Reflecting on SISU (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter jto123
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Ccfcisparks
Well-Known Member
Them and the council.
Anyone who is on positive terms with any of those councillors cannot consider themselves a Coventry fan
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
They definitely played a part too ... but I remember buying merchandise off a pasting table in the concourse at the ricoh .. we were being ran desperately
long way home
Well-Known Member
Too many individuals involved watching thousands suffer so they could feel important in pretending they cared....
Sounds familiar doesn't it..
Sounds familiar doesn't it..
Your last paragraph is spot on. I think we forget now looking back how bad the spiral felt at the time. I honesty couldn’t see how we’d get out of it and that the club would just continue going downward. Saturday really just proves that having a lack of ego was all that was needed.
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
Without trying to play ‘alternate history’, I think the club would’ve found itself back in L1 and pushing towards the Championship without Robins. By all accounts, Robins had a good relationship with the owners and that counts for something.
Where Robins and Viveash deserve their status as legends is that they expedited a process years ahead of schedule. Particularly, from the season we won the league in 19/20. Staying up in the league on a low budget and coming within a penalty shootout of the Premiership was a ridiculous achievement.
There’s no love lost for SISU from me, but they did play a part in supporting Robins et al in getting us back to the Championship. Despite the shite.
I think the presumption that we’d always get back to the championship is only ever said with hindsight. Remember just how bad it really was at the time. We only got out of league 2 through the play offs. There was never a guarantee the club would survive let alone get promoted with the mess it was in in 2016.
At the time SISU were the only show in town. They insisted on having 90% of the shares handed over to them. Craigavon (Geoffrey Robinson 31,871)and Sir Derek Higgs 8,021) only held 71% of the complete share holdings (55,788) and to that end Joe Elliott was tasked with rounding up all of the shares that were not in the hands of the large shareholders. SISU valued each share at £0.0001 and hence were going to pay a maximum of £5.57 for the club. At the time, the club had debts in excess of £38 million pounds. Sir Derek and Geoffrey Robinson agreed to write off any monies that the club owed them. SISU were stating they would invest 22 Million pounds in the club. The offer to take over the club was originally made on 13th December 2007. Joe Elliot wrote three letters to the shareholders asking that they hand in their shares by 7th January 2008. The last letter from Joe Elliott was dated 27th December 2007. In the letter he made it clear that the only alternative to SISU obtaining the minimum of 90% was administration. On the 3rd January an AGM was called and Mike Mcginity and I think Ray Ranson addressed all those who attended. Some time later the original demand to have the shares handed over was then extended to April 11th 2008 as 3,744 shares or (6.7%) was still outstanding. I believe the time line is correct but the letter from Ransom asking for the remaining shares to be handed over is not dated.
For info, Mike Mcginity only ever owned 100 shares, Mr Elliott is shown as having 10.
For what it’s worth, I firmly believe that if Sir Derek had not died in April 2008 non of the crap with CC or the Charity would have kicked off. Sir Derek was instrumental in the Charity purchasing the clubs 50% share in the arena (when the club did not have the cash to continue with the project) and for the club having the first option buy back clause inserted in the agreement which lasted for five years from the date of purchase by the charity. The hope was, within the five years the club would be in a position to purchase the 50% back from the charity albeit at an increased cost. When SISU had the opportunity they choose not to action the clause. Ransom said to me they did not feel at that time it was necessary. The council and the charity both had options in the agreement that they could veto the sale of the charities 50% if they did not approve of the proposed purchaser. By the time SISU woke up, the relationship with both the charity and the council had turned toxic and the rest is history
For info, Mike Mcginity only ever owned 100 shares, Mr Elliott is shown as having 10.
For what it’s worth, I firmly believe that if Sir Derek had not died in April 2008 non of the crap with CC or the Charity would have kicked off. Sir Derek was instrumental in the Charity purchasing the clubs 50% share in the arena (when the club did not have the cash to continue with the project) and for the club having the first option buy back clause inserted in the agreement which lasted for five years from the date of purchase by the charity. The hope was, within the five years the club would be in a position to purchase the 50% back from the charity albeit at an increased cost. When SISU had the opportunity they choose not to action the clause. Ransom said to me they did not feel at that time it was necessary. The council and the charity both had options in the agreement that they could veto the sale of the charities 50% if they did not approve of the proposed purchaser. By the time SISU woke up, the relationship with both the charity and the council had turned toxic and the rest is history
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Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
It was bad and hindsight can be 20:20. I don’t think Robins was the lisan al gaib (Dune reference) and the only person who could’ve led us back up the leagues. But, appointing Robins was about the best decision could’ve made in that moment and meant that relegation to L2 was moment to ‘reset to default factory settings’ for the club.
That was the difference between managing relegation to L2 v L1. We backed Thorn and Robins back in 2012/13 but keep Thorn was a terrible decision and things began to fall apart after Robins left for Huddersfield and we left for Northampton.
Anyway, no point dwelling on arguably the most miserable period in our club’s history when we’ve got potentially our most exciting period to come!
Evo1883
Well-Known Member
I think had we missed out on promotion in the first league 2 season , it could have been very different for us , as it was Notts county
Agreed, let’s look forward not backwards (mainly because I don’t understand the Dune reference!).
clint van damme
Well-Known Member
I think the outcome could have been even worse for us
bigfatronssba
Well-Known Member
Sisu thought they could win a PR campaign against the council
They did this AFTER spending several years proving themselves to be unfit and unproper owners of the club.
If you're going to launch a PR campaign against an elected body, don't first spend several years pissing off the only people who can remove said elected body
They did this AFTER spending several years proving themselves to be unfit and unproper owners of the club.
If you're going to launch a PR campaign against an elected body, don't first spend several years pissing off the only people who can remove said elected body
bigfatronssba
Well-Known Member
No they were completely wrong to do that, as legally they didn't have a leg to stand on.
Challenging the sale to Wasps was a moral one, not a legal one.
Gynnsthetonic
Well-Known Member
It almost feels like a blessing in disguise. If We didn't go through all that shit we would never have appreciated how far we have come and what we have now. Those Wembley appearances and promotions have given us a new generation of fans
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
It just means messiah tbf! I was just being silly!
This is a really interesting point and something I have often thought. I’m not saying it’s good we had to go through what we went through and that we have gained from it, but my as fan base it has made us really strong and has demonstrated what a truly great club we are.
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
Our team was in a v different place to Notts County’s and personally, never understood the idea that we could’ve went the way of Notts County had we lost in the playoffs.
I was quite happy with our team back then, we’d have lost McNulty, Willis and Bayliss but with the funds it wasn’t game over. After all, we had Robins and Viveash still.
It’s academic and either way, we didn’t need to find out because we won the playoffs and the rest is history.
bigfatronssba
Well-Known Member
One thing we can say with certainly, is Mike Ashley & Frasers turned out to be the best landlords we ever had at the Arena!
Gynnsthetonic
Well-Known Member
Yes i feel exactly this
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
Strange but true.
Adge
Well-Known Member
And then preceded to place it in administration wasn’t it twice after?
Without his paying bills to get his foot in the door with the administrators, we'd have possibly been looking for yet another "home" to fulfil fixtures for at least part of that season.
Skybluecol
Well-Known Member
They'll be advertising for a "creative" accountant in the next few weeks
COVKIDSNEVERQUIT
Well-Known Member
COVKIDSNEVERQUIT
Well-Known Member
Mucca Mad Boys
Well-Known Member
I don’t know. My worry at the time is that we were so desperate to get rid of SISU we were willing to buy anyone’s bullshit. There’s plenty of bad actors as football owners and we could’ve went from one lot to another that were just as bad.
Going through the archives, we’d see many people positive towards Hoffman’s supposed backers who turned out to be fraudsters themselves.
I’m certainly not here to defend their record, the issues all stemmed back to the ground, rental agreement and lack of a pathway to ownership. With hindsight, we see just how vindictive and underhanded the council was towards the football club so what choice did the ownership have?
Anyway, everything lead to today so all the pain and uncertainty was worth it in the end. For all his flaws, King seems like a decent egg.
Liquid Gold
Well-Known Member
Sisu’s stewardship can be broken down to different eras with very differing objectives. One thing that was so frustrating with them and their communication was that you had no idea things had shifted.
Era 1 - Ranson
Sisu didn’t ever want to be involved in football club ownership. They were sold a dream by Ransom of them fronting the money, him masterminding a promotion. They agreed at a fixed figure and that was burned through having Coleman as manager. Ranson came back when he had exhausted the funds and Sisu said no causing RR to throw his toys out the pram and quit the project.
Era 2 - Clown Car Cost Cutting
Sisu are now lumbered with running a business they never wanted direct control of and have no experience of. Their own men (orange Ken etc.) take control and in an attempt to learn more about the football business they make some egregious errors souring everyone to them. They ended up giving into their instincts anyway and going straight for cost cutting. This resulted in us losing key players for nothing and not being able to replace them. To nobody’s surprise we got relegated which further depreciated their asset.
Era 3 - Stadium Dispute
But of overlap with the last era but this is where joy started to see the millions that they’d put in disappear into nothing. They starting thinking about an exit strategy and decided that buying the stadium and selling it along with the club as a package would be the best way to get a ROI. The team wasn’t considered at all and we had to play out of the city as court cases were more important. Anything of value was sold as soon as possible.
Era 4 - Silo
Ironically the best period of ownership where they just isolated the club and let the people there run it, only providing minimal funding to keep the club afloat. Boddy & Robins with complete freedom to do as they pleased built a reasonably functional football club.
You could put together something from the council too. They were equally as culpable for our lost decade.
Era 1 - Ranson
Sisu didn’t ever want to be involved in football club ownership. They were sold a dream by Ransom of them fronting the money, him masterminding a promotion. They agreed at a fixed figure and that was burned through having Coleman as manager. Ranson came back when he had exhausted the funds and Sisu said no causing RR to throw his toys out the pram and quit the project.
Era 2 - Clown Car Cost Cutting
Sisu are now lumbered with running a business they never wanted direct control of and have no experience of. Their own men (orange Ken etc.) take control and in an attempt to learn more about the football business they make some egregious errors souring everyone to them. They ended up giving into their instincts anyway and going straight for cost cutting. This resulted in us losing key players for nothing and not being able to replace them. To nobody’s surprise we got relegated which further depreciated their asset.
Era 3 - Stadium Dispute
But of overlap with the last era but this is where joy started to see the millions that they’d put in disappear into nothing. They starting thinking about an exit strategy and decided that buying the stadium and selling it along with the club as a package would be the best way to get a ROI. The team wasn’t considered at all and we had to play out of the city as court cases were more important. Anything of value was sold as soon as possible.
Era 4 - Silo
Ironically the best period of ownership where they just isolated the club and let the people there run it, only providing minimal funding to keep the club afloat. Boddy & Robins with complete freedom to do as they pleased built a reasonably functional football club.
You could put together something from the council too. They were equally as culpable for our lost decade.
BackRoomRummermill
Well-Known Member
When I reflect on SISU all I see is a massive turd
robbiethemole
Well-Known Member
I thought he was more Muad’Dib myselfIt just means messiah tbf! I was just being silly!
Weird to think we were panicking about going into admin after seeing how it’s helped other clubs, lots thought it was liquidation given how Elliott and Robinson were going on. How would we have fared by going in and out of admin before SISU?
ovduk78
Well-Known Member
I think @Grendel said last week that Richardson considered administration, not sure who or what convinced him otherwise. It depends who took over afterwards & whether it cleared our debts and of course there was no points deduction at that time.I thought he was more Muad’Dib myself
Weird to think we were panicking about going into admin after seeing how it’s helped other clubs, lots thought it was liquidation given how Elliott and Robinson were going on. How would we have fared by going in and out of admin before SISU?
Stafford_SkBlue
Well-Known Member
After 10 years of ownership, Joy understood what was needed, after some very bad advice early on in their ownership.
What people overlook is that they laid the foundation to the current team, they signed Gyokeres and Hamer whose fees received underpins the current team. They were the owners for half the season when we reached the play off final, their latter part of their stewardship where they tried to balance the books put us on a good foundation that has helped us in the current ownership, as era 4 in Liquid Gold above.
What people overlook is that they laid the foundation to the current team, they signed Gyokeres and Hamer whose fees received underpins the current team. They were the owners for half the season when we reached the play off final, their latter part of their stewardship where they tried to balance the books put us on a good foundation that has helped us in the current ownership, as era 4 in Liquid Gold above.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
A certain politician and his hapless big nosed puppet were not too keen. They booted him out.
ovduk78
Well-Known Member
Was that when we were in the PL or D1? I can't remember when Richardson left
Edit: just checked and he left in January 2002.
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