of this. Selling or bailing out crystallises SISU's loss on CCFC. While SISU can kept their investment in CCFC surrounded by legal actions it avoids the need for a write down. And chuck out a few stories such as the Butts from time to time to pass off as strategy/help get the rent down at The Ricoh.

Avoids a write down of what?

 

[chiefdave]

Don't overthink it. If the club can be made self sustaining then SISU can stick around for the next 50 years if they want without it costing them a penny.

Even if its the slimmest chance in the world there could always be someone who will pay them £60m or a fluke promotion to the PL. Why leave if its not costing them money?

Chances are the losses have already been written down anyway.

 

[Brylowes]

But they didn't chuck the Butts story out. CRFC did.

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Do you not think SISU are the main driver behind this.

 

[afan4life]

It's actually difficult to reply with abuse because its a stupid comment but i'll bite the bullet and explain to you why it makes you a fan. Firstly, Season tickets contribute to the turnover that CCFC make each annum. Which accumulates to around £4 million a year. Lets say for sake of argument that with the early bird prices that we sell 7,000 season tickets this year. That generation of income of about will add up to about £2 million, which is half of our overall turnover. With a boycott of season ticket purchases, the club would suffer massively. We have a playing budget of around £2.5 million a season. This does not include things such as staff costs, running Ryton, rent payments or medical costs for the players - costs such as these cannot be ignored as they are sizeable when added up. Therefore to refer back to your comment, it makes you a true fan because you are the life and blood of keeping this football club through continuing to purchase a season ticket . Secondly, you are a fan of this football club, the club is going to be long here after SISU departs, that's all that should matter to a "true fan" as you were to put it. Thirdly, the club is apparently self sufficient, or close to being so. Do you honestly think there is that much profit to be put into "Sisu's pocket". The transfer fees of the mentioned players in the CET would have gone to running the club - note back to the costs that I previously mentioned. Not just being put on the pitch which clearly you think is the only cost of this football club. We are a player selling club, get over it. Everyone in League One is in the same boat. Football Clubs that are able to pay lucrative fees for young prospects are always going to get what they want, this is the age of modern football where money talks. Peterborough United stay in business through "selling kids", its an efficient way of sustaining a healthy football club unfortunately. It might scream 'no ambition' but its the way of the world, the gulf between the Premier League and the Football League is getting wider and wider. So accept it or constantly be bitter up to you but it seems that every single football club in this league accepts that talented players will move on if promotion isn't achieved apart from Coventry. Stop being so naive

totally agree with some of the above...disagree 'the club is going to be long here after SISU departs' I think they are killing MY club so it will not be here afterwards
Peterborough (and every other team) have their own Stadium* so running costs will be higher.we have a couple of big signs and a statue of Jimmy Hill ..who must be spinning in his urn
*including shops and catering outlets...

 

[skybluebeduff]

Do SISU make money whilst owning CCFC? Yes they do, they charge CCFC every year £1.37mill in interest charges, which before we were paying £2.6mill.

They are pond scum.

 

[Nick]

Do SISU make money whilst owning CCFC? Yes they do, they charge CCFC every year £1.37mill in interest charges, which before we were paying £2.6mill.

They are pond scum.

How much have they received

 

[skybluebeduff]

How much have they received

How much is being added to the made up debt pile of interests charges? who's eventually paying for it Nick?

 

[Nick]

How much is being added to the made up debt pile of interests charges? who's eventually paying for it Nick?

So they haven't actually made anything? They haven't taken any money or anything like that?

I very much doubt they will ever get that.

What is actually being pocketed?

 

[Brylowes]

So they haven't actually made anything? They haven't taken any money or anything like that?

I very much doubt they will ever get that.

What is actually being pocketed?

That dept acts as a wall around the club,and keeps any would be suitors out, so weather
they get it back or not, it serves a purpose for them.

 

[Nick]

That dept acts as a wall around the club,and keeps any would be suitors out, so weather
they get it back or not, it serves a purpose for them.

I haven't questioned that, I was asking about pocketing the money