Midlands Today Last Night (8 Viewers)

Jack Griffin · Jan 17, 2013

BackRoomRummermill said:
Is this 'guesswork' or 'spin' or fact ?

If its the latter then offer some evidance, like you know the future order contract book.

Finance information is taken directly from the council leaders public statements Mr uninformed person.

The rail station is happening.
http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/ne...-ricoh-arena-set-for-approval-92746-31424216/

There are plans for hotels where one carpark is, can't really be sure if this is happening yet.
http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/ne...ed-for-coventry-s-ricoh-arena-92746-27048969/

Oh yes, the area development continues.. you don't think the scrappy thing on the other side of the Area access road is part of long term development plans do you?

BackRoomRummermill · Jan 17, 2013

Jack Griffin said:
Finance information is taken directly from the council leaders public statements Mr uninformed person.

The rail station is happening.

There are plans for hotels where one carpark is, can't really be sure if this is happening yet, but came across planning application a while back.

Oh yes, the area development continues.. you don't think the scrappy thing on the other side of the Arean access road is part of long term development plans do you?[/QUOTE

I say once again and in paticular to you Mr 'informed person' where is the evidance of the future non ccfc order book apart from the website ?

Where is the market data ?

Where is the finance?

You are informed then inform me

?????????????????

Jack Griffin · Jan 17, 2013

OSB did some figures above. My view about ACL/CCFC was posted on a previous page of this thread.

Go and find out what has been said before or work something out for yourself instead of being negative, can you prove the opposite?

BackRoomRummermill · Jan 17, 2013

I give up LOL

torchomatic · Jan 17, 2013

Damn! No Plumbing Spectacular this year? I we'll just have to look forward to the Plumbing And Drains Megathon '14 next year.

To be fair though I think they'll be a good crowd for Psychic Sally. 500+

BackRoomRummermill said:
Check out there massive order book on the website for the next 6 months

http://www.ricoharena.com/entertainment/entertainment-events/

That including sprinstien wont even cover overheads hmmmmmmmmmmmmm . Fair enough every week with a Take that or Bruce or Bryan Adams but I see they have mystic meg filling in , maybe this will help

Again I am dealing with facts here , so over to the forum ACL reps ...............

Sorry forgot the midland carp fishing spectacular , not to be missed apparently

torchomatic · Jan 17, 2013

But have you ever rented out a stadium? Have you found all the teams Dongo says are waiting in the wings to jump into the Arena with their legion of fans. I don't know why you and others constantly try and compare a multi-million pound stadium with renting a house. Apples and pears.

Astute said:
Miss us like a fookin hole in the head you mean?

Have you ever rented out any properties? I have. Having someone not paying rent is nothing but hassle and costs you money. Get rid of them and you lose less money.

Grendel · Jan 17, 2013

Jack Griffin said:
OSB did some figures above. My view about ACL/CCFC was posted on a previous page of this thread.

Go and find out what has been said before or work something out for yourself instead of being negative, can you prove the opposite?

In other words as manuel in Fawlty Towers once said "I know notheeng"

Brighton Sky Blue · Jan 17, 2013

Grendel said:
In other words as manuel in Fawlty Towers once said "I know notheeng"

Our last manager used to say that quite a bit too.

Black6Osprey · Jan 17, 2013

The most telling comment from the council in all this was that the council insists the Ricoh project could still become a money-spinner for taxpayers, with the "leisure land" around the stadium long earmarked for a hotel and leisure complex - to add to the stadium's hotel, concert and conference events.

The council have a very look at the nasty SISU attitude about this whole situation but they are in it for the future cash this site gives them and nothing else.

As far the Ricoh surviving with CCFC, it might but I dont believe it would be a huge success. The exhibition facilities are very poor compared to the NEC unless you're having a bake sale maybe and this idea of more concerts is a bit of a red herring. The NEC has many more concerts per year then the Ricoh ever could and yet its the exhibitions they hold which run nearly every day of the year which generates the most income. The Ricoh will never compete in this market and will remain small time.

BackRoomRummermill · Jan 17, 2013

OLDSKYBLUE 58

Can you be my accountant

You forgot to mention TAX !

Corporation Tax ratesRates for financial years starting on 1 April Rate2010201120122013Small profits rate*21%* 20%*20%*Small profits rate can be claimed by qualifying companies with profits at a rate not exceeding£300,000£300,000£300,000Marginal Relief Lower Limit£300,000£300,000£300,000Marginal Relief Upper Limit£1,500,000£1,500,000£1,500,000Standard fraction7/4003/2001/100Main rate of Corporation Tax*28%*26%*24%*23%*Special rate for unit trusts and open-ended investment companies 20%20%20%
Main rate of Corporation Tax

The main rate of Corporation Tax applies when profits (including ring fence profits) are at a rate exceeding £1,500,000, or where there is no claim to another rate, or where another rate does not apply.
Ring fence companies

*For companies with ring fence profits (income and gains from oil extraction activities or oil rights in the UK and UK Continental Shelf) these rates differ. The small profits rate of tax on those profits is 19 per cent and the ring fence fraction is 11/400 for financial years starting 1 April 2010, 2011 and 2012. The main rate is 30 per cent for financial years starting on 1 April 2010, 2011 and 2012
Corporation Tax on chargeable gains

Indexation Allowance allows for the effects of inflation when calculating the chargeable gains of companies or organisations.

Based on your figures you have confirmed they are themselved needing bailing out as your 36K profit will get wiped out ( hence the council money)

BackRoomRummermill · Jan 17, 2013

Black6Osprey said:
The most telling comment from the council in all this was that the council insists the Ricoh project could still become a money-spinner for taxpayers, with the "leisure land" around the stadium long earmarked for a hotel and leisure complex - to add to the stadium's hotel, concert and conference events.

The council have a very look at the nasty SISU attitude about this whole situation but they are in it for the future cash this site gives them and nothing else.

As far the Ricoh surviving with CCFC, it might but I dont believe it would be a huge success. The exhibition facilities are very poor compared to the NEC unless you're having a bake sale maybe and this idea of more concerts is a bit of a red herring. The NEC has many more concerts per year then the Ricoh ever could and yet its the exhibitions they hold which run nearly every day of the year which generates the most income. The Ricoh will never compete in this market and will remain small time.

Anyway who would come ? What is the big attraction of Cov ? You can build 20 hotels but with no one in them it will soon run into rack and ruin. What a stupid idea bourne from a civil servant who has no buissness sense!!

This is not the climate for piddling around with council tax payers money !

cloughie · Jan 17, 2013

covcity4life said:
council fookin the club up

At times you do appear to be totally thick

cloughie · Jan 17, 2013

torchomatic said:
I guess because having a professional football club brings a lot of money into the local economy; jobs, opposition fans, fans (like me) who would never be seen dead in Coventry otherwise, the wealthy footballers spending their cash....

the wealthy footballers spending their cash, you are having a laugh yer right don't think Coventry is good enough for some up market people, quote...(like me) who would never be seen dead in Coventry

Brighton Sky Blue · Jan 17, 2013

cloughie said:
the wealthy footballers spending their cash, you are having a laugh yer right don't think Coventry is good enough for some up market people, quote...(like me) who would never be seen dead in Coventry

I forgot that Warwick was so splendid.

cloughie · Jan 17, 2013

torchomatic said:
Which reminds me. I need to pop out and buy him some fruit gums.

Him.....................hmmmmmmmmmm

cloughie · Jan 17, 2013

Brighton Sky Blue said:
I forgot that Warwick was so splendid.

obviously wouldn't want to get any warwick boots dirty by setting foot in Coventry

cloughie · Jan 17, 2013

BackRoomRummermill said:
Check out there massive order book on the website for the next 6 months

http://www.ricoharena.com/entertainment/entertainment-events/

That including sprinstien wont even cover overheads hmmmmmmmmmmmmm . Fair enough every week with a Take that or Bruce or Bryan Adams but I see they have mystic meg filling in , maybe this will help

Again I am dealing with facts here , so over to the forum ACL reps ...............

Sorry forgot the midland carp fishing spectacular , not to be missed apparently

Shame you can't drive by the Ricoh every day and see the events that don't need to be advertised , but hey ho you probably wouldn't set foot in Coventry along with others from closer to home

Mucca Mad Boys · Jan 17, 2013

Astute said:
But this is not the fault of the Council.

I never said that, I only made the post you quoted because people are underestimating the impact of the money the 10,000+ people that go to CCFC games have on the surrounding area.

I would know, I work in a store that is in the surrounding area. My managers (a Spurs and Man U fans) wanted CCFC to goon a good cup run and get a top 4 team at home and they were 'fantasising' about the amount of profit the store would make because of an increase in customers.

torchomatic · Jan 17, 2013

Absolutely.

cloughie said:
obviously wouldn't want to get any warwick boots dirty by setting foot in Coventry

torchomatic · Jan 17, 2013

So how does that work then? Thinking about it, I don't suppose Psychic Sally needs advertising as she can just beam the dates of her tour into people's minds.

Obviously, I was being facetious: I go to Ikea every now and then. Oh, and I went to Neros just after Christmas but was worried about getting attacked and robbed by the citizens of Coventry.

cloughie said:
Shame you can't drive by the Ricoh every day and see the events that don't need to be advertised , but hey ho you probably wouldn't set foot in Coventry along with others from closer to home

Brighton Sky Blue · Jan 17, 2013

torchomatic said:
So how does that work then? Thinking about it, I don't suppose Psychic Sally needs advertising as she can just beam the dates of her tour into people's minds.

Obviously, I was being facetious: I go to Ikea every now and then. Oh, and I went to Neros just after Christmas but was worried about getting attacked and robbed by the citizens of Coventry.

After my spell down south the prospect of going anywhere north of Guildford had me trembling.

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Jan 17, 2013

BackRoomRummermill said:
Based on your figures you have confirmed they are themselved needing bailing out as your 36K profit will get wiped out ( hence the council money)

Oh dear...

cloughie · Jan 17, 2013

torchomatic said:
So how does that work then? Thinking about it, I don't suppose Psychic Sally needs advertising as she can just beam the dates of her tour into people's minds.

Obviously, I was being facetious: I go to Ikea every now and then. Oh, and I went to Neros just after Christmas but was worried about getting attacked and robbed by the citizens of Coventry.

As for psyhic sally that was cancelled due to unforeseen events

Yet your second sentence is not only ridiculous but quite insulting and sadly says more about you as the type of person you are

torchomatic · Jan 17, 2013

True. One that likes to have a joke. But there you go. I should have made it more clear obviously.

You found my sentence "insulting" but not when someone said SISU were "raping" the City. You "liked" that one.

cloughie said:
Yet your second sentence is not only ridiculous but quite insulting and sadly says more about you as the type of person you are

Grendel · Jan 17, 2013

torchomatic said:
True. One that likes to have a joke. But there you go. I should have made it more clear obviously.

You found my sentence "insulting" but not when someone said SISU were "raping" the City. You "liked" that one.

Not insulted by the subsequent post showing the definition of rape either I seem to recall.

Grendel · Jan 17, 2013

cloughie said:
As for psyhic sally that was cancelled due to unforeseen events

Yet your second sentence is not only ridiculous but quite insulting and sadly says more about you as the type of person you are

Surely Sally should have foreseen the events that led to the cancelation.

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Jan 18, 2013

BackRoomRummermill said:
OLDSKYBLUE 58

Can you be my accountant

You forgot to mention TAX !

Corporation Tax ratesRates for financial years starting on 1 April Rate2010201120122013Small profits rate*21%* 20%*20%*Small profits rate can be claimed by qualifying companies with profits at a rate not exceeding£300,000£300,000£300,000Marginal Relief Lower Limit£300,000£300,000£300,000Marginal Relief Upper Limit£1,500,000£1,500,000£1,500,000Standard fraction7/4003/2001/100Main rate of Corporation Tax*28%*26%*24%*23%*Special rate for unit trusts and open-ended investment companies 20%20%20%
Main rate of Corporation Tax

The main rate of Corporation Tax applies when profits (including ring fence profits) are at a rate exceeding £1,500,000, or where there is no claim to another rate, or where another rate does not apply.
Ring fence companies

*For companies with ring fence profits (income and gains from oil extraction activities or oil rights in the UK and UK Continental Shelf) these rates differ. The small profits rate of tax on those profits is 19 per cent and the ring fence fraction is 11/400 for financial years starting 1 April 2010, 2011 and 2012. The main rate is 30 per cent for financial years starting on 1 April 2010, 2011 and 2012
Corporation Tax on chargeable gains

Indexation Allowance allows for the effects of inflation when calculating the chargeable gains of companies or organisations.

Based on your figures you have confirmed they are themselved needing bailing out as your 36K profit will get wiped out ( hence the council money)

Corporation Tax falls due on declared profit. As such, according to OSB58's analysis, a sum on the nominal £36K would be payable. I'm sure even this would be mitigated by a decent 'true and fair' accountant; but even not, it's small beer.

It appears you may have got corporation tax due on profit mixed up with turnover. Please tell me that's not the case, as such ignorance is as embarrassing for me as it must be for you...

oldskyblue58 · Jan 18, 2013

BackRoomRummermill said:
OLDSKYBLUE 58

Can you be my accountant

You forgot to mention TAX !

Corporation Tax ratesRates for financial years starting on 1 April Rate2010201120122013Small profits rate*21%* 20%*20%*Small profits rate can be claimed by qualifying companies with profits at a rate not exceeding£300,000£300,000£300,000Marginal Relief Lower Limit£300,000£300,000£300,000Marginal Relief Upper Limit£1,500,000£1,500,000£1,500,000Standard fraction7/4003/2001/100Main rate of Corporation Tax*28%*26%*24%*23%*Special rate for unit trusts and open-ended investment companies 20%20%20%
Main rate of Corporation Tax

The main rate of Corporation Tax applies when profits (including ring fence profits) are at a rate exceeding £1,500,000, or where there is no claim to another rate, or where another rate does not apply.
Ring fence companies

*For companies with ring fence profits (income and gains from oil extraction activities or oil rights in the UK and UK Continental Shelf) these rates differ. The small profits rate of tax on those profits is 19 per cent and the ring fence fraction is 11/400 for financial years starting 1 April 2010, 2011 and 2012. The main rate is 30 per cent for financial years starting on 1 April 2010, 2011 and 2012
Corporation Tax on chargeable gains

Indexation Allowance allows for the effects of inflation when calculating the chargeable gains of companies or organisations.

Based on your figures you have confirmed they are themselved needing bailing out as your 36K profit will get wiped out ( hence the council money)

try sticking to things you actually know about ............. both CCFC and ACL have accumulated losses brought forward generated by actual revenue losses and capital allowances that mean neither will be paying corporation tax for the foreseeable future.

Aside from which the tax on £36k is £7200 tops Which if tax were at all due (it isnt) would still leave net profits after tax of 28800

next question ?

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Jan 18, 2013

oldskyblue58 said:
try sticking to things you actually know about .............

Wise words, but a policy that might limit the topics upon which this genius can proffer his unique wisdom...

BackRoomRummermill · Jan 18, 2013

oldskyblue58 said:
try sticking to things you actually know about ............. both CCFC and ACL have accumulated losses brought forward generated by actual revenue losses and capital allowances that mean neither will be paying corporation tax for the foreseeable future.

Aside from which the tax on £36k is £7200 tops

next question ?

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Thank you your last sentence actually agreed with what i said it would wipe out the 36K

So you have indeed agreed with me on in pratice on what I have said. they will pay Corperation Tax , you have just said it expert.

Dont try top back pedal now, also I totally disregard anything MMM has to say anyway after the AT fiasco and how he slated a few including me for saying how crap AT was.

Ok no one on here has shown or demonstrated to me in this current Market where without CCFC playing at the RICOH can sustain in its present state. There will be no big name concerts every week up for grabs, if you think there are then you are deluded.

Also going back to the accounts (which are nearly 2 years out of date come this April) no one has or indeed has the access to the current accounts and if they did they would not post them on here anyway as it would show how week ACL position are at the moment.

So someone provide a sensible order book confirmed and only then. will and anybody with any sense be able to make sweeping statements on the future of Arena Coventry Ltd without CCFC.

If CCFC left the RICOH then within 3 years the stadium er sorry venue will be a fiasco, Council Tax money wasted on a huge cash cow. I can see it on Midlands today already the scandal

The acid test is as you experts sould know is that as you are so sure if the RICOH can survive without CCFC ......... why have they not taken proper legal action and offloaded the burden of CCFC?

Made up answers please on a Post card to the Bahrain ( MMM we used to use these when I was growing up if your wondering what they are)

In truth none of you know and are getting snippets from the internet and filling it in with old irrelevant data.

Dont forget to go to the Midland Carp show folks :facepalm:

torchomatic · Jan 18, 2013

A profit of £28K!? :facepalm:

oldskyblue58 said:
Aside from which the tax on £36k is £7200 tops Which if tax were at all due (it isnt) would still leave net profits after tax of 28800

Wrenstreetcarpark · Jan 18, 2013

BRR. You must have taken lessons in honesty from Fisher, Clarke and Seppala

you take out the bit in OSB's post which shows just how ignorant you are and then say he has proved you right. Pathetic and dishonest.

torchomatic · Jan 18, 2013

Actually, BRM, I think you'll find it's a Spectacular not just a show...

BackRoomRummermill said:
Dont forget to go to the Midland Carp show folks :facepalm:

oldskyblue58 · Jan 18, 2013

errr read it again amateur

"both CCFC and ACL have accumulated losses brought forward generated by actual revenue losses and capital allowances that mean neither will be paying corporation tax for the foreseeable future."

no back pedalling at all :facepalm:

also tax on £36K is £7200 tops so that still leaves £28800 net profit after tax - still a profit so not wiped out at all - is simple maths a problem for you?

You are presenting as facts your opinion ....... it is only opinion.......... then slating everyone else for not presenting facts. You dont know it will fail only think it will........ well some of us think differently

So the accounts cant be posted but the order book should be :facepalm: you dont think that such information like that would be commercially sensitive perhaps? I assume you know that so also assume that to maintain your argument knowing it cant be challenged on that information that is why you repeatedly stick to saying thats the only info worth a bean. You wanted facts well the accounts are the only facts available but because they do not meet your argument you dismiss them. Your choice. Personally I dont think you have proven your case - merely spouted an opinion with no actual facts pertaining to the Ricoh or ACL

None of us know ...... perhaps ............ but then why do you think you do because you are getting your "information" from the same place we all are.

Wrenstreetcarpark · Jan 18, 2013

I love it when Grendel, Torch, Taylor and BRR make up something and then have an argument with anyone who shows them its wrong. They create an aunt sally which tales people's attention and energy away from the central issue. All they want to do is deflect any reasoned argument away from the simple truths which are that Seppala and Fisher need to get real and do what they said they wanted to do which is to work out some kind of deal with ACL that will allow everyone to get on with supporting a football team that is Coventry City Football Club and not the Mayfair Kerbcrawlers United.

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